In many ways that game is the perfect recipe of Arsenal frustration over the last 6 years.
Start the game too slowly
Lose second balls to a more determined but less skilled opponent
Create hardly anything
Don’t test their gk with enough shots on target
Clear game changing decision from the ref against us
Clear cut chance missed
Wonder goal to win it for them

Repeat

And how many good performances in that run? I don't think we looked particularly convincing against Newcastle or Watford, they're just very poor teams. Against Crystal Palace and Brighton we were poor. Against Tottenham, Aston Villa and Leicester we were excellent. Sometimes it's okay to get a win even when not performing well, but when it becomes the norm rather than the exception, it's obvious it won't last in the long run.

That’s the third clear red card not given to our opponents this season. McArthur deciding volleying Saka was better than the ball, Evans fouling Aubameyang who had a clear goal scoring opportunity and this the worst of the lot for a stamp to the face.

Yep. Why did we tune in again? I was young and carefree at five minutes to eight this evening.

I’m not loyal to Arteta, I’m not even convinced he’s the right man I thought the substitutions were *%^@*** stupid today and not for the first time either. However there’s no point sticking your head in the sand. No manager gets us in the top 3 with this squad it is so young inexperienced and naive.

I saw the same xhaka strolling round the pitch I’ve seen before for 2 other managers. Aubameyang and Lacazette are past it I’m afraid. That doesn’t change if you replace the manager.

Match winners ? Be honest is there a single attacker in our squae you wouldn’t swap son or Kane for.

Arteta needs to be more proactive, he needs to learn how to manage a game aggressively. Change things earlier when things are not going to plan, shake things up.

The bottom line is we need to start creating more chances........somehow, because every team in the PL has players who cant hurt you at any moment and it is incredibly difficult to keep clean sheets.

I was very frustrated by the Man U game as it was an opportunity to show we were making serious progress under Arteta and instead it showed up our weaknesses at the highest level. Tonight's match was an opportunity to show that we have the fortitude to bounce back in a potentially tricky game. If you want to be generous you could say this young Arsenal team is a work in progress, but tonight I'm left (again) with the feeling that Arteta is probably not the man for the job.

That’s also true. This team clearly needs to mature a lot. Arteta too, but with a decent striker in the style Arteta wants you’ve got to think this team has got an upward trajectory. It’s just deciding if the team can actually achieve that, and then if the decision is made it’s not going to happen with Mikel then we need to get someone else in ASAP. But I’d rather wait for the right guy than “GET RID” now. How’s that going to work?

Who picks xhaka? Arteta. Who sets the tactics? Arteta. No one is suggesting we should be top 3, certainly not me, but I think we should be more consistent, more positive and less predictable and challenging for the fourth place in the league. All of these characteristics are symptomatic of a good manager. Arteta doesn’t have the capability to get the best out of the players he has and that makes him not good enough for Arsenal.

I gave up my season ticket when Wenger ruined our club and I won’t be getting it back until we have someone in charge who might lead us to something better. Arteta is not that person

If you want examples of that, you just have to look at our best performances this season - against Tottenham, Aston Villa and Leicester we came out on the front foot and allowed ourselves to dictate the play by showing more energy and determination than our opponents. Liverpool and Man City are not great teams only because of their quality, but because they constantly outwork their opponent, and it's the same reason why West Ham are much higher up the table than they should be when looking at their squad. It's just something you need to do regardless of the quality of players you have, and we rarely manage to do it.

Were desperately lacking any kind of centre forward who can give us the basics, or even just contribute to the attacking phases of play. Look how many dangerous moments richarlison had tonight, there are strikers up and down the league who would instantly improve us and I’d include strikers like Che Adams and Alan Armstrong at Southampton who we face next. Watch them give our defence more basic problems than our strikers do their defence

I thought we would lose this match one nil so i'm not especially surprised by tonight's loss. But what I found really frustrating and depressing is that when Everton began to dominat the 2nd half Arteta seemed unable to change it.

It’s not a given we should be competing for 4th with this squad. You must see that right ? Give klopp, guardiola or anyone the job and they would struggle.

Where’s our salah, ronaldo, de bruyne or Lukaku. We just don’t have players of that calibre right now.

If we are lower than 7th by the end of the season he has to go but it’s not an easy task and I’m telling you right now swapping the manager out won’t correct some of the horrendous *%^@ your seeing

Given the money we've spent we should be competing for at least top 4 but we’re not. Who’s fault is that? The man who picks the players to buy and then trains them. I also fundamentally disagree with your premise that Klopp or Guardiola( or Conte, Tuchel or Rangnick for that matter) would not be doing better with the players we have but that’s a matter of opinion.

I will be astonished if we make top 8, let alone top 6 with the level of performances we’re producing. I think it more likely we will finish around 10th and for a team of our pedigree and wealth that’s not acceptable.

I hope I’m proved wrong

This sound stupid but it feels like all our worst performances this season have come in games when we’re the only game on at that time and we’re also on TV, usually away from home with a late kick off so the home fans can be extra up for it. Brentford, city, Liverpool, Man U, Everton all for this.
I’ve felt for years that I hate us being live on tv for away games on the Saturday morning or evening slot or the Monday night game. We always lose!

We had to stretch 150 million across 6 new players when Chelsea can spunk 100 on just 1.

Which of those signings we made were bad? We still need another 3 core players.

The bloke inherited the biggest mess of a squad I’ve ever seen. You must get that wholesale repairs in several positions were required. Right back especially. That money wasn’t wasted but has highlighted that wholesale change was required.

I didn’t say the purchases were bad, I said Arteta is mismanaging them and I stand by that. He has been financially supported in the pursuit of a a better squad and he hasn’t managed to get a tune out of them. Of course we’re not Chelsea ( or city or Newcastle or utd) but we’re not Norwich either. We’re not going to agree on this so there’s little point in debating it further. I hope you’re right and Arteta comes good but I very much doubt that’s going to happen. If he doesn’t another completely *%^@ season beckons

I have to agree AndyB. The squad as it stands is:

Keepers: Ramsdale, Leno, Okankwo
Right backs: Tomiyasu, Maitland-Niles, Cédric
Left backs: Tierney, Tavares, Kolasinac
Central defenders: White, Gabriel, Holding, Mari, Chambers
Central midfielders: Partey, Lokonga, Ødegaard, Xhaka, Maitland-Niles, Elneny
Wide players: Saka, Smith Rowe, Martinelli, Pépé
Strikers: Aubameyang, Lacazette, Balogun, Nketiah

I’ve included Maitland-Niles in two positions, right back and midfield. So there’s 27 different players in the squad. I think there’s a weakness in the forwards with Aubameyang so off form, with seven goals so far and only four of those in the Premier League. But Kane is giving Tottenham an even worse problem as he’s only scored one goal and is presumably playing useless to make Levy let him leave.

But I agree. There are quite a few managers who could get fourth spot with that squad. Not just the likes of Klopp, Guardiola and Tuchel but also Conte, Moyes, Rodgers, Gerrard and Potter. I really hope we sign a top forward in January. If we do, Arteta will have no excuses left. If we don’t sign another forward, questions have to be asked about Arteta’s man management of Aubameyang and Lacazette to make them so poor or demotivated.

Then there’s his style of football. It not only rarely works, it’s routinely a more effective sleeping pill than the commercially available ones.

Can you actually write some of this tripe and believe it. Oh boo hoo we only had 150 to spend. I look at other squads and see how they perform with lesser players. There is a problem. It is the manager.

Worst thing is that this result has undermined any progress thus far. Confidence will now be low and given Everton's form of late, every team in the league is now thinking to themselves that they can beat us.

Unrelated to what you're saying in your post above, but I was musing about the 'young team will improve over time' argument. Technically true but if Arsenal don't appear to be going places, and quickly, then all those promising young players will just bugger off and we'll find ourselves in a perpetual rebuilding process.

Like who specifically ? Because bar West Ham I only see the usual big suspects above us in the league with a lot of football to play this season.

Win, lose or draw you slag the manager off anyway so it doesn’t matter

The negatives are apparant and doesn't need repeating. But I'll throw in 1 or 2 that may not have been discussed by fans. Only Tottenham has scored less than we have in the 7 in the table. Only Man Utd have given up more goals. Trying to eke out some positives about us right now. I'll try but I may fail in the process.

1. We lost 2 games in a row and are still very much in the race for top 4.
2. A loss is a loss but we played better in the last 3 losses than we did in the first 3 losses.


Other thoughts. Xhaka. There are 3 positives I can think of about him. He distributes fairly well, has leadership qualities. He seems very well respected among the players. I'd like to see it in the games more. It seems like he's a leader in training, the dressing room but I don't see it on the pitch. There was a spell we were trying to waste time to hold on to a win and there were a half hour or so left in the game. We didn't start playing till they equialized. If this leadership attribute is a positive, and if its not being seen in the game, then replace him. Third, he has a booming shot from distance that he rarely uses. He had 166 appearances, 163 shots taken, 48 of whom are on target. https://www.premierleague.com/players/1 ... haka/stats

We are a glorious mess. The upside potential is glaring. On paper the defense is good quality wise. Smith and Gabriel are solid defenders. Partey, while, not living up to the hype I thought is still a solid defensive midfielder. We have good full back options on both sides, Ramsdale and Leno are good.
But defense is a team sport. Especially a pressing defense. Lucky bounces and deflections can happen but its not that with us. Its fundamentals. It shouldn't be but is.

Spurs next few games in the league are Brighton away , Leicester away, Liverpool then West Ham

We have Southampton. West Ham, Leeds and Norwich. In the same period. All winnable

Spurs still have to go to old Trafford, the eitihad, king power and anfield in the league.

Man uniteds next 2 games are away. In march their fixtures are city spurs and Liverpool. They also have to come to our place in April and Arteta has only ever lost to them once last week to a gift of a Penalty

You would be foolish to suggest everything is lost to a point of disposing of a manager right now. Absolutely foolish. It’s all to play for after a run of very hard games.

Our game against spurs in January will be key. Lose that one and I think you have issues

Just look at Evertons last 7 games and tell me that all those teams have better players than us. Look at Brighton and Palace who we failed to beat. Brighton took points off Liverpool but we just surrendered even before a ball was kicked. Looking at the Spurs squad it is pretty ordinary. You are backing the manager. He is the one who wanted Partey purchased and Aubameyang contract extended. But what he wants is ‘yes’ men who actually lack spine and are too scared to try anything different.

It doesn’t matter who is in the forwards if the ball hardly ever gets into the area. You want to spend money but I am not even sure he has an eye for players. We don’t have mid week games because of him so there are no excuses of being overplayed. The Man U & Everton game had all the symptoms of Olympicos and Villarreal. Games for the taking. But see the problem is that the squad has changed dramatically and our style of play and mental application are the same. So who is to blame. Places 5-6 should be easily within our grasp but not with erratic decisions like Arteta makes. Winning all our games to Christmas is easily achievable but the manager needs to do something about our style of play. Leading a game and then fading away has been a problem and he appears incapable of fixing it which is his job. And Arteta apologists are part of the problem.

The only 2 sides above us you can make an argument of saying we have a better squad than which are West Ham (who are there on merit) and possibly Spurs. So on the basis they can be caught as we have easier fixtures what are you harping on about and isn’t a dose of realism required.

There’s no point in speaking to you about it because you’re warped and gain satisfaction from our defeats so I won’t indulge you further.

You’re simply an internet agenda fan. Weirdos on the internet hoping we llose to prove themselves right.

You know what it may come apart and we finish lower than 7th in which case I’ll be wanting a change but it hasn’t yet.

I heard Neville and Carragher both say they were convinced Godfrey meant to stamp on Tomiyasu, I agree, I don’t necessarily think he meant to stamp on his face but he meant to get him. I read a good way of looking at it which said if that was his teammate on the floor rather than an Arsenal player would his studs have ended up in his face?! No chance. Anyone that has played football knows that you can avoid putting your foot somewhere very easily if you are willing to try. Shameful, disgraceful decision not to send him off. Along with the Palace and McArthur one I think they cost us 5 points from those 2 games.

I think if we had our strikers playing anywhere near where they can we have a squad that could challenge for 4th, but only on the basis that West Ham have a thin squad as I think they’re starting 11 has a better balance, and on the basis that Spurs are about the same as us (bar two match winners as you said). Man U have a better squad and will probably get 4th now they’ve got rid of Ole
However there is still lots that will need to change and will change with that squad. You don’t need a 2nd 11 all at top 4 quality but you do need 6 or so who could feasibly play 25 games and be good enough for a top 4 team. Liverpool lost 3 CB and went from a title winning squad to scraping top 4.
Leno won’t stick around for long as No.2
Kolasinac is off and is barely midtable as a back up. Cédric is also not good enough
Mari I don’t think is good enough and if we had to play Holding for a full season I don’t think we’d make top 4
Chambers have never proven himself any better than mid table at best
Elneny is off and Xhaka was all but out the door last year and we’ve never finished top 4 with him at the club
AMN is a good utility player but I doubt we’d get top 4 if he had to start 25 games
Pépé doesn’t look like top 4 material
And in the next 12 months we’re looking at losing lacazette, Nketiah and Aubameyang

That’s 13 of the 27 man squad. Now not all need to go but the vast majority of that 12 will be off or need to be gone.

I also think that Arteta should be getting more from what he has, certainly more attacking football. I don’t think you have to come down 100% on one side or the other of we’re blaming Arteta or the quality of the squad

Football 365 on the Everton crowd and Richarlison
“They cheered effort and crunching tackles in the absence of quality and slowly dragged that quality from the players as the game went on.
Richarlison was the epitome of that – his desire was unmatched by anyone on the pitch and in doing the simple, unflashy things, he found himself in positions where his skill almost had no option but to eventually pay dividends.”

Both points I made last night. We allow a home crowd to desperately cheer anything and get their team going, our passive approach gives encouragement in spades. And Richarlison did all the things our forwards fail to do. If we had Richarlison as our main striker we’d be 6-9 points better this season I’m convinced of it. I’d probably say the same for Watkins, Antonio, and any number of forwards at non big 6 clubs who just do the basic things you expect from a CF.

Artera to Wenger “Yes we’d love you come back and be around the club. And you’ll notice that it’s just like you’d never left”

Agree with that, there's still some squad building to be done and this summer shows we're on the right track with our recruitment. But it's just hard to say Arteta is performing at anywhere near the quality required when it comes to getting the best out of what we've got. Our squad being young is an excuse that only goes so far; no matter the average age of the squad, we still should be getting more than a good performance every three games from this group.

If we compare to West Ham, it's clear that Moyes is making them perform better than just being a sum of their part. I mean, which of their players would be a target for the bigger clubs? Declan Rice is the only one, I don't see any of the big six lining up to recruit Antonio, Soucek, Bowen or Fornals. They're simply much better managed than we are.

This is the point I was trying to make last night. We tore Tottenham, Leicester and Aston Villa apart at times, and it happened because of the desire and intensity we showed which allowed our quality to shine. When watching most of our games, and listening to Arteta analyzing them, it sounds like we're waiting for the good performances to come, and sometimes they do and sometimes they don't. It's not going to just happen, we need to realize it happens when we make it happen.

West Ham are a weird phenomena right now.

I have several mates who follow them and even there own fans know it won’t last and are laughing about it.

Maybe United should reappoint Davey Moyes again eh? Nope I can’t see it either. Maybe we should !

When Leicester won the title we should have poached Ranieri. No ? What do you mean.

It’s possible for anyone’s confidence to build and have their day in the sun.

How much more money are we going to throw at this before we get to the real problem? You can chop and change what you want but this manager isn't good enough.

New striker
Experienced creative player in the final third to support saka and Smith Rowe
New passing midfielder to help partey

Not much will change until you get those 3 in. Moan, chastise hell even set fire to yourselves lads


That said we can still achieve a reasonable finish despite people’s compulsive behaviour about the manager.

I think the solution is pretty simple.

1. Stop giving the ball away stupidly
2. Keep Ødegaard or anyone from midfield scoring
3. Give Aubameyang some confidence.

And we’ll easily make top 4.

but it doesn't do any good for the heart rate / stress levels after such a performance to do your approach the "Oh we have a young squad full of promise and Mikel given a chance I'm sure will turn things around ''

with a couple of harps and Chilean pipes playing softly in the background

No no no ... shove three Lucky Strikes in your gob , light up , rip your shirt off ; go outside and smash yourself around with a birch branch for half an hour in -17 temperatures like Haz does

....or alternatively say Arteta you are a stupid clueless mealy mouthed dickw%%$$#ker who'd be out of his depth coaching the Under 6's .... much better approaches .

Why on earth does Nketiah who wont sign a contract keep getting a start in front of Balogun ...?

Let's not set the bar too high here Granty Boy

Possession: Everton 36, Arsenal 64%



… it’s the final third lads. We’ve refreshed our whole side except wengers 30 plus strikers and you can moan all you want about the manager motivating people and that bollocks but aubameyang not even working their keeper with that final chance was *%^@*** criminal and no manager can legislate or deal with that by any means other than dropping the stupid *%^@ (if you have a replacement)

If we had a fit Danny Welbeck in our squad he would be getting a lot of football right now

I was seething last night.
Just as i was against Utd.
Still pissed off today.
I’m 51. Supported this great club for 42 years and defeats still get under my skin and really hurt.
Arteta disgusts me with his negative football , cautiousness , *%^@*** ego and treating certain players like *%^@. Say what you like about Pépé but no player deserves that sort of treatment.
Just pure *%^@*** spitefulness from Arteta and we have seen it before with Saliba.
What sort of message does it send to AMN and Sambi that they have great games recently then are dropped to the bench. They then see Xhaka waltz back into the team after a LONG injury.
He is not even softly introduced from the bench. He is put STRAIGHT IN.
What sort of utter foolery is that and if you are AMN or Sambi why on earth would you want to play for this *%^@*** *%^@???
It’s like one of those movies you have seen a million times before.
We play a *%^@ team in crisis and you just know we will lose to them and give them a piggyback back up.
We play backwards and sideways awful bland football.
We go a goal up and play with fear and sit back.
It was so obvious Everton would equalise and then you start fearing a winner and hey presto , here it is!
Please Please get this fraud out. To think i was excited by his appointment but yesterday was truly the end game for me.
We will probably beat Southampton but west ham no chance on the basis of these *%^@ performances.
The season can still be rescued. Get Arteta the *%^@ out.
Step forward Graham Potter.
He has Brighton punching above their weight and playing good football.
Imagine what he could do with us.

Pépé on the right when Eddie goes on. Oh if looks could kill...