Is it any wonder there is no atmosphere at the ground when we are so apathetic. We're talking about the next round being a Semi-Final and one more to a Cup Final in February. Winning breeds winners here.

Saints rested 9 players and still beat us with ease.

The problem is starring people in the face.

Morning goonerguru. For me the end of that sentence about someone else being sounded out "in case Wenger decides to leave at the end of the season" says a lot about the board, and what it says isn't very positive. The chances that the board will decide it's time for Wenger to move on are in my view close to zero. I firmly believe that if this is Wenger's last season, it will be his decision to make it so. He will be offered a new contract, and my strong guess is that he already has been. I think I mentioned after attending the last AST meeting that Wenger hasn't yet decided whether or not to stay. I just hope the crowd makes him believe it's time to retire regardless of whether that makes the atmosphere at matches somewhat unpleasant.

I will say it till I'm blue in the face. It starts at the top. If Stan was a football man, we wouldn't be where we are right now. If he wasn't but still cared about winning we wouldn't we where we ware now. If we are looking at other managers its because Wenger hinted to the club that it will be his last season. We have an owner whose main concern is another team in another sport in another city, in another country. How effed up is that? But that's who are stuck with until he keels over.

In the interim.....

My point exactly Steven .... I genuinely feel sorry for Arsenal supporters arriving at the ground , having paid out whatever hard earned cash and to be treated [ repeatedly ] to such absolute rubbish .

Limp wristed highly paid twats getting fifty times as much as Radford , Armstrong , Kelly and Co ....and go through the motions .

Jenkinson ... I liked that guy , had a "I'm mean business" look to him .... please f**& off to Grimsby reserves .

No doubt Theo , Aaron , or some other Twitter orientated **&^%^$ will be talking about wake up calls .

At least Jenkinson cares. But so would you and all the members of the forum let alone all the countless other lifelong Arsenal fans across the world. The thing is, we're not considered good enough to play for Arsenal's first team even as a back up player. Wenger considers Karl to be so.

In short, I genuinely couldn't give a toss about the league cup, and indeed my biggest disappointment was that Mavididi didn't get a look from the bench. I also think the only way we'd beat Liverpool or Utd over 2 games is by playing our 1st 11, which is less of a stretch for them given their lack of serious European commitments, and our unkind fixture list in the new year. It isn't the 80s or 90s. The only big club manager who really gives a toss about the league cup is Mourinho, more so than ever with his underachieving side.

The thing is, despite all the endless whinging on here, we are 3 points off the top of the table, with a deeper squad than any time in the last 8 years and some useful players to return. Of course we are over-reliant on Kos, Özil and Sanchez. But most best teams are reliant on their three best players. When City lost Aguero and De Bruyne for a few games, they could barely buy a win for a month. The key for us will be whether our currently injured players can get up to speed quickly enough on their return to make up for the inevitable injuries and rotations of some our current first choice 11, and whether Xhaka can cement a place for himself.

The loans for Wilshere, Campbell and Chambers don't look so smart now, and I'm not in favour of loans without recall clauses. I also think Gnabry doing a last minute contract u-turn and leaving has been a bit of a miss.

As has been the case before, much depends on whether the manager is willing to bring in a body or two in January (a full back who can cover both sides and a creative wide-man who can play centrally would be nice), and he has bought at least one body in in most Januarys.

I don't expect us to win the league. But I also believe that we are better placed to last the pace than for a long time, so that is worth not risking too many first teamers for the league cup. Actually last night would have been a good chance for Akpom if fit, and he would have brought some badly needed pace and energy.

Southampton were compact, professional, had a plan and had just enough first choice men to keep their team cohesive. We were awful and deserved to lose. And we looked like a team that hadn't played together (Which for the most part was the case) - imbalanced and lacking in any understanding.

We already know that Ramsey and Coquelin doesn't work, and Elneny not working with those two was absolutely no surprise. Disappointed we haven't got more in the youth set ups that can contribute to be honest.

And despite what many on here think, I don't think the manager can do no wrong, and if we can get someone with proper clout or a genuinely exciting young manager, I'll be happy if he calls it time, which has been my view for the last two years. Having had to sell his stars every year, he can now spend some money, and we are seeing some improvement, but perhaps not enough. The difficulty is, he and the club sacrificed a decade for the stadium move and increased revenue, only to discover that the world has moved on, and that the stadium cash is small beans compared to other income and every other big club is spending just as much as us now anyway.

Our first 11 is still very very good. Our reserve players aren't really good enough on the whole, but are a little better than our reserves have been in previous years.

Yes we'd all love the invincibles team, but ultimately, that just isn't possible for Arsenal anymore. Everyone else has caught up on nutrition,scouting and tactics, the league is much more even in terms of quality, and we still have multiple domestic rivals spending more than us on players and wages. Its just a lot harder now.

Would I have taken Klopp or Guardiola? Yes of course, but Klopp's star was at its lowest when we had just won the cup. Guardiola had been lined up by City for 5 years. I liked Conte too, but Chelsea always seemed a better fit for him. I would take Tuchel for sure. Simeone? Maybe, but they aren't great to watch for the most part, and I hated him as a player with a passion. The guy at Liepzig is interesting, as is the young guy at Hoffenheim, but both are relatively unproven.

Maybe Lucien Favre at Nice?

Any other suggestions? Not that Wenger will go before his own time with our predominantly gutless board and owner.

What a cartload of waffle ...and took three million words to express it
You don't care about the League Cup ...you only graciously gave some in laws a treat .

What about the poor pr*cks that care . The whinging on here ... 3 points off the top bollox .... we say this every f***^^%#$ year .

We are guaranteed Champions league for the last three thousand years under Wenger ...whoopee doo ... what about turning up and competing .... providing some entertainment

" " " Southampton were compact, professional, had a plan and had just enough first choice men to keep their team cohesive.""""

Why the f**&^ cant we be like that ...... Coquelin , Elneny , Ramsay , Gabriel , Gibbs , Oxo , Perez , Xhaka , Iwobi ... they are all first team on their day .

Utterly *%^@ performance.

Rather than saying more of what's been said already here is a link to a lady talking about using Highbury as an air raid shelter in WWII. Trust me - it'll be a far better use of your time.

http://www.islingtonfacesblog.com/2016/ ... est-stand/

Agree 100%

A past it relic

Greatest manager of our club? Not in my world he's undone that ,

If others are outraged by that stance tough!

Whose stats f@@@ all this cryptic nonsense

We're doomed I say doomed.

Santi to have an ankle operation, out for 3 months.

AW will need a miracle to replace him...............

http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archiv ... go-surgery

Could Di Maria play the Santi role. He's always saying he wants to play with Santi again and he is available I think.

Wouldn't that be some scoop......................

How often does this happen to us. Cazorla was injured on Oct 19th, 6 weeks ago. Diagnose it properly and he has his surgery and is back with us in 6 weeks. Now its 3 months. I realise you can't get every decision on injuries correct but we seem to bugger up so many.

How often do you hear for other clubs "so and so is ahead of schedule......" or "so and so injury not as bad as first feared..." and how often do you hear the total opposite for us?

Hindsight is great but Wilshere should be with us, I said I was worried about that loan signing as soon as it was completed.

The cycle is the same every season. Start the season with at least a couple of long term injuries (welbeck and mertesacker this year), pick up more injuries as the season gets started (iwobi and ramsey first game - giroud struggled) then run the same players in to the ground (or infamous 'red zone') because we can't afford to rotate. Yet more injuries.

Wenger will, as we know, come out with some statement that buying players in january is not always the solution but we really do need a Cazorla replacement AND cover at right-back

Whilst most of us are not in the Nostradamus envelope we could've predicted ( in fact many of us did ) that relying on a 32-year-old injury prone player was maybe not the best idea to plan your Season to out on the creative midfield front, but then we have not worked half a day at football have we?

I'd break Madrid for Isco. Chuck Ramsey in as they're sweet on him. Not knocking Ramsey, I just can't see a balance in our team that's going to work for him and Bale loves playing with him.

Yes every season is the same, how long we been saying this for some of us?

Repeat patterns 9 years and counting , The man is a busted flush

Rich - to be fair reports today seem to suggest Welbeck is well ahead of schedule.

If ever there was a post that totally sums up the mood about Arsenal it's your one here H

Do you seriously think Ramsey is good enough to play for real? Their fans get on the back of even their best players. After the 3rd needless back heel they'd be losing the plot

That would be most welcome. Although he was injured vs City at the start of May and the diagnosis was 9 months. End of Jan is 9 months. Important member of the squad due to his versatility

I like Isco but can't see Real Madrid letting him go. He's been fairly well used this season so far, 14 appearances.

Strange that for so long we had a front 6 made up of 5 technical players, first touch excellent, passing excellent, creativity excellent but missing the physical side, a workrate, desire to do the dirty stuff.......and now we're crying out for a bit more creatvity in the middle of the park

I read that Southampton have 1 win in the last 7 matches against Arsenal. What's cryptic about that.

Your wrong that's what 2 league defeats at st Mary's last 2 seasons 0-4 & 0-2 and two league cup defeats at home including last night, plus chuck in two last minute home wins in league and another fortunate draw

Shame when people don't do their research , that's why it was cryptic mate

My apologies Lom

...was last night ruminating Arsenal's demise , had a fairly high temperature argument with the wife so decided after she slunk off to bed , alcohol might cure all ... a few hefty vodkas later I eventually went to bed at 5 am

.......... not the greatest idea I've had this year .

From an interview with O'Leary in telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/201 ... nt-fallen/

Graham asked O’Leary to join him at Tottenham when he left but he stayed, not because of any expectation of getting the Leeds job, but because “I couldn’t join Tottenham”.

Thats,the legend status back then

... so they didn't offer him enough money then

I don't think he is but if they asked Bale about him, I'm sure he'd give Ramsey a good reference. It's not our problem if their fans start giving him stick after he signed for Real.

Let me make it clear that I like Ramsey. I just think it could be the right time, for both him and the club, for him to move on.

What characteristics about him do you like? Seriously

To me he seems like a lazier version of Michael Thomas with less technique

But we have a very special speereet and beeleef and we just need to look for internal solutions and improve our sharpness.

I like Ramsey as a player.

He gets stick for 'trying it' but he is always there trying it, to get stick.

Honestly I can't help thinking of that night against Barca when he and Jack utterly schooled possibly the best midfield unit ever (I said possibly guys!). They had every kind of balance the middle two need that night. It was an amazing performance and both players were lauded in the Spanish press. But in our game now with how we play I don't see how he fits. His ideal is #10 and I think he'd work there behind either Giroud or Sanchez in different ways – but we've got Mezut Özil... The left was a bit of a stretch I thought but he's put in a lot of good games playing on the right of the three and tucking in/coming through the inside forward line.

He was extremely good in the summer international bollocks thingy. One of the players of the tournament. You get noticed doing that and he was in the Real press. And there's the Bale thing.

He's a very good player but I just can't see how he fits in.

One other thing about Ramsey. I can't remember the (home) game, a few years ago, but there was a thing where our right back went off and the replacement wasn't ready to come on. Players were looking at each other and pointing but he ran over and pointed at himself and took the position until the ball went out again and the sub came on. I really liked that.


Yeah swapping him for Isco might be a bit of a stretch but in all the years it's the first time I've gone full football manager on the forum. He would be rather good though.

I thought Thomas had a lot of technique. I can remember him Davis and Thomas going full Wengerball for a while.

I used to like his work rate, albeit it's not been so evident this season. I tend to think he's not as bad as some people suggest, but nor is he as good as others claim. On the latter, I heard someone say that he's technically good enough to play for Barcelona after it had been reported they were interested in signing him. I didn't agree. I feel his passing it too inconsistent, or hit and miss, for him to be seen at the very top level. Namely, Barcelona's level.

Oh blimey, Paul Davis.

Him. About 30. That is who we need to sign this window.

The give Wally a whole load of Rocky whoop-arse (I'm not saying ass) and we're home and dry.

I love that - proper brilliant.

DHD.

You asked about transport from not the boleyn. Spoke to a West Ham person at the pub. He's been there a couple of times and his advice is spend some time googmaping the area beforehand. Plan a nice walk away for a bit then jump the first bus you see going anywhere. The way he made Stratford (the athletics station he called it) sound it was a bit like Finsbury Park would be if every other station around the arse was shut. And you were stuck in a tube in the road coming up to it.

Everyone has a line.
I wasn't really as into football as I am now, and have to wonder how (badly) Graham going to the scum was taken and how much teasing Tottenham were doing about the announcement, if any.

Not buying a better striker after Giroud's first season has got to be no worse than second as Wenger's biggest crime. I'm a fan of Giroud actually. I think he gets maligned for things he can't do. Can't blame a man for what he isn't. Its like blaming Santi for not being tall. Giroud has played to fullest extent of his ability and the things he does do well or decently at.
That said, he's not the striker you typically have to win the league or CL with. I've read on here from one or two people making excuses about Wenger not having either the financial resources or someone available good enough. This is indicative of why we won't be in the top, top tier of clubs. City, Chelsea, Man Utd, Barca, RM, Juve, Bayern Munich would have paid above the costs if necessary for such a vital position. Even Liverpool and PSG would have.
Wenger still operates on a principle that got us Vieira, Henry, Petit. Buy unknowns and make them great. Even if he was City's manager he would do that. Not as much but he still would. He would do it as a national manager. Obviously you don't buy players but I can see him taking on players that no one thinks should be in the national team or a risk. More non Premier league players which would be exciting but a huge risk.

I heard Bellerin on a podcast talking about his new contract. He finished off with words to the effect that it was important to win silverware. I know everyone thinks players are motivated only by money but the reality is if we don't start picking up some trophies he will not stay forever. It would not surprise me if Alexis thinks he needs a few more medals before he retires and hence the reluctance to sign a new contract.

If it was me I would wait the end of the season and see if I had any medals.

That will always be Herbert Chapman barring something utterly extraordinary.

To be fair O'Leary has been back to The Arsenal as a fan in recent years a fair bit, and has never said a bad word against us.