Part of the problem is he hasn't been managed at all, let alone badly. I'm no fan of Keswick or Gazidis, but I do think the main responsibility for that is Kroenke more than those two. At least they both want Wenger out now, and if he does stay it will be down to Stan. For all hoy's questions about what a director of football would actually do, I believe Gazidis wants one appointed because Wenger is so against it. If in addition to the reaction of fans it makes Wenger decide not to sign the new contract offer, I think Gazidis will see the salary of whoever it will be as money well spent.

I do agree with your point in the second post you made today. Something does appear to have changed with Wenger, as I also alluded to in my last post. Seeing the interview on MOTD did not give me the impression he was intending to hang around.

Wenger has got spin off to an art. I really cannot understand how anyone believes anything that comes out of his mouth.

The facts are Champions League has always been his fall back. Now he doesn't even have that.

Now you can't really argue with what Arsene achieved in his first ten years. Then we had the so-called issue with cash flow, moving to the new stadium. Yet the way I see it all now after 21 years is thus. For the first ten years it was mainly Arsenal battling it out with United. Two teams so we were always getting top four. Then along came Chelsea, but this still gave us top 4 by default as there were not 16 worse teams. Then we had City to make it four at the top, but still we would get that by default. Now you have Liverpool, Spurs and maybe even Everton, who can cause problems. seven teams and top four is not a given.

Wenger is yesterdays man. he loves the club. OK that's fair enough. Then why doesn't he leave, let a new manager take charge, sit back as a fan of club and maybe watch us win trophies and enjoy that? He won't because of the fact he is selfish.

In our last eight league games we won seven of those racking up 21 points, almost a third of the seasons total in almost a quarter of the season. These results have papered over huge cracks. They were against team sitting on the beach and a United side looking at a cup final Jose was more interested in.

Next Monday whatever the result Wenger should be history at Arsenal.

If Gazidis had any balls he would have come out and said something publicly and he should have resigned if his football advice was being counteracted by a supposedly hands-off owner in the way you suggest.

I don't agree that Wenger should have gone "years ago" as some on here suggest as they engage in a kind of willy-waving contest about when their massive footballing presience (No offence, Top Gun, but you would sack pretty much everybody except Sanchez and have been guilty of absurd hyperbole over talented players like Ramsey) spotted the glaring defects that we've always kind of known about but were previously offset by other factors.

It should all have been relatively straightforward, this contract should have been his last, he should have been thanked for everything he had done, and given a fond farewell with a dignified handover. He has been seriously at fault for the way this has been handled as well but he has a better excuse than the rest insofar as he cannot be expected to remain neutral and detached.

IF Gazidis was being blocked in an orderly transition by Kroenke then he should have said that his job was untenable and *%^@** off as well. As it is, he has presided over a total mess that has led to the unedifying spectacle of our manager - sensibly but sadly in my opinion - not being able to join the players to mark the end of the season.

I agree especially with the "whatever the result" part.

Annoyingly it's going to be spun that wanting him to leave is about the childish entitled selfishness of us not accepting being outside the top four for the first time in 20 years.

For me and for most I know it's nothing to do with that and everything to do with the realisation that Wenger simply cannot take us any further than he has and the only direction for him now is backwards.

Good post Harlow,

The only thing I didn't agree with was this part because I dont think it's true.

Wenger isn't the king of spin, in fact he's not even bothered about spinning anything. He basically sticks 2 fingers up to anyone with a different opinion, the fans, the board even pat rice and Steve Bould.

Look at his comment about the "poisonous atmosphere" yesterday, I mean he could have said something different like

"at times we had to play in front of some rightly frustrated fans in tense environments but we will take stock of what went wrong and strive to provide them with the success they deserve in future"

... now it basically says exactly the same thing however it doesn't make him sound like a bitter twisted and resentful manager who sees the clubs supporters as an irritation.

He's not even trying to spin it anymore he's just blaming everybody else. The fans, the toxic atmosphere, the Blairites.

I can't recall a manager before who had such distain for his own supporters

All the ground has pretty much been covered by everyone else's posts but thought I'd throw my twopennyworth in anyway.

Wenger went for full on martyrdom in his post match interviews yesterday - fair play I'm sure he has turned down some tempting offers in the past to stay at Arsenal, but refusing "every club in the world" is lot easier I'd imagine when 1) you have total control over every aspect of the club, the kind of control you will never get anywhere else 2) you are under no pressure from the majority shareholder to win any trophies and 3) you are trousering £8m a year.

Still we can sleep easy knowing that if Wenger loves Arsenal as much as he says he does he will do what is best for the club, which means at some point next week he will become Arsenal's ex-manager.

Hmmm......

How dare you!!! I've been pretty restrained recently. Apologise immediately

The 3 main players I've singled out have been Ramsey, Giroud and mert. I just don't like Giroud I admit it, he largely gets a deck chair out for most games and it irritates me. Ramsey a player with talent I acknowledge and there is a debate that could be had around arsene being the right manager for him however I think he's a big time Charlie, Mertesacker I'll admit to being a little unfair on. His managers lack of defensive prowess probably left him exposed in his time with us which is also the reason I'm reluctant to criticise Mustafi these days like everyone seems to as I believe under a different manager there is a good player in there.

I actually tried to defend Walcott on here a lot and believe he takes too much blame sometimes.

In terms of the willy waving contest squire I plead guilty as charged, I have shouted my mouth off about it for too long but after being told to *%^@ off to Spurs numerous times down the years there is a kind of satisfaction to be derived from being right about things and anyone who says otherwise is a liar. Anyway I'd win a forum wave off anytime, you should see the size of this python, it's like something out of clash of the titans

This clearly overlooks what a brilliant manager Wenger was in his prime - which is what he was alluding to. He remained at the club through his best years even though he knew he would have to work with limited resources which negatively impacted on what he could reasonably be expected to win.

The man should not be being hammered for the loyalty he did show Arsenal in his career, a loyalty not replicated by Henry, Fabregas and several other stars worshipped for their contribution to the club.

Totally agree. Wenger deserved his new contract after winning consecutive FA Cups (alongside CL qualification) and deserved the opportunity to have a crack at the title with the financial restraints lifted from the previous decade.

Now if there is a better man available, we should go after him.

I agree, Niall.

Whilst not wholesale revisionism on the part of lots of fans, there's certainly now a sense of selectiveness when it comes to crediting Wenger for what he has achieved and has brought to the club. He's been magnificent but it's now time to try something else.

I'm genuinely finding it sad watching it unfold but I also find the vitriol from some quarters of our fanbase simply disgusting. I get the frustration, I get the need for change but some of the things being said on social media about him are nothing short of vile. It's actually stuff like this that is turning me off the game rather than the football on the pitch.

There are a lot of tw*ats who follow football clubs, of all colours.

I'm not overlooking anything that he did in his first 10 years, he was brilliant. Was being the operative word. And I've tipped my hat to the loyalty he has shown us. I'm merely pointing out that as well as Wenger being good for Arsenal, Arsenal has been pretty for Wenger. In return for his loyalty he has been well remunerated and afforded a level of control that no other manager in the world has had.

I might want him out now but I will always appreciate what he had done for this club. And I wish the whole situation had been handled better so that he could have been shown that appreciation by all Arsenal supporters. Sadly it looks as though the ill felling has gone too far now for that to happen.

You obviously follow different people from me, even now I haven't read much that's been so bad. I'm not sure I really buy into the whole "abuse" argument as people are even claiming that alleging that Wenger is stubborn and tight (he is) or not the genius he's cracked up to be (he isn't) is "abuse". He's a football manager it does come with the territory. I also find it really ludicrous when people treat him like some kind of saint for the reasons tomc outlined above. He never showed any signs of wanting to leave the club where he had an excellent position and his 'financial restraints; (suddenly coming to the fore, they didn't use this excuse at the time) were hardly snaffling around looking for players in the Championship. There's hyperbole on both sides when it comes to Wenger.

I'm regularly seeing stuff calling him a senile old fool and a c**t, which is wholly unecessary IMO. Calling the girl he had an affair with a skanky French slag etc. What's that got to do with his managerial skillset?

He does talk bollocks a lot of the time now which is why I try and ignore most of it as much as I can. It's just soundbites after all. However, yesterday's post match press conference reflected a different shade to what we're used to. Maybe it was the final acceptance we have failed this season or maybe it was him realising it was over for him. It should be a final hurrah on Saturday regardless.

Yeah agree that's no good, just haven't seen so much of it especially about the dodgy rapper (one of his funnier biographical details).

There is an argument that the club partly to blame through their own appalling communications which just leads to rising anger and intolerance.

Yes, Arseblog is brilliant this morning as it covers every angle.

Excellent piece, he's been consistently good throughout this. Doesn't flip-flop after a victory which is really important but remains very clearheaded about the problems. I totally agree with him about Gazidis who is beyond useless and does less to earn his money than Wenger that's for sure...

It's Season Ticket renewal time shortly. The idea that Wenger can be in charge next season worries me. However, Arsenal has been a big part of my life and even more so today when going with my Son Luke. So of course I am going to renew. I'm not letting the fear of yet another season falling away bother me.

In fact should Wenger stay then I'm just going for days out with Luke and going to keep enjoying Arsenal for that very reason. I would hope if Arsene does stay, then he keeps to his word (Hmmm) and changes how he does things. The club give him more money and he spends it wisely on the right players and makes a proper challenge. Whatever, he cannot stay too much longer.

Juve win the Champions League and Allegri decides he wants a crack at the premiership. Dream

Gazidis dropping Özil for Liverpool was a ridiculous decision.

That useless *%^@ Chips can't coach our team to defend a corner.

Lord Harris moving Sanchez back to the left when he was on fire was a mental decision

All these people should be fired

Renewal notices are out. Looks like a 12.5% reduction on last season.

We still get the first 9 European and FA Cup ties included. That's a brave move.

I think his last contract was signed after the first FA cup actually?, Van Gaal was sacked despite winning the FA cup, did he deserve a new contract?, Wenger saved Stan Kroenke lots of money is that why he deserved it?, I'm not sure many fans are very concerned about that.

Anyway we wont get Allegri because our incompetent board have let this situation fester for years, they now have realised at the last possible moment the whole footballing structure of the club needs renewing and are panicking what to do, they don't want Wenger to stay (apart from possibly Kroenke Snr), but really have no idea how to change so much in a short space of time.

What I expect we'll get is a fall guy, obviously it wont be the real villan - Stan, it could be Wenger or Gazidis I think, then we will get a new DOF who is probably not especially high profile, especially if Wenger stays as he wont want someone to question him, we will be sold this as 'evolution' because that is a buzzword the PR at Arsenal like to use frequently.

All speculation and guesswork of course but really does anyone expect Vieira as DOF and Allegri as manager?, mediocrity is Kroenke's brand.

Has no CL sunk in yet? I knew it was fairly inevitable but its still a little surreal.

Edit

10% reduction and first 7 cup ties.

Can't wait for Videotron and Gabala - WHO???

Mind you, Luogrets and Basel hardly quickened the pulse last year.

You renewing? I just did. *%^@ it, you've just got to love the dog you're with I guess.

I don't mind the thought of the Europa. I rarely bothered going to CL matches anyway, whole competition is a massive bore. Quite good fun to see some new teams.

Genuinely haven't made up my mind yet. More likely to renew than not I think.

10%. Tbh I'm surprised they even gave that. But I can't see that appeasing the masses.

More stories about Sanchez to Bayern - Chilean press have been saying this for ages. He would hook up with Vidal...I think it's gonna happen.

Play the b squad ( tap in for you Tg ) in the group stages and if we make it through go for it then.

Funny about Sanchez. Easily our best player but I don't feel much about him and can't say I'm gutted at the thought of him leaving like I was about players in the past.

I'm *%^@*** sick of Giroud whom I have defended previously. Mainly because he is such a giant ponce. Be happy never to see him, his stupid hair and his even stupider theatricals again.

I only really like Ramsey, Iwobi, the Ox and Monreal. The latter just affection for working hard and looking permanently anxious.

Starting to quite like Xhaka because he reminds me a bit of Edu who was better than Gilberto.

Can't stand Bellerin. Sorry I just can't. I think it's the hair and the Instagram mainly.

This will cheer you up no doubt.

Sky Sports reporting we are after a Belgian youngster called Onyekuru, buy out clause of just under 7 million. Reportedly a goal scorer that many clubs are after.

What did you say? Do I want a season ticket..................

Since he came out as a god-botherer, Giroud has plummeted in my estimation.

I like Sanchez when he's got the bit between his teeth but he can stuff the 99% of his back-heels and flipped lobs that don't work right up his arse. The 1% that do work isn't worth it. And he can stuff his increasingly whingeing attitude up there as well. And his arm-waving at the mortals he plays with. I'd like him to stay but if someone stumps up £50m, I won't weep for too long if he leaves.

Özil had a good game yesterday and he's played pretty well recently, but he's been missing in action for most of the season. On his best days, he's very good - often influential and occasionally dangerous but essentially incapable of running a game. On his off days, he's a passenger - if he turns up, that is. If he isn't 'sick'. Or 'sad'. No matter how well he's playing, he's never got out of the habit of collapsing like a rancid lettuce leaf if anyone has the temerity to challenge him. Of course the entire PL has worked this out so guess what he gets? This alone makes him a liability. On the evidence of the last four seasons, he isn't worth £300k per week, nor anywhere near. Again, if someone stumps up proper money, I won't weep at all if he leaves.

Bellerin had a stormer yesterday; his best game of the season. I was pleased to see he's ditched the fukwit hairstyle and reverted to his smarmy/stupid hair. That's progress. I don't do social media so I have no problems liking young Hector and wanting him to stay. In the new formation, he will be a star.

Luke and my ST renewals came through.

Last season £1496 each

This season £1197 each

5th place is a trophy!!!

Happy to hear that about Bellerin - my opinion on players pretty flexible really.

Music tip - the new Perfume Genius album "No Shape" is fantastic and if you liked John Grant, I think you would really like it too. Best album of 2017 so far for me.

Been checking Bayern websites and it seems they've been quite confident of getting him for some while. Apparently Vidal has persuaded Sanchez what a great move it would be for him. Their interest fits because while he won't replace Lewandowski in the centre, on the left where Sanchez also plays, Ribery is 34 now and needs replacing.

I'm not deciding on renewing my season tickets until I hear what the managerial situation is going to be. I can't see Wenger challenging for a major trophy again with Arsenal let alone winning one so I don't see the point of him continuing. At the very least i would like a genuine managerial succession plan to be announced.
The anti Kroenke mood is interesting and welcome but I can't see what we as fans are going to do to pressure him, beyond singing "get out of our club". The bloke doesn't even watch Arsenal matches. Still, it's a start I suppose. He's an investor and unless he stands to lose a lot of money why would he sell a profitable investment?

Car crash TV from May.

I agree that Sanchez does overdo it a bit sometimes but you can't say his over elaboration is not worth it when he scores the number of goals he does (especially from out wide) and makes the number of assists he does. He's up there with the very best players in the PL.

Agree about Özil, he's too flakey for me. Rarely turns up in big games either (infact, any games this season) and hates physical contact. Has the talent to run a game but most of the time he couldn't run a bath. Get rid unless we bring in about five top notch players who can compensate for the negative aspects to his game.

Giroud is a big girls blouse who should be bullying defenders but instead is too worried about messing up his hair. Get's fouled a lot but instead of dishing out a bit of well deserved retribution he would rather sit on the ground shaking his hand in some ridiculous gesture regarding the pain he is suffering. His chronic lack of pace is an issue too.

Agree about Bellerin, he'd largely been bang average since his return from injury, especially with his final ball, but he was fantastic yesterday. His energy was amazing.