You can add Partey to that list.

Elneny? Why?

Doesnt really matter is we lose 5 or 6

Partey didn't look fit. J get the impression he has been rushed back.

The type of defeat which might halt our recent momentum. We look lightweight going forward

Because any Arsenal fan who has watched these 2 this season at the emirates knows they have been dire.

It’s a question nobody is asking anymore and is frankly boring

If I’m Pépé or Martinelli I thinking I don’t even get a chance when other players play shite. Not good management.

Saka on heroin is better than martinelli.

Got it yet ?

No it’s not, Saha and Emile Smith Rowe have been shite 2nd half. Is Arteta intent on playing the same eleven every game with no consequences if players play shite

Brighton drew here.

Important to remember these took man it's apart at old Trafford. Arsenal are miles away from the finished article but we have chosen this path so need to expect slow progress with plenty of backward steps. I don't think Arteta is the right man but he should be given time.

Good point

passing accuracy is the key , Liverpool do far less work ... our overhit wayward efforts mean we expend so much more energy trying to win the ball back

Not pretty to watch but we have a very young side and Klopp has had a few more years to perfect their style .

Hopefully lessons will be learnt , Tavares in the reserves for the next twenty years would be a good start

Do *%^@ off top gun with your patronising and sarky comments. Don’t be a wanker all your life, have a day off.

Let's face it, Arsenal are a perennial soft touch for the big guns. Put this lot, Man City or Chelsea in front of them and it's brown trouser time.

Do you think bringing on Pépé fixes this ? Hell obviously shore it up. The game is lost

Mate it’s a clueless comment.

Progress doesn’t need to be measured by the result, more how well we have expressed ourselves and coped under pressure. Neither had been anywhere near good enough today.

You’re daft comments are frankly clueless and out of touch with how Arsenal fans feel.

Hope for your sake you don’t put that to the vote. Elneny has been rightly frozen out and is gone from the club at the end of the season when his contract is up. I think it’s a perfectly fine point to bring on players who might actually have a future at the club.

AMN was already on the pitch ?

Who else can he bring on to shore it up Pépé?

Pathetic.

Why is it pathetic? Obviously bringing on an attacker isn’t a move to shore it up. I’m done anyway. You’re awful to talk to.

Elneny is the only sub then proving you’re comments daft.

Maybe he should have brought on holding let’s put that to a poll

Hmmm .... for Arse supporters I'd advice against throwing a noose over the rafters or contemplating disembowlment with the blunt bread knife .

Liverpool are a very good football team , many will point to them being beaten by West Ham , held by Brighton whoever but these sides are probably better organised than we are .

We are a very young side and have been getting some credible results of late but we are still a work in progress .

We keep picking up points against the majority of teams losing to Chelsea , Man City and Liverpool is not the end of the world .

…but we should have brought on martinelli in the 85th minute

Getting a better striker is priority. Aubameyang is past it.
If one of Martinelli, Balogun or Nketiah has promise, Arteta should give them much more game time.

If not for Ramsdale, we could have lost 7 or 8 nil. Pool cut through our midfield too easily. And our defensive shape was easily breached. The coaching team should use this game as a key learning video. No doubt Lokonga and Tavares aided too many of their attacks too.

Ode is still too lightweight to be our creative mid. Not someone I would want to depend on.

Ah well, not the end of the world for us. I think we can still aim for 4th.

you don't let up

Gidday G7 ..... it a collective thing not a question of Ødegaard too lightweight Aubameyang passed his best , swap both of them into a Liverpool shirt and they'd have performed well .

We need to function as a team , everybody playing their role .
When you display as many weaknesses / basic errors as we did today the introduction of Messi , Ronaldo in their prime wouldn't have made any difference .
Liverpool's play today is a model we should aspire to .
The spat between Arteta and Klopp seemed to galvanise them into action we were quite comfortable up to that point .

The bottom line is that I don’t think Arteta is tactically up to it. Even when we are in trouble he is incapable of making a change in tactics. How we react from here is a real test of the team and manager.

Theres no obvious omission from our starting 11 that fixes defeats like that right now. You can only moan about the manager so much. It’s not like messi is being ignored on the bench.

It is what it is and the fans that go week in week out largely understand our predicament and the ones that don’t moan about substitutions and nonsense. It’s quite hard to listen to but the divs and weirdos on the internet need to understand we ain’t sacking our manager right now if he’s in 5th position. We just don’t have enough options in the squad to change things.

Condolensces John .... My father was quite distant so his passing was though sad a more ho hum affair ......... you were by contrast close ; so rejoice in the fact you have a treasure trove of great memories .

At 96 he had a damn good "innings "

So, if you aren't one of the 60,000 fans who go to games each week you can't understand the game or voice an opinion. What an absolute load of snobbish arrogant misguided bollocks.

There's millions of Arsenal fans around the world, many of whom who have forgotten more about the game than some of the wealthy newbies who have replaced the working class fans actually know.

Nobody is saying that making substitutions would have won us the game or even nicked a draw, but what they are saying is that when you are 2-0 down and your forward line is misfiring badly then anything is worth a go. Pépé and Martinelli are basically being frozen out leaving us with zero attacking options off the bench bar Nketiah who is leaving in the summer or sooner anyway.

Aubameyang and Pépé go to AFCON for at least a month in Jan. What the *%^@ happens then? Throw Martinelli in even though you've barely given him any minutes and his confidence and match fitness is absolutely drained. Doesn't sound like much of a plan.

You must have a problem with your education. Did I say anything about the starting line up. When we were overwhelmed he simply had no plan B. The same happened against Leicester. We had a great start and then we’re overwhelmed but our defence held firm. Change formation, move players around : swap Saka and SR or bring on Pépé. His persistence with Aubameyang in games like this is a real problem. As I said I will give him to the half way part of the season, but I know they will keep him on and from this position nothing less than a Europa place is good enough. Did you read the bit that says let’s see how we react from this. That’s when we will know if we are making the progress required.

Unfortunately true though, freaks on the internet and their weird views don’t reflect those of fans where I sit in my block or generally in the match going fanbase so their weird views carry no relevance at all as far as I’m concerned. Few think like this and there is actually a lot of goodwill towards this young team and manager inside the emirates so basically you can get *%^@** !

As for martinelli I live in hope but he rarely does anything when he’s on the pitch anyway so why does it matter to bring him on when we are getting our a****** podgered without lube!!!

I mean *%^@*** hell you have to pick your best players and Lacazette will have to fill in or something in January but frankly there’s nothing more pathetic right now than weirdos on the internet blaming our defeats on martinelli not starting or coming on it’s a *%^@*** pathetic joke.

Like I said if you have no other options in the squad how can you change it. You didn’t read the post properly.

… oh and don’t say bringing on Pépé changes things it would do *%^@ all and we both know that. Our best 11 lost

There is no way to sugar coat sh*t and pass it off as anything else. Same about a 4-0 loss, unless you are San Marino playing at France (or England). That said, as bad as a 4-0 loss is, it wasn't a game where I could say we didn't seem to show up or gave up.

At the risk of making excuses, Salah is the best player in the world at the moment in most people's opinion. The quality throughout that side is of the highest order and when they are up for it, at home, there aren't too many sides that will come there and get anything out of the game.

Fact is, both sides are at totally different levels. Liverpool is getting back to its old form from a couple years ago and we are still in building mode. We have moved up a level since the start of this year. Since last year truth be told as well. But we are still a work in progress and these are reminders the road is long and will be bumpy.

A coach said once that when you play against a side that is much farther above you in quality, you play your smartest players because any mistakes will get punished and if you are going to get something out of the game you have to have an almost perfect game without mistakes. And whomever has the ball the most has to be the smartest player over the most skillful. In football, the players in the middle of the pitch who the ball goes through (in basketball the point guard is that player for example of another sport).

My guess (or hope) is we'll see a much different game on the return match. I also won't be convinced we have turned the corner until we put a whole season together...hmm..no two seasons, so its not a one off.

Sidenote, Chelsea are looking stronger than I have seen them for ages.

Paddy is doing a great job at Palace. 'Only' 2 losses. Drawing too many games but he's not losing. Gotta learn how to put games away.

John my deepest condolences to you and your family at your sad loss.
Your dad sounds like a top guy and it's great you had a great relationship.
It's the same with my Dad and I.
He passed away in 2010 and we were extremely close.
He loved The Arsenal and my love of Arsenal was from him. One of my proudest moments was taking Dad to a couple of matches at the Emirates during his regular visits from Ghana.
We have to treasure our moments with Our Fathers.
Take care John.

The Man Utd game will be a better test than the Liverpool game. Liverpool, Chelsea are on another stratosphere it seems right now.

I cannot believe that had we won yesterday we would have gone above Liverpool
How often has that possible outcome presented itself recently.
Definitely a sign of progress but we were schooled yesterday in the 2nd half. We did well in the first half and looked quite comfortable holding them but we looked toothless up front.
Saka wasnt his usual self and didn't really attack their defence as he is easily capable of doing. Smith Rowe was anonymous but we have to cut these 2 some slack as they have largely been brilliant this season.
Bit surely if not clicking up front then change it no?
One thing Pépé and Martinelli will give you is a bit of pace, trickery and direct running at defences.
If current attacking set up is not working then change it up and give your opponents something different to think about.
Anyway it's done let's move on and make sure we beat Newcastle next week.
Great west ham and utd lost.
Liverpool will do that to many teams.
Salah is just such a slippery **** and Mané doesn't let up and is a sly git as well.
They are hell to play against when in this mood.
Ramsdale was brilliant again.
Could have been 6 or 7.

I disagree. Was it the season we lost 6-2 or was it 8-2 to United that we went on and won the league, or was I dreaming?

This will put people's feet back on the ground. Make us play better. Liverpool always pull a brilliant game out of the bag against us there aren't many teams that would have not lost to them in this form, they were awesome much as I hate to say it.

Everyone knows our problem now is up front. I believe most want Aubameyang and Lacazette moved on as soon as possible and a new front 2 bought or brought on. For me it would be Balogun and Nketiah week in week out till they click then *%^@ me we'll be so proud of OUR team.

Partey is a problem methinks is it fitness or not quite what we need, We have the attacking options now we need a Kante or a Bissouma to shut things down and win games for us.

Thanks Gaz

Thanks Soc