Fixtures Sunday April 28th - Tottenham Hotspur - Tottenham Hotspur Stadium - 2:00 Pm

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Post #422441  Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 1:43 pm 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
Okay the season just ended and although to me July 16th seems a long ways off when you have work to do, it seems like a somewhat short break to me for the squad. Yeah..yeah...we won't be playing starters and such but I always think the break seems rather short, even though it isn't. Plenty of time for a vacay for the players. But they have to be back in training when? Which really makes it a short break in my mind.

The season never really ends does it. This year for example the Nations League runs until late June.

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Post #422442  Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 4:08 pm 
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long time gooner wrote:
AmericanGooner wrote:
Okay the season just ended and although to me July 16th seems a long ways off when you have work to do, it seems like a somewhat short break to me for the squad. Yeah..yeah...we won't be playing starters and such but I always think the break seems rather short, even though it isn't. Plenty of time for a vacay for the players. But they have to be back in training when? Which really makes it a short break in my mind.

The season never really ends does it. This year for example the Nations League runs until late June.

LTG,
Yes indeed. Three of our guys have a call up. White, Ramsdale, Saka. Two matches June 4 and 7 to start. No rest for the weary.

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Post #422443  Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 4:35 pm 
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Zed wrote:
long time gooner wrote:
The season never really ends does it. This year for example the Nations League runs until late June.

LTG,
Yes indeed. Three of our guys have a call up. White, Ramsdale, Saka. Two matches June 4 and 7 to start. No rest for the weary.

I’m guessing, but don’t know, that others from our squad will feature for other countries.

I think that England play on 4th, 7th, 11th and 14th.

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Post #422444  Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 4:57 pm 
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https://theathletic.com/news/eddie-nket ... 5jLj6jRYf/

Looks like Eddie is staying!
Great news!


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Post #422445  Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 5:24 pm 
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long time gooner wrote:
Zed wrote:
LTG,
Yes indeed. Three of our guys have a call up. White, Ramsdale, Saka. Two matches June 4 and 7 to start. No rest for the weary.

I’m guessing, but don’t know, that others from our squad will feature for other countries.

I think that England play on 4th, 7th, 11th and 14th.

Meant to add that there are other players, depending on their country call-ups, will also be playing. Looked up the sumner matches and a through June, the starts again in September. These are just the group stages.

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Post #422446  Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 5:41 pm 
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david.d wrote:
https://theathletic.com/news/eddie-nketiah-arsenal-transfer/vNz5jLj6jRYf/

Looks like Eddie is staying!
Great news!

Ornstein just tweeted this also
Eddie Nketiah understood to have changed mind on leaving Arsenal. 22yo striker was set to go as free agent but now expected to sign new contract. Deal not finalised but duration likely to be up to 5 years

I think it is a good move. The risk is who knows whether what Eddie showed with 5 goals in 8 games at the end of the season was just the tip of what he can achieve or whether it was a flash in a pan.

As I said I think it is a good move, I think Eddie could play well wide left and wide right as well if we bought in a tall physical target man.

My only concern with Eddie re-signing is Arsenal may think they only need 1 striker signing this summer and that might be 'just' Jesus. I like Jesus but I'm not sure a set of strikers of Jesus, Nketiah and Martinelli at a push is enough for a European season. Add in an Abraham or Osimhen and we'd be looking exceptionally strong up front all of a sudden.

Bottom line is we could have lost Eddie for free when in the last 2 months his value is probably nearer to £30m. Young english forward who has proven he can score goals in this league - £30m would be the going rate


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Post #422447  Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 5:54 pm 
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Rich wrote:
david.d wrote:
https://theathletic.com/news/eddie-nketiah-arsenal-transfer/vNz5jLj6jRYf/

Looks like Eddie is staying!
Great news!

Ornstein just tweeted this also
Eddie Nketiah understood to have changed mind on leaving Arsenal. 22yo striker was set to go as free agent but now expected to sign new contract. Deal not finalised but duration likely to be up to 5 years

I think it is a good move. The risk is who knows whether what Eddie showed with 5 goals in 8 games at the end of the season was just the tip of what he can achieve or whether it was a flash in a pan.

As I said I think it is a good move, I think Eddie could play well wide left and wide right as well if we bought in a tall physical target man.

My only concern with Eddie re-signing is Arsenal may think they only need 1 striker signing this summer and that might be 'just' Jesus. I like Jesus but I'm not sure a set of strikers of Jesus, Nketiah and Martinelli at a push is enough for a European season. Add in an Abraham or Osimhen and we'd be looking exceptionally strong up front all of a sudden.

Bottom line is we could have lost Eddie for free when in the last 2 months his value is probably nearer to £30m. Young english forward who has proven he can score goals in this league - £30m would be the going rate

Abraham would fit the bill for me. Tall, great movement, and a natural goalscorer.

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Post #422448  Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 6:40 pm 
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Like I said at the weekend on Nketiah I thought so.

So basically there’s a couple of things you can probably glean from this.

The manager would prefer to invest in the midfield than totally reinforce his strike force because at 5 million signing on fee and 100k a week they could have let him walk. (I agree btw)

They can now go big on a striker if they want to. Personally like others have said here I’d go for Abraham who seems perfect (Arsenal fan, English, right age, height) . If he joined bizarrely we would have quite a British core (especially if we get hickey) which is something we haven’t had for years

I’m not totally DHD on this but I hope he proves me wrong. Over the last few weeks he’s showed more depth to his game but he’s still not quite there yet. I thought the Newcastle game showed that to be honest when we needed more connecting play.

I think it’s a good decision


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Post #422449  Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 7:08 pm 
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Reiss Nelson playing for Feyenoord tonight in the conference league final.


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Post #422450  Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 7:15 pm 
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Hoping for a Feyenoord win over Roma, game just started. Can't stand Mourinho. The guy is odious.

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Post #422451  Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 7:24 pm 
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Maybe the players had a shorter rest period in the past. I don't know. I do know (and you old vets can attest to this), they played a lot of games during the season, cup ties, replays. I recall looking at old games or reading about them and the number replays was rediculuous. I was amazed. And I recall a few of you saying how you could only use so many players in a game. Not as many subs. Crazy. Really hard men.

It's the same with the NBA and NFL, and other sports. The 'off season' (time between seasons) was much, much longer in the old days. The NFL season pre season started hmm...late July, early August I think, don't quote me. League play started in September and the Super Bowl was over be the 2nd week in January. If your team didn't make the playoffs your season ended by first week in December. NBA started autumn, ended by May. Super Bowl is now creeping into March. The league expanded 2 more games. Its a physically taxing sport, players are visibly much bigger and faster these days. Nearly 300lb line men nearly as quick off the mark as scrum halfs to borrow a rugby position (which I'm hoping I got right...haha).

It just seems players are playing almost all year round. Many of them. The various organizations. PL, UEFA, FIFA don't seem to care. It's all a money grab. More games, more money. The CL reorganization seems to be about two things only, getting as much money as possible by adding in more teams while making sure only the most popular teams progress or if they are having a bad season, be in the final of a lesser competition.

What happened to the football I fell in love with?

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Post #422452  Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 8:39 pm 
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Really? Ya think? Investigation? Should have been cleared up in 2 minutes worth of video.

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/61584400
Patrick Vieira: Football Association to take no action after Crystal Palace manager's altercation with fan

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Post #422453  Posted: Wed May 25, 2022 9:11 pm 
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Definitely over did the opioids today AG


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Post #422454  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 3:35 am 
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I'm hoping and if I were Arteta or someone else in management above him, I'd go to the Kroenke's and tell them that (whether I believed it or not) "We were hair close to getting 3rd. If we had spent in January its by belief we would have gotten 3rd. We need to spend. The clubs above us, next to us and just below us are spending. Its the reality. We have a few targets in a few positions I think will at the very least keep us as strong challengers, because we will be challenged and Newcastle will join that group. Anyway, in order to get CL football and the MONEY that comes along with it we need to spend big."

Let's not be deceived. The Kroenkes fully understand that. I've stated on here a few times how they have spent big on the Los Angeles Rams and seen their investment come to fruition. The Rams are playing for the title or are at least title contenders annually now.

Los Angeles is also a great city to recruit players to come to live in (although the city is dying in my opinion). London is the same and we should use London as a selling point. Anyway, the Kroenkes fully know spending is a risk but can be yield results. If they don't spend big its because they simply don't care enough.

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Post #422455  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 3:35 am 
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Hated to see Mourinho win but he is the king of the cup finals.

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Post #422456  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 8:59 am 
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Must admit I don’t mind Mourinho. Don’t get me wrong, I think the game routinely outgrows managers as well as players. I think that process is happening with Mourinho and has been for a few years. So I wouldn’t want him as Arsenal’s manager. Either now, in the future, or anything but the distant past.

But his comments were always focussed on Wenger, rather than having a go at Arsenal as a club. I went off Wenger myself towards the end of his time at Arsenal so I never got angry about Mourinho slagging off Wenger. I used to do it myself.

My feelings towards Wenger have grown more positive since he left. I respect the way he’s kept away, and hope he continues to do so. I do wonder if part of Manchester United’s current problems relate to Ferguson not letting go. He’s always there, watching games like some retired Mafia boss who won’t let his successors make their own decisions.


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Post #422457  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 9:11 am 
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Bernard wrote:
Must admit I don’t mind Mourinho. Don’t get me wrong, I think the game routinely outgrows managers as well as players. I think that process is happening with Mourinho and has been for a few years. So I wouldn’t want him as Arsenal’s manager. Either now, in the future, or anything but the distant past.

But his comments were always focussed on Wenger, rather than having a go at Arsenal as a club. I went off Wenger myself towards the end of his time at Arsenal so I never got angry about Mourinho slagging off Wenger. I used to do it myself.

My feelings towards Wenger have grown more positive since he left. I respect the way he’s kept away, and hope he continues to do so. I do wonder if part of Manchester United’s current problems relate to Ferguson not letting go. He’s always there, watching games like some retired Mafia boss who won’t let his successors make their own decisions.

The Manchester United situation is like the post Busby era except that the shadow seems to be there for very much longer.

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Post #422458  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 9:58 am 
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long time gooner wrote:
Bernard wrote:
Must admit I don’t mind Mourinho. Don’t get me wrong, I think the game routinely outgrows managers as well as players. I think that process is happening with Mourinho and has been for a few years. So I wouldn’t want him as Arsenal’s manager. Either now, in the future, or anything but the distant past.

But his comments were always focussed on Wenger, rather than having a go at Arsenal as a club. I went off Wenger myself towards the end of his time at Arsenal so I never got angry about Mourinho slagging off Wenger. I used to do it myself.

My feelings towards Wenger have grown more positive since he left. I respect the way he’s kept away, and hope he continues to do so. I do wonder if part of Manchester United’s current problems relate to Ferguson not letting go. He’s always there, watching games like some retired Mafia boss who won’t let his successors make their own decisions.

The Manchester United situation is like the post Busby era except that the shadow seems to be there for very much longer.

Fair point.


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Post #422459  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 10:17 am 
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Bernard wrote:
Must admit I don’t mind Mourinho. Don’t get me wrong, I think the game routinely outgrows managers as well as players. I think that process is happening with Mourinho and has been for a few years. So I wouldn’t want him as Arsenal’s manager. Either now, in the future, or anything but the distant past.

But his comments were always focussed on Wenger, rather than having a go at Arsenal as a club. I went off Wenger myself towards the end of his time at Arsenal so I never got angry about Mourinho slagging off Wenger. I used to do it myself.

My feelings towards Wenger have grown more positive since he left. I respect the way he’s kept away, and hope he continues to do so. I do wonder if part of Manchester United’s current problems relate to Ferguson not letting go. He’s always there, watching games like some retired Mafia boss who won’t let his successors make their own decisions.

I think this is a decent post with a lot of truths. United aren’t helped by the stench of former players slagging off the club and talking about their time and experiences giving it the big un.

I do think Arsenes exit since his dismissal has been graceful and respectful bar a couple of comments he made. I’d have no problem him acting as some kind of ambassador for the club

The way united replaced Ferguson was sheer lunacy. Letting him pick his own successor. Just bonkers

Anyway they are in the *%^@ and long may it continue. Hopefully that new bloke signs a complete load of old duffers from the Dutch league and screws up. His biggest problem is ronaldo where he is damned if he does or doesn’t. If he moves him in he’s liable to get slagged off but he probably needs to do this. If he plays him the team suffers. It’s going to be *%^@*** hilarious


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Post #422460  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 10:43 am 
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Just listened to Nketiah on the beautiful game podcast. Worth a listen If you get time.

Came across as a well grounded lad but said he and all his family have been Arsenal fans all their lives and the only thing he ever wanted was to be Arsenals centre forward. It was recorded pre his recent run in the side and he talks about playing minutes a lot. You can’t help feel pleased for the kid knowing since then he’s played all the games.


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Post #422461  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 1:45 pm 
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https://tbrfootball.com/report-says-alv ... -25m-move/


Please no
Please no
Please no


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Post #422462  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 1:54 pm 
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david.d wrote:
https://tbrfootball.com/report-says-alvaro-morata-now-very-close-to-joining-arsenal-in-25m-move/


Please no
Please no
Please no


I find that one pretty hard to believe. Surely unlikely. Unless Arteta does want 2 strikers in addition to Nketiah as he’s pretty cheap


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Post #422463  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 2:22 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
david.d wrote:
https://tbrfootball.com/report-says-alvaro-morata-now-very-close-to-joining-arsenal-in-25m-move/


Please no
Please no
Please no


I find that one pretty hard to believe. Surely unlikely. Unless Arteta does want 2 strikers in addition to Nketiah as he’s pretty cheap

I just dont rate him.
Age profile just seems out of sync with our recruitment drive.
He is hardly prolific either.


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Post #422464  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 2:47 pm 
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America is irreparably broken. She has passed the proverbial 'Rubicon' towards assured decline. The only areas globally where mass shootings on this level and this frequency are normal to all of us are: America, Nigeria, Afghanistan, Israel/Occupied countries and less than a handful of other places. Any similar event in any developed, G20 nation would and have galvanized the nation into collective action. Political, cultural, class divisions set aside. New Zealand, Finland, Austrailia, France, Japan to name a recent few in modern times.

But not America. The aforementioned nations only needed one event. No nation at the level America is ever lasts with such events continually. A peace has to be made. Ireland, the UK comes to mind.

As the political divisions continue and there are as bad as I've ever remembered or in history since the Civil War. Even in the build up to the Civil War, the business of running the country was still adhered to. These days? Republicans routinely run for office with a platform of not ever compromising with or working with Democrats. It's impossible to run a nation that way. But, we are at that stage. Mitch McConnell, the Senate majority leader while Obama was in the office, bragged publicly about telling Obama when they met after Obama hadn't even warmed his seat that he would not work with him on anything. Not that he wouldn't work with him on things his party didn't agree with, no, with ANYTHING. Even things he may even support. They'd vote for it if something they were for was up for a vote and fell into their laps but as far as constructing, etc? No. They'd critique it from the sidelines and that's it.

The Democrats are the most imcompetent at politics. The Lincoln Project, Republicans who are fighting the party since it embraced Trump and have run ads against Republicans, have commented that the Dems can't follow simple political strategies and they end up snatching defeat from the jaws of victory. Sanders polled very well against Trump in both the 2016 and 2020 elections but the Dems backed 2 candidates the Dem masses didn't want. Hillary Clinton and Biden are beholden to the corporations and special interests (so are the Republicans) and the masses dying in debt, undercut by every turn by the Amazons of the world, wanted someone who would fight for them. But the party machine wanted to serve their paymasters and chose someone who would do just that.

This fall the Democrats will lose and lose big. It won't be pretty. They will lose both houses of Congress and after 2024, we will see Republicans in complete control of the country, top to bottom. Not only will they have the White House, the entire Congress they will likely have before all is said and done, 7 of the 9 Supreme Court justice and the majority of them have no intention of honoring precedence, the Constitution or protecting the reputation of the court as unbiased. Not only that, 28 of the 50 states have Republican governors but my guess is they will get 35 to 38 or 39 governorships over the next 4 years or so.

What will the Republicans do with all that power? They will do what either party has done. They will abuse it. Republicans abuse it by granting the rich so much unregulated freedom, they end up creating a economic bubbles that eventually explode. Its happend every time in the last 100 years, with only one exception. The 'Ike' years of the 1950s (specifically 1952-1960) and the reason it ended well was because Eisenhower ran the government like he ran his army. It lived no more, no less on what it needed. He was the one that warned about the power of the 'Military-Industrial Complex'.

Anyway, my guess from what I can see from present trends, events is that there will likely be a massive economic crash of Great Depression proportions before the end of the decade. The Democrats will react by wanting to write checks to everyone, damn the national debt or how they will pay for it. The Republican masses will become unhinged and react how they have for the last 20 years: mass shootings. To whom they will direct their animosity to? Take your pick: elected officials, immigrants, Blacks, Gays, liberals.

China will emerge the new world leader. Russia will become an ally to check China and we'll look the other way of internal abuses in Russia and probably the other way as they reconstitute the old Soviet bloc by force. India will join this alliance as it has a regional concern. Pakistan will play both sides possibly.

America will be balkanized. Even up to the point where the red states, especially those that are adjacent like the deep south, will be similar somewhat to Kurdistan in Iraq. Techinally under the auspices of the Iragi government but in actuality autonomous.

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Post #422465  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 5:14 pm 
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david.d wrote:
https://tbrfootball.com/report-says-alvaro-morata-now-very-close-to-joining-arsenal-in-25m-move/


Please no
Please no
Please no

Yeah another ex-Chelsea player.
Meanwhile, Rabiot just might go to either Spurs or Chelsea.

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Post #422466  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 5:34 pm 
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'Goodfellas' actor Ray Liotta died in his sleep in the Dominican Republic. Age 67. He was filming a movie there called Dangerous Waters. RIP

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Post #422467  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 7:02 pm 
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Villa have so far signed Coutinho permanently, Boubakar Kamara on a free and now reached an agreement with Diego Carlos the Sevilla CB….on top of Digne and Chambers in January and a big spree last summer with Buendia, Bailey, ings and Ashley young all joining. A big offset is the Grealish transfer though.

A couple of points:

It must be a worry for other leagues that players are switching from top 3-4 teams in those leagues to join 14th in the Prem

There are a number of players in that list who will be on very big wages due to their age or free transfer status as well as the status of the teams they’ve come from no doubt paying them high previously. Villa must be absolutely smashing their total wage outlay. But also could find themselves having problems in the future, as we know to our cost old players with big wages is not an easy problem to solve if their performance drops


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Post #422468  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 7:08 pm 
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I’ve sen us linked once again to Aouar. His price is dropping rapidly. French media say he’s available for £12m. He’s about to turn 24. It’s the sort of gamble someone could take and be handsomely rewarded if he refunds his form….or mildly put out if he doesn’t. £12m is nothing in today’s market


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Post #422469  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 7:19 pm 
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Here are some per 90 minute stats and where that ranks in percentile (closer to 100 is better) for a striker we’ve been linked with. Would you have him at Arsenal?


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Post #422470  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 8:44 pm 
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Rich wrote:
I’ve sen us linked once again to Aouar. His price is dropping rapidly. French media say he’s available for £12m. He’s about to turn 24. It’s the sort of gamble someone could take and be handsomely rewarded if he refunds his form….or mildly put out if he doesn’t. £12m is nothing in today’s market


For that kind of money I can also see West Ham, Newcastle, Villa, Tottenham, Leicester going for him. We have a higher profile than all of them and I'd include Tottenham. I still think we have a bigger rep internationally.

Seems we are starting a bit early on a few contracts as well.

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Post #422471  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 8:54 pm 
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3 of the most important deals we can do this summer are extending the contracts of Saka, Martinelli and Saliba. I think all 3 have 2 years left on their deal this year. 3 year extensions for all would secure their futures


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Post #422472  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 9:15 pm 
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33 years ago today (shouldn’t be any need to say what was). 3 months from being a quarter of a century. Gulp. Mind you, getting old is better than the only alternative.


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Post #422473  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 10:26 pm 
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Bernard wrote:
33 years ago today (shouldn’t be any need to say what was). 3 months from being a quarter of a century. Gulp. Mind you, getting old is better than the only alternative.

Er, so maths is not your strong point :42laughter:


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Post #422474  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 10:31 pm 
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Terry Henry wrote:
Bernard wrote:
33 years ago today (shouldn’t be any need to say what was). 3 months from being a quarter of a century. Gulp. Mind you, getting old is better than the only alternative.

Er, so maths is not your strong point :42laughter:

In what way? 26 May 1989 to 26 May 2022 is 33 years isn’t it? A third of a century is 33 years and 3 months isn’t it?

EDIT: Sorry, I get what you mean. I meant to say a third of a century not a quarter. Incompetence using the wrong word more than faulty maths.


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Post #422475  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 10:52 pm 
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Bernard wrote:
Terry Henry wrote:
Er, so maths is not your strong point :42laughter:

In what way? 26 May 1989 to 26 May 2022 is 33 years isn’t it? A third of a century is 33 years and 3 months isn’t it?

EDIT: Sorry, I get what you mean. I meant to say a third of a century not a quarter. Incompetence using the wrong word more than faulty maths.

Good thing you caught that. The 1/3 of a century that is, mother a 1/4 century. Was sort of wondetong that myself.... :8surprise: :angel4:

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Post #422476  Posted: Thu May 26, 2022 10:54 pm 
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Zed wrote:
Bernard wrote:
In what way? 26 May 1989 to 26 May 2022 is 33 years isn’t it? A third of a century is 33 years and 3 months isn’t it?

EDIT: Sorry, I get what you mean. I meant to say a third of a century not a quarter. Incompetence using the wrong word more than faulty maths.

Good thing you caught that. The 1/3 of a century that is, mother a 1/4 century. Was sort of wondetong that myself.... :8surprise: :angel4:

Edit: supposed to be 'not a 1/4 of a century' and wondering not wondertong.... :14laughter:

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Post #422477  Posted: Fri May 27, 2022 12:50 am 
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Zed wrote:
Bernard wrote:
In what way? 26 May 1989 to 26 May 2022 is 33 years isn’t it? A third of a century is 33 years and 3 months isn’t it?

EDIT: Sorry, I get what you mean. I meant to say a third of a century not a quarter. Incompetence using the wrong word more than faulty maths.

Good thing you caught that. The 1/3 of a century that is, mother a 1/4 century. Was sort of wondetong that myself.... :8surprise: :angel4:

It was only after I’d done my first reply to Terry Henry that I noticed I’d somehow used the word quarter rather than third. Incompetence or carelessness I guess, as I’d actually been talking to my wife about it being three months off a third of a century just before I did the post. Indeed, it was my chat with her that made me do the post.

I also chatted (by text) this evening about it being 33 years to an Arsenal supporting friend who didn’t go to the game with me as he decided to watch it at his family’s home with his dad, who was terminally ill with cancer. The friend was a regular home and away fan like me. Says he doesn’t regret his decision not to go because when Thomas scored the winner, despite being terminally ill his dad (also a lifelong fan) somehow found the strength to get up and celebrate the goal.

My friend said if he’d gone to Anfield with me, he’d have never shared that moment with his dad.


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Post #422478  Posted: Fri May 27, 2022 1:44 am 
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I was never there but when I see the videos of it I feel like I were.

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=704931333892630

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Post #422479  Posted: Fri May 27, 2022 1:51 am 
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Rich wrote:
3 of the most important deals we can do this summer are extending the contracts of Saka, Martinelli and Saliba. I think all 3 have 2 years left on their deal this year. 3 year extensions for all would secure their futures

Unless I hear any evidence that supports why we risked losing him by never playing him (we could have used him instead of Holding), that even Henry has commented, if he leaves, its self inflicted mistake.

Saliba is one of the big mysteries I am hoping the documentary solves.

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Post #422480  Posted: Fri May 27, 2022 2:09 am 
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Translation of la Liga comments: "Only we are allowed to offer insane contracts because we have Real Madrid and Barcelona who are above mere football"

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/61598269

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