Our support has indulged Wenger for so long defending his every move for a long time. A selection of our fans truly deserve this current incarnation of Arsenal. The fans protesting should be given medals frankly.

You deserve this Arsenal side mate

The key is that Wenger is no longer the sole master of his own destiny. The club's recent hirings mean he can be removed without leaving a massive black hole with Steve Bould offering the only modern footballing expertise after his departure. The club's structure made him unassailable. Now he can actually be held to account. Its a farce that the behind the scenes changes that we ALL wanted took so long to happen, but the fact they have massively increase the likelihood of his departure...because the club is now ready for it. This means that whatever his KPIs are, there is now at last some potential consequence to not meeting them. Sadly for Wenger, they've come in as he's finally started underachieving by any measurable criteria bar net transfer spend, but its about bloody time, because any staff member of any organisation with complete autonomy can go a bit Louis XIX after 20 years...

Our medical team is now much much more advanced than it is, so I think bar perhaps minor changes to Wenger's training methods, our injury prone players are just that. Rambo has extraordinary stamina but its hamstrings and groins that are the same repeated injuries for him, so perhaps that's the ongoing long term impact of having his leg snapped into by arch orc Shawcross. Most of our other players seem to have greater variety of injuries that would suggest less of a long term problem, bar the ongoing issue of Kos's tendons, and poor old Santi.

I think the Ancelotti parachute is no longer the primary option - the structural changes are all in motion. We have a new scouting system, a new medical system, a new contract negotiator, a new 'not director of football, honest' and I'm sure Hodd can inform us of any ongoing changes at the academy or what he thinks might be on the cards. The only thing Wenger totally controls now is the training and matches, and that can change with a new manager and some turnover of coaches. Accordingly, we can be a bit more stratgic in our next hire than simply going for a safe pair of hands, particularly as Ancelotti is famously tactically hands off compared to many top managers. He's the guy you bring in with an experienced team of big egos that needs a change of man management, atmosphere or internal relationships. I think we need a more long-term hire, which with Wenger's reputation diminished will be a lot easier to do than would have been the case before.

There is no doubt that Mertesacker tends to be a stabilising influence for most of his partners. We've seen it at Arsenal, and its the only reason he got so many Germany caps. A guy with no acceleration who was still an amateur at 18 can only have such a career if he is smarter than most. The problem is that Mertesacker's ability at this level has now dropped off too far to be a really viable option. Once into your 30s missing a whole year with a serious injury is often a career killer, and despite his excellence in the cup final, that always seemed like a last hurrah.

I don't know of any fan who has supported his every move.

I'm more optimistic than most, and even I've been saying its time for the last 18 months. There's enough audio on the internet to prove it!

Even before that I was saying that I didn't think he was underachieving as much as people suggested and that finishing 4th or above when you have the 4th biggest wage budget and somewhere between 10th & 20th net spend makes you hard to sack for a board not prepared to invest. I felt he deserved his chance at running the team for 1 contract once we finally moved beyond the point of a net transfer profit every year. I felt he should have gone at the end of that contract, as it was clear that the extra transfer spend hadn't made much difference, and that he'll regret staying on after the Chelsea final.

Also, I maintain that Kroenke doesn't give a rats arse about fans protests.

Maybe I do deserve this Arsenal side. But that will have nothing to do with what I post on here. And having lived through significantly worse Arsenal teams, I'll cope - in the knowledge that unless he pulls a miracle out his aging bum, Wenger will be gone in 4 months or 16 months at the longest.

For the record I still maintain strongly that our current position is infinitely more to do with the previous and existing board than the manager, and the refusal of said individuals to invest any of their own money (bar a couple of exceptions) when Wenger was still a cutting edge manager with a world class squad was a crime far worse than any of Wenger's managerial failings.

in 2004 we were arguably the best team in Europe. We had grown into one of the most popular teams in the world. We had a top manager at the absolute peak of his powers. We had a brilliant first team in fairly urgent need of renewal. At that point Wenger was still identifying future world stars before most other big club managers. And the club chose to stagnate rather than invest. Without even going full Abramovich, with more investment in the playing staff we could have become one of the absolute world super clubs.

The last 3-4 years Wenger has undoubtedly underachieved. But for me, the club's actions and policy 03-14 showed an extraordinary lack of foresight and a great degree of personal greed.

For me Wenger's worst single decision as Arsenal manager was him turning his back on what made his Highbury years so successful. A team packed with big players and a style of play that focused on moving the ball forward quickly. I don't know why he made that change, but we started recruiting skilful midgets who played possession football. Maybe he wanted to accommodate Fabregas, or perhaps he fell in love with the way Barcelona at their peak used to play. The trouble was, our skilful midgets weren't at the same quality level as Messi, Iniesta and Xavi and our possession game degenerated into a mind-numbingly boring exhibition of short balls where it seemed to take a forty pass move to get the ball in the opposition's half. But whatever the reason, it's what I perceive as happening. Moreover, I blame Wenger for making that decision. I don't suppose the board asked him to make it, even though I tend to agree with your main comments on them.

Our away record is absolutely shameful. It would get managers of struggling teams sacked let alone a team who is supposed to be challenging at the top.
20-30 points less than the top 5 in our last 25 or so games.

Nothing will improve until wenger is turfed out

If you're not watching you should see Sanchez's face.

Even when he was at his lowest he still had a smile on him when he played now its more Victor Meldrew.

Newcastle lead 1-0 Sanchez pushed into the middle, Pogba off. This is not a happy team.

We have not beaten one of the top 5 teams away since 2015. Stuff that in your pipe AW.

Craig Dawson is such a crap referee. Earlier he missed a blatant foul on the corner of United's box and just now Valencia almost took a Newcastle player's face off and Valencia stayed on the pitch. I've never seen such a bad foul.

Mané got a straight red and 3 game ban for doing that to the city gk earlier in the season.
I don’t see why after the game that that can’t be reviewed and upgraded to a red. The idea that if a ref saw it and dealt with it on the pitch means nothing further can happen is bonkers.
If Valencia’s tackle gets upgraded to a red how can anyone complain, same goes for all other obvious errors. Just have a single guy who can review all these incidents and therefore his opinion gives the consistency we want

the difference is Kevin was actually right, based on the info he had been told on the inside ( we as the protest organisers were also told this from decent inside sources too) and up to a point it was how it panned out the board were hoping to ease him out at the end of the contract. the fly in the ointment was Kroenke , and with the get out cards of the fa cup semi and final performances and results ( considering the opposition in both) Wenger was able to rock up at the Dorchester on the Sunday after the final and persuade Stan to give him another contract over the heads of gazidis et al . Added to the fact that Wenger knows how to smooze the type of cultural Inferiority complex someone like Stan has


Obviously, where Wenger is concerned it ain’t over till it’s over , and I know bernard will point to the not breaking a contract stance , but unless they announce they are extending this summer (which even they would see would be commercial suicide ) the issue will dominate next season .

the situation is way different now. Wenger played his last card last summer and we’ve got worse, the various sponsors are starting to lose interest and the club is becoming an irrelevance at the elite level the longer this goes on.

As I said whist Wenger is Houdini in this stuff , he looks like he’s out of luck and I’d say it’s a fair chance he’s toast

the difference is Kevin was actually right, based on the info he had been told on the inside ( we as the protest organisers were also told this from decent inside sources too) and up to a point it was how it panned out the board were hoping to ease him out at the end of the contract. the fly in the ointment was Kroenke , and with the get out cards of the fa cup semi and final performances and results ( considering the opposition in both) Wenger was able to rock up at the Dorchester on the Sunday after the final and persuade Stan to give him another contract over the heads of gazidis et al . Added to the fact that Wenger knows how to smooze the type of cultural Inferiority complex someone like Stan has


Obviously, where Wenger is concerned it ain’t over till it’s over , and I know bernard will point to the not breaking a contract stance , but unless they announce they are extending this summer (which even they would see would be commercial suicide ) the issue will dominate next season .

the situation is way different now. Wenger played his last card last summer and we’ve got worse, the various sponsors are starting to lose interest and the club is becoming an irrelevance at the elite level the longer this goes on.

As I said whist Wenger is Houdini in this stuff , he looks like he’s out of luck and I’d say it’s a fair chance he’s toast

I presume you're having a laugh at Man U/Sanchez bubble, but when we're in such a state and just capitulated to Spurs in such a feeble manner, it all feels a bit hollow.

Yep , pointless , actually from my ( adopted) point of view a Newcastle win was the last thing brighton needed

Each to their own. Sanchez could come good but if he doesn't and i don't think he will then the fact I called it a long time before any of you and took a lot of criticism for doing so makes my day every time it happens.

If we keep on losing so be it, I'm narked for a couple of days then look for our next opportunity to win. Hoping the team don't win the cup or lose a game is I agree disrespectful to the club we love. AW is not the club and will leave in due course. We will see what happens then but good or bad I will always want the Arsenal to do well.

So who has been criticising you for wanting Arsenal to win? I want them to win as well. Personally I find your obsession with Sanchez failing (comfortably our best player each season he was with us excepting this one) a bit weird.

Benitez has now beaten Mourinho 6, it was Pep that's beat him 9 times I would still like to see Rafa take over from AW for at least a year or two.

His team were awesome today and he seems to have discovered a brilliant new keeper.

Yeah got that one right Brom

We should all hibernate for fifteen months and only burrow out of the snow only when the news "Arsene Wenger resigns " comes through .

One mini mini consolation ; Wenger's says post match ... " I think we passed back to the goalkeeper too much and should have been more audacious "

Well Glory Hallelulah Arsene .......... what I've been raving about for God knows how long

Our passing and general play will never ever f***** ever improve while we constantly resort to the soft cock option of passing back to Čech ; who then just Hail Mary's it upfield .

Now you've twigged that one Arsene ...could you instruct Aubameyang to stand two yards inside our half when the opposition takes a corner ... that would keep two of their defenders occupied and give us a goal threat from any hopeful clearance .

I think the decision was made for simple reasons. He was told he had to on average break even or make a profit on transfers every year. So he decided to pursue youth. Who was our best young player? Fabregas, a passing genius from Barca.

Had we not been kicked out of the 07/08 title race due to an appalling lack of protection for our players, he might have been vindicated. Sadly the vultures picked off Hleb, Flamini and soon enough Adebayor as our competitors all got better. And of course we had the Almunia blind spot among other bad Wenger decisions that started to creep in.

Now it would make more sense for Wenger to try and copy Germany's way of playing.

Bizarre isn't it. Until 3 years ago we often were better away than at home. The last 18 months our away form has fallen off a cliff in a way we haven't seen in decades.

Unless we win the Europa League... Kroenke might be happy with just a League Cup win too.

I enjoyed this sentence very much. And yes, unless Wenger somehow flukes top 4 or the Europa League, I assume he'll be gone.

I'm aware that at least three of the board members wanted Wenger out last summer. But as you correctly say, the fly in the ointment was Kroenke. Wenger succeeded in persuading Kroenke to renew his contract, so I find it difficult to accept that Kevin was actually right. After all, he thought Wenger would be off, but he stayed. Regarding summer this year, it could go either way. Finishing sixth will get Arsenal into the Europa League again, so Kroenke might be comfortable with that. Also, if we win it this year we get into the Champions League (I don't see us as favourites but we do have a chance of winning it). If that happens, I think it practically guarantees Wenger will still be manager next season. Win the League Cup (City are the very firm favourites but it isn't impossible Arsenal might) and I think it could go either way. But even a League Cup win and losing the Europa League might easily be enough to save him. But it will surprise me if he resigns because of his obsession with not breaking a contract, so if he does go this summer I reckon he'll have to be sacked, even if Gazidis tries to smooth talk a way of making it sound 'kinder' than him being dismissed.

As you know, I want to see Wenger out the door as much as anyone. I'm just not as confident as you that it will happen this summer.

As I said the information was “correct” but beyond that not much anyone could do, that’s where he was right, we believe he was going right up until the final

Sure Wenger could be around next season , but quite frankly the club,s reputation as a serious force is getting damaged at an increasing rate , that if people think this year is bad it will fall off a cliff unless they win the Europa , as I said I doubt they would let him just see out the last year , and go through the whole speculation thing again , so they would have to offer a new contract this summer, that I can’t see.

The one year break clause is definitely there from what informed people tell the likes of Kevin

Arsenal’s next away league game is at the Amex , that’s gonna be an interesting afternoon for me

Accepting your point. What do you do with players like Wellbeck - retain them and eat up a lot of salary or look for a full fit replacement. He is not the only player at the club like this.

I am not with Lom on the explanation it is all the boards fault. The board have failed to put money into the club and purchase proper quality players. They have failed to stay up with the changing mode of the EPL but they are happy to take the increased prize and TV money.

Wenger contributed significantly. Having been required to be frugal for a while, I believe Wenger and his ego bought into the belief that he could build a great team on a small budget. He wanted to do the Raineri win at Leicester. (Of course he failed to understand that he would never get recognition like Raineri as fans of other clubs would have still said it was Arsenal and we are rich but that is a side issue). Wenger could at any time have told the board he needed more money and tell them he would not renew his contract. At that time akin to blackmail as he was still reasonably popular with the fans.

Plus as Bernard has pointed out he changed his playing style to tippy tappy without players of the ability to play the style. We stopped recruiting speedy players with a skill match. We ended up with short players across the park and players on the wing who could not cross consistently.

But then I believe Wenger totally misread the path of the EPL and transfer fees. He liked to think he was able to predict the way forward for the league. I recall after one of the big financial meltdowns Wenger predicted that transfer fees would fall. They didn't. But he still valued players well below value.

He was stubborn in his beliefs and so began the trolley dashes. Asharvin and others as an example. It was Wenger not the board who believed we had a solid team for the season and then went to Man U and got beaten 8-2 - trolley dash. That game will stay with me until the day I die.

It was Wenger who had loyalty to some players that were simply not and would never be good enough. He was never brutal enough in man management. It was Wenger who used to tell players like Fabergas, Henry and Van Persie that he would improve the team in the offseason. After failing to do so for a number of seasons in a row, they all eventually left.

Now Wenger has a belief that most modern players will see out their contracts and clubs will not sell them. If he is wrong he will cost the club a lot of money. It is Wenger who has no identifiable playing style for our club and indeed not even a consistent defensive style. He has a lot of 'yes arsene' players but no leaders at the club. this is Wenger not the board.

Wenger is known for not breaking contracts. So, would he do that now? From his history of stubborness and him liking to be a man of his word I don't see him leaving on his own.

My guess is creating a structure that can see Wenger not a important is Gazidis' doing.

With regards to him being shown the door, that kind of decision would mean Stan would have to give the OK. As far as I know he's happy with Wenger unless I am not privy to new information.

So, I think its unlikely to see Wenger leave before his contract is finished.

Dude, if you think Kroenke even knows what the league cup is you haven't been paying attention. lol, i say that jokingly. If he is told we are in a final, he'll show up because it will look badly if he isn't there.

As far as Wenger, does he want his contract extended? I don't know the rumor mill but its a fair question. He's been managing us for ever it seems. The league is becoming harder to win, next to unlikely. We'd have to be more like Leicester than Man City to win the league for near and intermediate future.
Domestic cups are pretty much the only thing left and that is getting more and more difficult as well.

5th or 6th is becoming our new level. If we get 5th or worse this year, I fear it will be consistent. The club needs a shake up. I am least of us on here privy to the rumors and what's happening but the little I know and I have repeated this is Gazidis. I think he is not happy with Wenger and trying to engineer Wenger out of the club. I think he's in Stan's ear about it as well. Gazidis is a football man and wants to win things. If we see the mess, he has and he's in the center of it, seeing up close and personal. Bould as well.

Great seeing Man Utd lose. Even better to see Sanchez miss their best chance. He won't make that mistake too often but its nice to see it.

I think you might have made an error. Man U and us are not rivals for a top four position. They are 11 points ahead of us with 11 games to go & we are only half way thru February. We are a full level below them. Hard to take any good things out of our weekend after the way we were totally outplayed.

Mind you we get to play Man U at the home of Maureen before the season ends so that will be something to look forward to.

As far as Ancellotti being at the match, I think its just as likely sperz will lose their manager as we ours. He could be there to see them. It wouldn't be a shock to anyone if either the sperz manager or Kane moves to Spain.

We’ve lost as many away league games this season as we did between 2001-2005

Well that has cheered me up. Wenger loves setting records.

Unless we go on an unlikely unbeaten run, can't see us finishing top 5. Unlikely for Burnley, Leicester or Everton to catch us either. 6th will get us Europa Cup again?

5th gets Europa. League cup and FA Cup winners get Europa. The league cup place will go to 6th placed team if City beat us - so as long as we finish 6th Europa is guaranteed