Only really seeing the Burnley at home game as a win. And there will be massive pressure on us to win that. I can see every other team overwhelming us. This squad from front to back is not suited to premier league football

Only 3 teams in the league muster fewer shots than us. I can’t recall which teams but it means one of Fulham, West Brom, Burnley or sheff Utd is better.

I think he has lost some of the players already and in particular Aubameyang. The inconsistency of his decisions do not sit comfortably with me. He has favourites and that creates divisions.

If we sacked Arteta would this group of players take us where we want to be? Could they even take us in to the European positions? Or are this group of players playing pretty much where their abilities are at the moment?

The easy step is to always sack the manager but this group haven’t performed for the last 3 managers, 4 if you include Ljungberg. I think that is the most depressing part about it, there are far too many players that really are at the limit of their ability. I just don’t see any manager being able to improve certain individuals in this squad.
The club needs some sort of stability at the moment so we need to stick with Arteta and give him the funds to reshape this squad. We need to start shopping smartly in the sub £20m range and only for young players with hunger, athleticism, pace and power.

Aubameyang is looking thoroughly pee'd off. I read in the first half yesterday he only touched the ball 7 times and 2 of those were kick offs.
Most of our on field problems stem from midfield, it is an absolute horror show in there. But we've also failed to develop a team to play to each players strengths. It seems we're stuck trying to mask weaknesses. Aubameyang thrives on quick ball and small spaces in the box, but we don't get in to him quickly enough or fire crosses at his head. Tierney is a decent crosser of the ball but we don't have a centre forward to head it, or any midfield runners. Xhaka and Luiz can both play accurate long passes but they are either playing them from so deep, not playing them or not having any willing runners.
Arsenal's entire team attempted 2 dribbles last night, Wolves had 3 players who individually attempted 3 each

AMN one is strange now. He formed an important part of a system that to some extent worked last year and it seems Arteta convinced him to stay. Now it seems we just didn't want to lose a swiss army knife player but don't have a plan for how to use him. Right now he couldn't do any worse so deserves some time.
Saliba, some people who have watched him for the U23's have said they can see why Arteta is reluctant to throw him in, he is still raw and takes risks.
Ceballos is an odd one, seems to spend most of his time in a deep right back position. Pointless. Xhaka is the same, dropping deeper to get some time on the ball because he cant work under the tighter pressure in midfield. Both just sit on top of our defence making any transition to the forwards impossible. It is why Partey was such a breath of fresh air.
I agree Nelson deserves more game time, at least he's willing to run at opponents instead of constantly passing it backwards. If we continue with 4-3-3 then at least try Willian in the hole behind the striker, it has never been Willock's best position.

God knows what team to pick v Spurs but it feels like we need to go back to the 3-4-3 or even 3-5-2, cut any space for them to run in to behind as they will kill us on the counter attack. With a back 3 you can afford one of those defenders to go man to man with Kane and follow him even when he drops deep. Use Bellerin and AMN in the wing back positions as the out-ball and with pace to counter attack. Picking two from Elneny, Ceballos, Xhaka, Willock in central midfield fills me with no joy and this is where we'll likely lose the game. It wouldn't be so bad if you just instructed the midfield to sit and be disciplined and play longer balls in to space for a front 3 to score and create their own chances but we don't have that.
My only hope is Mourinho is naturally cagey so will probably be happy to keep things tight and nick it. Which is what he did last year.

I will be pleasantly surprised if we get away with anything other than a good hiding at the the hands of Tottenham next weekend. We are as poor as we’ve ever been.

I like Arteta, I like the way he speaks, I like his connection with the club, I like how he presents himself. But I also think it’s safe to say he is having an absolute mare when it comes to our PL form. He is under real pressure.

Shame that Partey will miss a fair few games but we have to use what we have. I’d give Nelson a run of games. He can’t be any less effective than Willian.

We’re a mess and its not changing anytime soon.

I think you are right. Arteta has lost some of his players.

There are rumblings that some of the dressing room are not happy with the way he has ostracised some players, the way he has dealt with certain situations. It looks like we will end up selling Guendouzi for peanuts when a season ago we probably could have got £35m for him.

Personally, since day one I have had some misgivings about his team selections, his tactics and his substitutions despite an FA cup win and a few great results against the big boys.

I feel that what we are seeing from Arteta is more David Moyes Everton than Pep Guardiola Man City.

Clearly he has not been given a great hand to work with in terms of the squad but its not the worst set of players either.

Are these the same players that downed tools for Emery, couldn't give Freddie any kind of new manager bounce and also downed tools for Wenger?

I find it hard to believe the players have lost any faith in what Arteta is doing after so many of them have specifically praised him last year as a breath of fresh air and loved his methods. The whole club is struggling, players and manager. There is a massive lack of confidence in the team, as has been the way over the last 5 or so years, we can build our confidence up but any set back knocks the entire team back to square 1 and facing starting again.
If we got 1-0 up and Arteta just said sit on this and defend for your lives and win 1-0 I'd still have more confidence in this side to do it than any Arsenal team in the last 10 years and that is mostly down to Arteta. He is definitely struggling and looks like he's just trying anything right now to scrap any kind of result but it just isn't working.

The last transfer market was a huge problem, we have a bloated squad. If we wanted Partey and Gabriel we had to leave two senior players out of the squad altogether. When results don't go well there will be huge numbers wanting Özil back (maybe not so many for Sokratis) but Özil was a massive part of the problem, he simply was not solving our creativity problems before, the stats showed his lack of influence on games. In a perfect world he'd have done what Sanchez did and take a hit in order to go and play football somewhere but he didn't - not his fault of course.
Guendouzi was possibly the sacrificial lamb of Arteta getting across his non negotiables. A new boss showing he isn't messing around if you break the rules. If we kept Guendouzi that is another player from this bloated squad who couldn't be registerred this season. Torreira also.
The squad needed wiping clean, at least 12-15 of them. We're almost in a situation where we need to wait for each of them to run their contract down in order to get rid because we're struggling to get rid of players on free transfers because their wages are so high. That is certainly not Arteta's fault.

I’m reading some hysterical bollocks on here

Do you think Arteta whispers in ceballos ear in the changing room before each game “by the way make sure you don’t follow your run into the box EVER”

Do you think he encourages Xhaka to walk around the pitch like a dad playing in his kids 5 a side literally playing at walking pace.

There’s isn’t a single club in this league that would play a midfield 3 of willock, Xhaka and ceballos. There certainly isn’t a team above us in the league who I would swap our midfield 3 for theirs.

In the end it’s Nothing to do with Arteta and is a mathematical calculation.

Xhaka, Ceballos, kolasinac, Mustafi, willock, Nketiah

Harsh but all players not capable yet or in some cases ever of playing up to premiership standard. If you pick one of them you may scramble a win

Two? A result is unlikely

Three ? No chance just no chance.

There isn’t a dressing room to lose. If you think these are players playing massively beneath themselves I don’t know what to say.

I read a piece that illustrated the absolute mess Arsenal got in in the last few years of Wenger but more importantly what has happened since. Every single major building block post Wenger has come and gone in 2 years. Gazidis got rid of Wenger and upped and left, Mislintat came and went, Sanlehhi in and out under a cloud, Fahmy the contracts guy gone and obviously Emery. All of that was put in place for the post wenger era and it all crumbled. Has any other team had that amount of upheaval in the most senior positions? Even Man U have kept the off field structure stable. Man U are 7 years post Fergie, gone through 4 managers, spent close to £1billion, and the squad Fergie left was a lot better than the one Wenger left and even they have not even come close to a title challenge in those years. The transition from the dynasty is huge.
Even now the set up isn't right, even if you believe in Edu, who else is there supporting him to bridge the gap between board and team?
Arteta of course has made mistakes but in terms of our current plight there is really only a very small percentage that can be laid at his door I think.

Rumour has it Arteta whispers in his midfielders ears before each game “DONT TAKE ANY SHOTS FROM OUTSIDE THE AREA”

This is his fault.

Is it a confidence thing rather than Arteta losing the players?

How many times now has (mainly) Tierney had that hands outstretched "where's the pass" gesture, and even Gabriel has been doing it.

Are players hiding? Or is it too rigid tactics? Or just players not up to it?

Hard to tell off tv without being in the stadium.

Quite simply this is the worst team we have had since 1994. You can debate the price of fish and chips if you want.

5 decent players, Leno, Aubameyang, Tierney, gabriel, partey and a couple of promising youngsters.

That’s it,

I think it is a bit of both to be honest. I think there are some people who hide, some that are scared of making a mistake and then those that don’t believe in the game plan. It is hard for me to believe in the game plan of hoping to catch them on the break. The problem is that you create only a couple of chances and you can’t afford to miss without everyone complaining. In one of the recent games MAn City had something like 25 shots and lost. Can’t recall if they even scored. Normally a good team creates numerous chances to only score one or two. Yet players in our squad get maybe 2 chances only and people complain about the miss. This leads to players becoming anxious and even rather pass it sideways than shoot. I am not sure we can redeem ourselves from this situation.

Arteta got away with it last season but we have no other game plan and it’s so obvious to opposing teams that they start with an advantage over us. It’s alright to say give him 5 years but that won’t happen and I have serious reservations about trusting him in the transfer market.

We managed to win the FA Cup beating Chelsea, City and a decent Sheff Utd side along the way. We have beaten United away, beaten Liverpool and had some decent performances and results against some of the big boys, albeit mixed in with a number of inept performances.

If none of our recent dismal showings are in any way Arteta's fault and its all down to the players then surely the FA Cup win is all down to the players?

I have seen nothing yet to convince me that Arteta is some sort of managerial genius in the offing.

The truth is that Aubameyang has been consistently getting us out of jail by scoring a high proportion of the relative scraps he is having to feed on. As soon as his goals dried up it was inevitable that we would struggle because no one else scores any.

Because the FA Cup was a park the bus exercise

5 at the back and won by long balls over the top from Tierney on The break. That’s it

Then it’s back to the premiership and asking bog average midfield players to play expressive football every week. Totally different ball game.

Arteta came in with some fresh tactics, it was percentage football with numbers at the back and relying on an in form striker to take 50% of chances that were created. Unsustainable. Teams pretty quickly worked out how to stop Aubemeyang. Also see how Leicester stopped Partey quite well by just cutting off the supply line to him. This is the problem when you just have a couple of players who can influence games, the opposition are quite happy to let Xhaka, Ceballos, lacazette have it because they won't cause trouble.
I sometimes hear fans say 'why isn't X team just doubling up on Salah, hes the best player int he league and he gets all that space' It is pretty tricky to do that when you know doubling up on him leaves Mané, or Jota free - those guys will just take advantage instead. That's what all the best teams have.

If you fall down on Arteta or the players side you're basically asking yourself these two questions.
If Arteta had better players would we be better off?
If these players had a better manager would we be better off?
It may be the answer to both is yes - but given I feel we've seen all we can from at least half this squad I would certainly choose better players over a better manager right now. Xhaka has been average from the day he signed. Lacazette is a 1 in 3 striker all his Arsenal career. Chambers has never hinted he might be good enough for us in 6 years, Sokratis, Luiz and Kolasinac are not getting better than they are now no matter who the manager. Elneny is not a disaster but he isn't the answer either, there was a reason he was out on loan and no one was offering a bid for him - average. And I know we are all more fond of the academy players but Nketiah, Willock, Nelson, AMN - I'm yet to see anything from any of them to suggest they can form the backbone of an Arsenal side that gets back in the top 4. I could even throw Bellerin in there, I dont doubt his effort and commitment but there are at least 9 RB better than him in the league right now (Trent, James, Cancelo, Walker, Doherty, Wan Bissaka, Lamptey, Perreira, Castagne) and you could make a case for Ayling and Cash as well.

The FA Cup final was not a park the bus effort. They started better, we came back into it, both sides had their moments and periods when they were on top. It was almost universally accepted that Arsenal were the better side on the day and deserved to win it. It wasn't some park the bus/backs to the wall/smash and grab job.

Both games were the same. 5 man defence wins clearly affected by long balls over the top. Cup final was exceptionally close chelsea we’re disappointed and we were lucky pulisic went off at that moment

Your missing the point somewhat though. Those games were not won by incisive cutting edge expressive football required in the premiership.

Just saw this, shows that not only are willock, Xhaka and ceballos not good enough but our central defenders know they aren’t as they are moving the ball forward without their involvement.

Maybe take a look at the winning goal again. A break through the middle of the pitch, quick pass to Aubameyang and brilliant finish. The team was playing with confidence and moving the ball far quicker.

Also, what is the difference between playing PL teams in the league and in the cup? It is the same set of players.

Well, the bad news is we are 14th and to top it off, we are not playing well. So, what's the good news? We aren't far off point wise. We are "only" 7 points from the top.
It's a very contracted league, point wise.

Obviously it doesn’t need explanation cup finals and semis are different to league games. The point remains, not at any point under Arteta, ljungberg, Emery and wengers last season have we played consistent pass and move football that opens teams up. Our midfield 3 yesterday have scored less premier league goals in their arsenal careers combined than chamberlain himself did at Liverpool last year and he was in and out the side.

Our goal of the month competition for November will be a penalty and a header from a centre back. Does this really require further explanation ?

I'd like to see us go back to some form of high press. We seem to build from so deep, slow to get the ball forward so are mostly faced with packed and organised defences where we struggle to create chances. If we won the ball much higher up the pitch and then were able to attack their defence with a more balanced attack v defence in terms of numbers it would certainly help.

Also, a high press involves a high off the ball tempo. As a tactic it switches the mind on to things like second balls and closing down. It is pretty easy to turn down the tempo but it is much more difficult to ramp up the tempo when you're playing so slowly.

Reports are saying Partey is out until the new year. Him and Gabriel are the two players we really can't afford to lose. That they are the two newest members to this team speaks volumes

Didn’t take him long to get in the Arsenal way of things then.

Really disappointing.

I think that so true. Its a double whammy of Aubameyang's loss of form and that the team have stopped creating opportunities for him. This is why I'd like to see us sign one more top level striker and a top creative midfielder at the earliest opportunity. Lacazette's form is in the toilet, Nketiah is 'only' a 6 yard poacher, which leaves are hopes resting on Martinelli who after a blistering start to his Arsenal career, started to tail off a bit. The midfield is so devoid of pace and creativity its quite astonishing.

I think in the short term I'd consider reverting back to the high pressing counter attacking set up which at the very least stopped us losing games. Hopefully this can build confidence. We can then ease Martinelli and Partey back in, and hope that fringe players like Smith Rowe and Balogun may be able to provide some offensive spark. Then in the transfer window I'd try and get a striker with an aeriel threat and obviously look for a creative midfielder.

Arteta's predicament reminds me of those Arcade games where you have to reach a check point to continue.
You know if you can get to the check point you will have a new lease of life (time and transfers) but if you miss it, its game over.

Giroud is looking for a new club again. He would be an improvement for a 6 month loan. Can anyone think of a better solution for a target man striker factoring in cost, effectiveness and assurance of performance?
We need to go all out for Szoboszlai as the creative mid I think, at £22m he is a gift to whoever gets him. Unless there a short term low cost loans (like Giroud) we need to be signing players with a huge upside and long terms potential and with future value.

I'm sure there are good signings to be had from within the premier league if we got rid of some of the snobbery and 'we're better than that' attitude. Look at how much Hojberg has stabilised Spurs midfield for £15m, unfashionable but a clear plan to make the team better.

Here are some pretty awful stats.
No team has attempted fewer dribbles than Arsenal
Only 3 teams have attempted fewer shots than Arsenal
No team has attempted fewer tackles than Arsenal
Only 1 club has won fewer aerial duels than Arsenal
Only 2 clubs have attempted fewer shots from outside the box than Arsenal
Only 2 clubs have fewer key passes in total than Arsenal

So in summary, we don't shoot from close in or from long range, we don't make tackles, we don't try to take men on, we don't compete aerially and we struggle to create anything.

But apart from that we’re bloody good.

The only ex players we should be looking to re sign should be Ramsey, Cazorla and the OX.

I didn't think we should have gotten rid of Giroud the first time. He was producing off the bench.

Ramsey we have missed but he's still injury prone, he's 30 before the end of the year and is on £400k a week at Juve. If he had never been an Arsenal player no fans would want to sign him right now even on a free.
Cazorla I'd love back but he is very nearly retired.
Ox would be starting in the centre of our midfield every game if he could stay fit, we did well to get the £35-40m for him - one of the few successful transfers out. I'm sure he'll point to the medals but so can David May, deep down they both know those trophies weren't won because of anything they contributed.
Id absolutely take Giroud for 6 months