Fixtures Sunday April 28th - Tottenham Hotspur - Tottenham Hotspur Stadium - 2:00 Pm

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Post #414001  Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2022 9:23 pm 
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dec wrote:
"Better to engage with what people are actually saying." Both yourself and Rich described their transfer dealings as "must win now" and you literally said you don't see much of a future for their team. Yet it is some leap on my part to interpret that as criticism of their transfer activity?

It's not a criticism, it's just simply stating where their squad is at - built around two world class attacking players approaching 30. Several of the core players in our squad still have years before they're at the age where players usually peak; Saka, Ødegaard, Martinelli, Saliba, you can throw in most of our other defenders there too, and we still almost beat them to 4th place.

Richarlison adds much needed attacking depth for them, and Bissouma should improve their rather mediocre midfield, but they will once again depend on their two stars to remain fit and firing to repeat what they did last season. Behind those two I don't see anyone capable of stepping up and leading the team forward.


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Post #414002  Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2022 10:09 pm 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
old man of hoy wrote:
Thanks for posting that AG - Folley was a class act. He fought our Henry Cooper twice - losing on points in 1958 but winning by KO in 1961. As a boy I recall my dad using Toby's gym off Tower Bridge Road, and him telling me he had seen Ezzard Charles training there.
Thanks, always something interesting mentioned when you comment. I watch a lot of old videos. Cooper and Frazier had 2 of the best left hooks I've ever seen. Both men tagged Ali pretty good with it. Their second fight was at Highbury, wasn't it? Or do I have it wrong. I thought I read that once.
Yes it was at Highbury - a one-sided affair ending in a stoppage because of bloody minces, as some of Cooper's fights did. The Achilles eye, and a relatively glassy jaw, meant Henry was never a serious world title contender, though his left hook was dynamite.

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Post #414003  Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2022 11:06 pm 
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Hazuki wrote:
dec wrote:
"Better to engage with what people are actually saying." Both yourself and Rich described their transfer dealings as "must win now" and you literally said you don't see much of a future for their team. Yet it is some leap on my part to interpret that as criticism of their transfer activity?

It's not a criticism, it's just simply stating where their squad is at - built around two world class attacking players approaching 30. Several of the core players in our squad still have years before they're at the age where players usually peak; Saka, Ødegaard, Martinelli, Saliba, you can throw in most of our other defenders there too, and we still almost beat them to 4th place.

Richarlison adds much needed attacking depth for them, and Bissouma should improve their rather mediocre midfield, but they will once again depend on their two stars to remain fit and firing to repeat what they did last season. Behind those two I don't see anyone capable of stepping up and leading the team forward.

The other thing is add against Spurs (and of course we’re biased and want them to fail) but their play is quite one dimensional and I think after a successful season of one dimensional play opposition coaches will pay more attention to it and work out a better plan.
The best teams have an aggressive not passive tactical set up and work on the basis that they have the ball and can create and beat the other team no matter what the other team do. Spurs kind of rely on the other team to come at them for them to do what they’re good at.

For everyone saying Srsenal now have European football and two games a week to deal with the same applies to spurs, they hardly played in Europe at all last year and actually being in the CL means they’re more likely to play their best 11 midweek as well where we’ll have a much better chance to rotate heavily in the early europa rounds


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Post #414004  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 2:57 am 
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Rich wrote:
Read a few reports about Martinelli signing a new deal to 2027 with a further year option. He’s been given the No.11 shirt this year too.

Getting Martinelli, Saka and Saliba tied to nee deals is as if not more important than any signing we make from now


Hope it is true, I like Martinelli a lot. He is the new Alexis for us. Always driving forward and lots of energy.

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Post #414005  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 5:23 am 
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I can't take this titled (and I corrected the title which said 21th online) 'Arsenal Team of the 21st Century seriously. Just off top of the top of my head no Pires? A few others as well.


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Post #414006  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 5:44 am 
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Hate to say it but Fergie is the man. I wonder what history would have been like in the PL if Palace had beaten them in the '90 FA cup final?


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Post #414007  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 5:53 am 
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long time gooner wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
Why is announcing a player so important anyway.

Why do you need some divvy video before you can announce something the world and it’s mother already knows anyway.

Surely just wanky marketing to keep people and PR and marketing earning their pointless salaries a bit longer

It’s probably so that they dispel fake rumours about the player.

As well as what you say LTG, announcing a player as a confirmed signing means as well as terms being agreed with the selling club and player, it means there were no hitches with the medical.


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Post #414008  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 6:15 am 
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When we look at our transfer business we can’t forget Saliba. If we’d just signed a 21 year old, CB, 6ft 4 with pace and good technique and passing ability who had just got in the French league team of the year and won young player of the year we’d be hugely excited. We’d almost certainly had to pay £50/60m+ for that kind of player as well!


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Post #414009  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 6:55 am 
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dec wrote:
Hazuki wrote:
That's quite the leap there. Better to engage with what people are actually saying.

What I mean when I say I don't see much of a future with their team is that they don't have that special quality youngster behind Son and Kane - a Saka, Martinelli, Saliba etc. I doubt players like Richarlison and Bissouma become much better than their current level (and I would say the same for Gabriel Jesus) and I don't see Kulusevski becoming that player. You need more than good players to challenge Liverpool and City.

That being said, if one or two of their attacking players can raise their game a level or two, that would be huge for them.

"Better to engage with what people are actually saying." Both yourself and Rich described their transfer dealings as "must win now" and you literally said you don't see much of a future for their team. Yet it is some leap on my part to interpret that as criticism of their transfer activity?

Obviously, you have since expanded on what you meant by saying that you didn't see much of a future for them, namely that they haven't addressed replacements for Kane and Son.

In my view, they have bought a bunch of players in their mid 20s who have improved both their first team and their squad. Also, Kane is 28. He's younger than Thomas Partey. Son has just come off arguably his best ever season. It would be great if both of them declined rapidly, but we are likely years away from that happening.

Of course, it could all go pear-shaped on them, as they are Spurs after all.

I have a nasty feeling that is won't. Conte seems to know what he is doing. That fact that there seems to be none of the usual noise about Kane moving on is ominous, frankly. Spurs seem to have turned a corner.

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Post #414010  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 7:03 am 
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Rich wrote:
When we look at our transfer business we can’t forget Saliba. If we’d just signed a 21 year old, CB, 6ft 4 with pace and good technique and passing ability who had just got in the French league team of the year and won young player of the year we’d be hugely excited. We’d almost certainly had to pay £50/60m+ for that kind of player as well!

It’ll be interesting to see what happens with Saliba. Let me say I think Agbonlahor’s criticism of White is grossly unfair, but he certainly thinks Saliba should be in the team instead of him.

What worries me about Saliba is how willing he’ll be to sign a new contract at Arsenal. Might having joined three years ago and still be yet to make his first team debut have compromised his affinity with Arsenal? Hopefully I’m worrying unnecessarily but I don’t think it’s impossible that it could make it harder to get him to renew his contract.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailym ... aliba.html


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Post #414011  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 7:11 am 
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Decaf wrote:
dec wrote:
"Better to engage with what people are actually saying." Both yourself and Rich described their transfer dealings as "must win now" and you literally said you don't see much of a future for their team. Yet it is some leap on my part to interpret that as criticism of their transfer activity?

Obviously, you have since expanded on what you meant by saying that you didn't see much of a future for them, namely that they haven't addressed replacements for Kane and Son.

In my view, they have bought a bunch of players in their mid 20s who have improved both their first team and their squad. Also, Kane is 28. He's younger than Thomas Partey. Son has just come off arguably his best ever season. It would be great if both of them declined rapidly, but we are likely years away from that happening.

Of course, it could all go pear-shaped on them, as they are Spurs after all.

I have a nasty feeling that is won't. Conte seems to know what he is doing. That fact that there seems to be none of the usual noise about Kane moving on is ominous, frankly. Spurs seem to have turned a corner.

Sadly I agree with you Decaf. At this point in time I reckon Tottenham look more likely to secure a top four finish than we do. Obviously the transfer window still has two months to run and plenty can happen over that time to make me change my mind. But at the moment I’m not feeling that confident.


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Post #414012  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 7:48 am 
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Bernard wrote:
Rich wrote:
When we look at our transfer business we can’t forget Saliba. If we’d just signed a 21 year old, CB, 6ft 4 with pace and good technique and passing ability who had just got in the French league team of the year and won young player of the year we’d be hugely excited. We’d almost certainly had to pay £50/60m+ for that kind of player as well!

It’ll be interesting to see what happens with Saliba. Let me say I think Agbonlahor’s criticism of White is grossly unfair, but he certainly thinks Saliba should be in the team instead of him.

What worries me about Saliba is how willing he’ll be to sign a new contract at Arsenal. Might having joined three years ago and still be yet to make his first team debut have compromised his affinity with Arsenal? Hopefully I’m worrying unnecessarily but I don’t think it’s impossible that it could make it harder to get him to renew his contract.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailym ... aliba.html

I saw what Agbonlahor said, I find it strange the criticism White gets. I think he had a solid first season. I think people are judging him by the price tag and a lot of CB are judged against van Dijk
As for Saliba I think we messed up his 2nd year. 1st year was staying with st Etienne which was part of negotiation in getting the deal done anyway and the 3rd year at Marseilles was a roaring success. But last year needed to be his 2nd year. We also need to try to keep adding these ‘1year option’ in contracts so if players with 2 years left don’t want to renew we can extend by the year and give time to find a proper buyer


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Post #414013  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 7:51 am 
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Bernard wrote:
Decaf wrote:
I have a nasty feeling that is won't. Conte seems to know what he is doing. That fact that there seems to be none of the usual noise about Kane moving on is ominous, frankly. Spurs seem to have turned a corner.

Sadly I agree with you Decaf. At this point in time I reckon Tottenham look more likely to secure a top four finish than we do. Obviously the transfer window still has two months to run and plenty can happen over that time to make me change my mind. But at the moment I’m not feeling that confident.

Conte has got them ticking for sure. My 3 hopes for them is their very 1 dimensional game plan will be better snuffed out by teams next year who are better prepared for it. 2 that they surely can’t take 10 points from city and Liverpool again, and 3 hoping they lose lane and son for a period of games. I think if you took our best 2 players out of our team for the season and did the same for spurs we’d finish above them comfortably.


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Post #414014  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 8:06 am 
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Rich wrote:
Bernard wrote:
Sadly I agree with you Decaf. At this point in time I reckon Tottenham look more likely to secure a top four finish than we do. Obviously the transfer window still has two months to run and plenty can happen over that time to make me change my mind. But at the moment I’m not feeling that confident.

Conte has got them ticking for sure. My 3 hopes for them is their very 1 dimensional game plan will be better snuffed out by teams next year who are better prepared for it. 2 that they surely can’t take 10 points from city and Liverpool again, and 3 hoping they lose lane and son for a period of games. I think if you took our best 2 players out of our team for the season and did the same for spurs we’d finish above them comfortably.

We have to remember Kane had a poor start to last season. So much so that Tottenham fans I know were saying Levy should have sold him to City. And they still got fourth place above us. If he’s his normal self over all of next season, I’m not as confident as you even if he and Son miss a few more games.

EDIT: Let me say again, there’s still two months of the transfer window to go and plenty can happen over that time to make me change my mind. But as things stand, I’d say Tottenham are favourites to get a top four place over us.


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Post #414015  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 8:27 am 
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Up front spurs are vastly superior to us. Possibly the best striker in the world right now leading the line and now 2 international strikers as back up. Compare that to us and I think it gives them an edge personally. I think generally across other areas of our team we are better but such a crucial part of the pitch and in the premiership it’s always about the first goal.

I would say they have a slight edge and based on the transfer business we have done so far assuming we don’t get Raphina the other players we seem to be getting linked to probably wouldn’t swing it either. More power up front and more power in the middle of the park are required. Not sure if we are going to address this in this window


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Post #414016  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 8:36 am 
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Rich wrote:
Bernard wrote:
It’ll be interesting to see what happens with Saliba. Let me say I think Agbonlahor’s criticism of White is grossly unfair, but he certainly thinks Saliba should be in the team instead of him.

What worries me about Saliba is how willing he’ll be to sign a new contract at Arsenal. Might having joined three years ago and still be yet to make his first team debut have compromised his affinity with Arsenal? Hopefully I’m worrying unnecessarily but I don’t think it’s impossible that it could make it harder to get him to renew his contract.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailym ... aliba.html

I saw what Agbonlahor said, I find it strange the criticism White gets. I think he had a solid first season. I think people are judging him by the price tag and a lot of CB are judged against van Dijk
As for Saliba I think we messed up his 2nd year. 1st year was staying with st Etienne which was part of negotiation in getting the deal done anyway and the 3rd year at Marseilles was a roaring success. But last year needed to be his 2nd year. We also need to try to keep adding these ‘1year option’ in contracts so if players with 2 years left don’t want to renew we can extend by the year and give time to find a proper buyer


I don’t understand the white thing either. He’s a good player as far as I can tell, he’s probably not the defensive wall Gabriel is but he’s no absolute weak link. There seems to be an overly critical movement againest him because he’s something of a pretty boy (looks like a love island contestant) and the fact he’s very good on the ball for a centre half.

Also you are right on saliba. Sending him on loan fine, but sending him to one of Frances biggest historical clubs where his mate was to be playing who had recently been involved in a bust up and booted out. Just daft man management. The very worst. Surely a year on loan at a club like palace or Brighton would have been perfect or a stint at a lower tier Spanish club or even somewhere like rangers.


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Post #414017  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 8:48 am 
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If we end up signing that centre back Martinez chap who is only 5.7 tall I can only imagine the twitter social media meltdown that will occur if he gets out jumped for a cross.


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Post #414018  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 9:00 am 
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TOP GUN wrote:
If we end up signing that centre back Martinez chap who is only 5.7 tall I can only imagine the twitter social media meltdown that will occur if he gets out jumped for a cross.

Is he only 5ft 7ins? Effing hell, that’s even shorter than I realised. I’d assumed he must be about 5ft 9ins at least, which is still very short for a Premier League central defender.

Bloody Nora, if he’s 5ft 7ins then Warwick Davis could possibly out jump him (imagine a smiley here).


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Post #414019  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 9:19 am 
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Dan Ballard has joined Sunderland permanently after his move to somewhere else (i cna't recall) fell through at the last minute.

Undisclosed fee. I reckon it will be about £1-2m


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Post #414020  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 9:28 am 
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Bernard wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
If we end up signing that centre back Martinez chap who is only 5.7 tall I can only imagine the twitter social media meltdown that will occur if he gets out jumped for a cross.

Is he only 5ft 7ins? Effing hell, that’s even shorter than I realised. I’d assumed he must be about 5ft 9ins at least, which is still very short for a Premier League central defender.

Bloody Nora, if he’s 5ft 7ins then Warwick Davis could possibly out jump him (imagine a smiley here).

He is 5ft 9". He shows up as 1.75m tall which is 5ft 9". Still short for a CB but watch clips of him he is decent in the air


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Post #414021  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 9:45 am 
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Bernard wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
If we end up signing that centre back Martinez chap who is only 5.7 tall I can only imagine the twitter social media meltdown that will occur if he gets out jumped for a cross.

Is he only 5ft 7ins? Effing hell, that’s even shorter than I realised. I’d assumed he must be about 5ft 9ins at least, which is still very short for a Premier League central defender.

Bloody Nora, if he’s 5ft 7ins then Warwick Davis could possibly out jump him (imagine a smiley here).


5'9 actually (and no venereal diseases mentioned).

I can think of a few top CBs who were 5'10 or less. Puyol, Cannevaro, etc ... Can't think of any in the premier league.

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Post #414022  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:20 am 
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Decaf wrote:
Bernard wrote:
Is he only 5ft 7ins? Effing hell, that’s even shorter than I realised. I’d assumed he must be about 5ft 9ins at least, which is still very short for a Premier League central defender.

Bloody Nora, if he’s 5ft 7ins then Warwick Davis could possibly out jump him (imagine a smiley here).


5'9 actually (and no venereal diseases mentioned).

I can think of a few top CBs who were 5'10 or less. Puyol, Cannevaro, etc ... Can't think of any in the premier league.


Still a midget.

The shortest centre half’s I’ve seen play for Arsenal were Keown and Ben white who I think were both 6.1.

5.9 is really short. That’s even shorter than Steve nicol and everyone said he was small. Early ball goes in the box towards Kane or Calvert Lewin how is Peter Dinklage supposed to deal with it?


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Post #414023  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:49 am 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Early ball goes in the box towards Kane or Calvert Lewin how is Peter Dinklage supposed to deal with it?

Jump?


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Post #414024  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:51 am 
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Being short as a CB is obviously a disadvantage, but there's so much more to being good in the air than height. Timing, athleticism, positioning... I'd rather have a CB who's a little short but aggressive, quick and good on the ball than a donkey like Maguire who is tall and strong but can't play a pass longer than three yards or carry the ball ten yards without tripping himself.


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Post #414025  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:59 am 
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Hazuki wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
Early ball goes in the box towards Kane or Calvert Lewin how is Peter Dinklage supposed to deal with it?

Jump?

And hope the attacker doesn’t ?


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Post #414026  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 11:36 am 
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Take away Richarlison's penalties and Richarlison has a worse Premier League mins per goal ratio (286), than Chris Wood (284), Salomón Rondón (283) and Danny Welbeck (266).


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Post #414027  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 1:01 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Up front spurs are vastly superior to us. Possibly the best striker in the world right now leading the line and now 2 international strikers as back up. Compare that to us and I think it gives them an edge personally. I think generally across other areas of our team we are better but such a crucial part of the pitch and in the premiership it’s always about the first goal.

I would say they have a slight edge and based on the transfer business we have done so far assuming we don’t get Raphina the other players we seem to be getting linked to probably wouldn’t swing it either. More power up front and more power in the middle of the park are required. Not sure if we are going to address this in this window


I don't think so. Lewandowski, Mbape, Benzema even Song has been better this season.

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Post #414028  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 1:18 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Take away Richarlison's penalties and Richarlison has a worse Premier League mins per goal ratio (286), than Chris Wood (284), Salomón Rondón (283) and Danny Welbeck (266).

Good signing for Spurs, albeit quite expensive. Its ok to take a risk on a player like that when you have what spurs already has.

However, not the player I would want for us.

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Post #414029  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 3:18 pm 
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Rog - Problems logging in as advised but worked this time from iPhone.


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Post #414030  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 3:21 pm 
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Nightmares around passport renewal so I went early in the hope of getting away later in the year.

Renewed on line last Thursday - took 10 mins - new passport turned up this morning.

Johnson may be a tosser but that’s impressive.


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Post #414031  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 3:33 pm 
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Laptop is working now.

Richarlison has never impressed me. He flattered to deceive at Watford and he certainly hasn't kicked on at Everton. Remember Everton paid (up to) £50m for his potential and he's been sold on 3 years later for not a lot more. That's not career progression.

Have to say I've often been impressed by Bissouma but he had a sexual assault charge hanging over his head. He may have been cleared but it still takes the gloss off him. At a reported £25m, it seems to me that Brighton were keen to get rid of him.


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Post #414032  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 3:40 pm 
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Arsenal website
says Guendouzi stays at Marseille permanently.
Saliba back to Arsenal would be good business. Hope it happens.

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Post #414033  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 3:49 pm 
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Zed wrote:
Arsenal website
says Guendouzi stays at Marseille permanently.
Saliba back to Arsenal would be good business. Hope it happens.

Saliba's back at Arsenal, no?

Edit. He's been given the number 2 shirt.

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Post #414034  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 4:53 pm 
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DHD wrote:
Nightmares around passport renewal so I went early in the hope of getting away later in the year.

Renewed on line last Thursday - took 10 mins - new passport turned up this morning.

Johnson may be a tosser but that’s impressive.


Glad it worked out well for you. My missus had the opposite experience trying to renew her passport. The incompetence of the passport service was actually rather impressive.


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Post #414035  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 5:22 pm 
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Football history.

I’m on holiday in Oludeniz, Turkey, and this afternoon got chatting to an elderly Italian Juve fan who was in the stadium when Vaessen scored that goal.
I tried to tell him I was listening in my bedroom on BBC radio in Shrewsbury England, but I think that got lost in translation.

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Post #414036  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 7:37 pm 
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Links with Lille midfielder Amadou Onana, defensive midfielder 6ft 5" - that'll please some people!


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Post #414037  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 9:21 pm 
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Ornstein saying Utd are close to tying up a deal for Martinez. Just hope we have alternatives lined up as it seems we’ve missed out on two of our three key targets.

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Post #414038  Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:39 pm 
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Darren wrote:
Zed wrote:
Arsenal website
says Guendouzi stays at Marseille permanently.
Saliba back to Arsenal would be good business. Hope it happens.

Saliba's back at Arsenal, no?

Edit. He's been given the number 2 shirt.

Saliba's no 2 shirt number was leaked online Darren.

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Post #414039  Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 5:20 am 
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Just a hunch but honestly I could see Neymar ending up at Chelsea

There are no links about it at all but just strikes me as the type of thing that club would do. He’s pretty burned at PSG his wages are ridiculous. Many wouldn’t touch him.


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Post #414040  Posted: Sat Jul 02, 2022 6:39 am 
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Hazuki wrote:
Being short as a CB is obviously a disadvantage, but there's so much more to being good in the air than height. Timing, athleticism, positioning... I'd rather have a CB who's a little short but aggressive, quick and good on the ball than a donkey like Maguire who is tall and strong but can't play a pass longer than three yards or carry the ball ten yards without tripping himself.

The thing is, athleticism, timing and positioning can be attributes of taller forwards and central defenders going up for free kicks and corners too. A 5ft 9in Martinez with timing, athleticism and positioning against six foot plus opponents with timing, athleticism and positioning will be at a disadvantage.

Mind you, according to Darren’s post about Ornstein’s comments, it’s probably all academic anyway. I guess with ten Hag, Manchester United were always going to have the advantage getting Martinez. As Darren implied, with Raphina also likely to go elsewhere (everything I’ve read suggests we were o better than third in his preferred destinations behind Barcelona and Chelsea), two of our alleged big targets won’t be recruited.

Myself, I think the last two months of the transfer window are vital for Arsenal. That’s regardless of Jesus arriving, which I firmly expect him to. As things stand, we’re not only miles behind City and Liverpool, but I have little or no confidence of matching Chelsea, Tottenham and Manchester United. If Kroenke has made the funds to buy all these targets available, then I reckon Edu and Arteta May well have some questions to answer.

Things can certainly change over the reminder of the transfer window. For us I think they have to.


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