Supporters Forum

socrates · **#489921**

gooner7 wrote:

socrates wrote:

With only a month left of the window it is hard to see how we are going to get all the players we want out of the door, bar virtually giving them away or sending them out on loan whilst paying a large chunk of their wages.

I don't blame Edu either, what's he supposed to do. Trying to get a decent fee for average players on very high wages in a depressed market. Not an easy thing to do.

But he should take the blame for Willian, squarely on his shoulders, that one

Hi g7,

Was it Edu, though, I read somewhere that it was Arteta who insisted on Willian.

long time gooner · **#489922**

Rich wrote:

Arsenal.com has 29 first team players officially listed. For a club with no Europe I'd say that is about 6 too many.

Kolasinac and Torreira are the two most obvious to leave without requiring a need to be replaced. You could also say Nelson, Nketiah and AMN are in the same boat. Then one of the 3 right-backs we have to leave also. That brings the squad down to 23 and broadly speaking is 2 players for every position and 3 GKs which feels about right.
You could probably argue Willian could leave and not need replacing but as the squad stands he's probably the back up No.10 to Emile Smith Rowe.

So based on that 23 and in an ideal world youd have
Willian leaving, new No.10 coming in
Cédric leaving, new RB coming in
Runarsson leaving, new back up GK coming in
Elneny/Xhaka leaving, new CM coming in
and an argument for Lacazette leaving, new striker coming in

Do anything close to that with some good quality coming in a=then Arsenal's transfer window would be a 9 or 10/10 in the circumstances.

Still got this player on my mind. I’ve just looked on the Arsenal site for the ‘players’. No mention of Balogun at all. He looked like a prospect and Arsenal fought to get him to sign a new deal. So where does he fit in?

long time gooner · **#489923**

Here’s hoping…..

https://newsjust24all.com/arsenal-put-7 ... d-wldkGtpc

TOP GUN · **#489924**

gooner7 wrote:

socrates wrote:

With only a month left of the window it is hard to see how we are going to get all the players we want out of the door, bar virtually giving them away or sending them out on loan whilst paying a large chunk of their wages.

I don't blame Edu either, what's he supposed to do. Trying to get a decent fee for average players on very high wages in a depressed market. Not an easy thing to do.

But he should take the blame for Willian, squarely on his shoulders, that one

But to go back to Socrates point what’s edu supposed to do ? He’s offered an international winger for free and the alternative is signing nobody. It hasn’t worked out but beggars can’t be choosers right ? We seem forced to make decisions out of necessity.

As rich eloquently illustrated in an earlier post we need about 5 new players. 3 desperately too. There’s only so much money.

Rich · **#489925**

TOP GUN wrote:

gooner7 wrote:

But he should take the blame for Willian, squarely on his shoulders, that one

But to go back to Socrates point what’s edu supposed to do ? He’s offered an international winger for free and the alternative is signing nobody. It hasn’t worked out but beggars can’t be choosers right ? We seem forced to make decisions out of necessity.

As rich eloquently illustrated in an earlier post we need about 5 new players. 3 desperately too. There’s only so much money.

I think the Willian decision has to be looked in the full cost of his transfer. £0 fee but probably a healthy signing on fee due to player and agent plus £150k a week for 3 years which is probably somewhere in the region of £30m total. Could that have gone on a younger player for £15m fee and half the wages, so the same outlay. Perhaps the club (probably rightly) saw Willian as as much of a guaranteed success as we could find. If he'd done for us last year what he'd done for Chelsea on average over the last 5 then the signing of him would have been fine. The problems come when the age and wage of these players it simple has to work or your stuck. If that was a younger player that didn't work there is an exit strategy

david.d · **#489926**

long time gooner wrote:

Rich wrote:

Arsenal.com has 29 first team players officially listed. For a club with no Europe I'd say that is about 6 too many.

Kolasinac and Torreira are the two most obvious to leave without requiring a need to be replaced. You could also say Nelson, Nketiah and AMN are in the same boat. Then one of the 3 right-backs we have to leave also. That brings the squad down to 23 and broadly speaking is 2 players for every position and 3 GKs which feels about right.
You could probably argue Willian could leave and not need replacing but as the squad stands he's probably the back up No.10 to Emile Smith Rowe.

So based on that 23 and in an ideal world youd have
Willian leaving, new No.10 coming in
Cédric leaving, new RB coming in
Runarsson leaving, new back up GK coming in
Elneny/Xhaka leaving, new CM coming in
and an argument for Lacazette leaving, new striker coming in

Do anything close to that with some good quality coming in a=then Arsenal's transfer window would be a 9 or 10/10 in the circumstances.

Still got this player on my mind. I’ve just looked on the Arsenal site for the ‘players’. No mention of Balogun at all. He looked like a prospect and Arsenal fought to get him to sign a new deal. So where does he fit in?

Hi LTG
Balogun is still showing under the Academy list.
You are right we did fight hard to get him to sign a new contract.
What reassures me is there is no way he signs that contract if he doesnt receive certain assurances.
He has definitely been promoted to the first team squad so assuming our website has not been updated yet.
Couldnt understand either the links to Tammy Abraham when we have Balogun waiting in the wings.
If Lacazette leaves then i want a more established striker than Abraham coming in.

I like Xhaka but i was looking forward to a new midfielder coming in to replace him with maybe more mobility and pace.
Happy to keep him but would like to see Azeez promoted to the squad maybe at the expense of Elneny.
I love Elneny's professionalism and attitude but if we can get a fee for him he should be moved on and his spot given to Azeez who is definitely more pregressive playing wise.

Rich · **#489927**

As much as Ben White will really add some much needed pace and passing ability from the back the signing I'm more excited about right now is Lokonga. Possibly because we've lacked a player with his skillset (however raw right now) in the central midfield for some time. Whilst we have had players in defence with White's skillset they were just flawed in other ways.

Lokonga has a fluent grasp of English as well which will make the adaption easier. 21 years old, has already been captain of his last club, on the fringe of an excellent national team, physical, quick, mobile, sharp, short and long range passing, head up play and looking to move the ball forward quickly. Love all of this.

Rich · **#489928**

Harry Kane was due back at Spurs training today and has not shown up. That is a pretty big and public statement.

We've been here before with players demanding to leave, its not nice as a fan and the club need to make the best long term decision - if there is £100m plus on the table from City then they need to take it and move on. It is something I wished we'd done with Sanchez for example.

Spurs digging their heels in and having an unhappy Kane being forced to stay would be excellent news for us.

gooner7 · **#489929**

socrates wrote:

gooner7 wrote:

But he should take the blame for Willian, squarely on his shoulders, that one

Hi g7,

Was it Edu, though, I read somewhere that it was Arteta who insisted on Willian.

Hi Soc, I might have been mistaken. I did read somewhere too that Edu got the deal going. Perhaps I was trying to connect Brazilian to Brazilian. My bad.

AmericanGooner · **#489930**

Fact is we have marginal players on high wages and trying offload such players often if not usually ends up with us being stuck with a player on high wages and him knowing he's not wanted.

It may be best to bite the bullet, sell at whatever we can get, get there wages off the books, take a loss and on a go forward basis make a better effort of offering 'smarter' wages. The time to sell 120k a week Bellerin was a few years ago.

Rich · **#489931**

AmericanGooner wrote:

Fact is we have marginal players on high wages and trying offload such players often if not usually ends up with us being stuck with a player on high wages and him knowing he's not wanted.

It may be best to bite the bullet, sell at whatever we can get, get there wages off the books, take a loss and on a go forward basis make a better effort of offering 'smarter' wages. The time to sell 120k a week Bellerin was a few years ago.

It is a difficult position and not one uncommon to other clubs, one look at Chelsea's expanded squad list at the weekend shows you they have an even bigger list of failed signings on big wages that they can't shift. Man U are similar. The difference for those clubs is they can afford to dump these players on loan or keep them well away from the first team without getting any revenue from them and without it effecting their transfer plans to strengthen the squad.

Each case needs to be looked at in isolation and on its own merits.

For example, selling Xhaka for £12m now and only having that money to spend on a replacement will make us weaker next year. However, if we only had £23m left in our budget and our primary midfield target was going to cost us £35m then accepting a low offer for Xhaka to facilitate the move for the main improvement we want in midfield would be worth it.

It also applies to players like Lacazette with only 1 year left on their deal. Lets say we're only being offered £10m for Lacazette, for me I would forego the £10m and keep Lacazette and let him leave for free next year because having him contribute for 1 more year is worth more to us than having £10m in the bank.

Rich · **#489932**

So to call it early, If Partey is out injured for a period of time I think this will be our starting 11 for the first day of the season:
Leno, Chambers, White, Mari, Tierney, Elneny, Xhaka, Pépé, Smith-Rowe, Aubameyang, Lacazette

If it is I'll find it pretty underwhelming because for whatever reason it won't have addressed the main weaknesses or balance in the side.

long time gooner · **#489933**

Rich wrote:

So to call it early, If Partey is out injured for a period of time I think this will be our starting 11 for the first day of the season:
Leno, Chambers, White, Mari, Tierney, Elneny, Xhaka, Pépé, Smith-Rowe, Aubameyang, Lacazette

If it is I'll find it pretty underwhelming because for whatever reason it won't have addressed the main weaknesses or balance in the side.

I must admit I hadn’t been anticipating a Elneny Xhaka partnership to kickstart our new season after all the supposed activity.

Nor for that matter a Lacazette Aubameyang partnership.

Where’s Gabriel?

socrates · **#489934**

It feels like this transfer window is beginning to fizzle out. Lots of encouraging links with quality players but no real substance to the rumours and we can’t shift anyone making it incredibly difficult both economically and numerically to bring any targets in.

We have put a number of players up for sale but there is no money in Europe or the PL and the best we can realistically do is to drop the asking price so low as to make it a no-brainer for potential buyers or send them on loan and pay a large chunk of their wages.

The other side of the coin is that those who do have money and don’t need to sell before buying are in a great position to buy players who may normally be out of their reach and/or shop around for bargains.

Spurs and Villa could do a lot of damage in this market if they get £100m for Kane and Grealish.

tomc · **#489935**

long time gooner wrote:

Rich wrote:

So to call it early, If Partey is out injured for a period of time I think this will be our starting 11 for the first day of the season:
Leno, Chambers, White, Mari, Tierney, Elneny, Xhaka, Pépé, Smith-Rowe, Aubameyang, Lacazette

If it is I'll find it pretty underwhelming because for whatever reason it won't have addressed the main weaknesses or balance in the side.

I must admit I hadn’t been anticipating a Elneny Xhaka partnership to kickstart our new season after all the supposed activity.

Nor for that matter a Lacazette Aubameyang partnership.

Where’s Gabriel?

That would be a very underwhelming first 11, not least because it's obvious to the world and his wife that Lacazette and Aubameyang in the same team, with Aubameyang out on the left, does not work.

warrior · **#489936**

long time gooner wrote:

Is that you trying to get around the time limit on replies by posting in the future?

:toothy9:

I've made a short video explaining the new time limit feature here - Hope it's helpful:

https://youtu.be/RXJKdh1KZ0w?t=44

gooner7 · **#489937**

warrior wrote:

long time gooner wrote:

Is that you trying to get around the time limit on replies by posting in the future?

:toothy9:

I've made a short video explaining the new time limit feature here - Hope it's helpful:

https://youtu.be/RXJKdh1KZ0w?t=44

Gaz from Oz · **#489938**

warrior wrote:

long time gooner wrote:

Is that you trying to get around the time limit on replies by posting in the future?

:toothy9:

I've made a short video explaining the new time limit feature here - Hope it's helpful:

https://youtu.be/RXJKdh1KZ0w?t=44

Great post

Lincoln gooner · **#489939**

warrior wrote:

long time gooner wrote:

Is that you trying to get around the time limit on replies by posting in the future?

:toothy9:

I've made a short video explaining the new time limit feature here - Hope it's helpful:

https://youtu.be/RXJKdh1KZ0w?t=44

Interesting to hear that side fumbling has been effectively reduced. I'd never have thought that possible.

david.d · **#489940**

Very strange.
The squad has clearly been updated as it shows White , Tavares and Lokonga but Balogun is not showing as being in first team squad.
He has clearly been promoted so why still show him in the academy??

LTG did point out yesterday he was slightly off the radar.
I really hope he gets chances this season to really push Lacazette and Aubameyang.
Sounds crazy but was really expecting more movement with Lacazette and Eddie gone to open the door a bit more ajar for Balogun and freshen up our striking options a bit. Just seems a bit stale.
Have really high hopes for Balogun and really don't want Abraham anywhere near Arsenal if it means it blocks Balogun's progress.
I hope Arteta is fair and gives him minutes if the senior strikers are not doing it.

Frustrating the likes of Kolasinac and Bellerin are still here.
I can deal with Xhaka not going because he does give us something but those two need to go.
Really need a good keeper to challenge Leno as well.
Was hoping for more of a refresh but what can you do if there are no buyers

Bernard · **#489941**

Gaz from Oz wrote:

warrior wrote:

I've made a short video explaining the new time limit feature here - Hope it's helpful:

https://youtu.be/RXJKdh1KZ0w?t=44

Great post

The bloke might just as well have been speaking in Russian for all the sense it made to me.

warrior · **#489942**

Bernard wrote:

The bloke might just as well have been speaking in Russian for all the sense it made to me.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turboencabulator

Gaz from Oz · **#489943**

Is it okay to now be worried about our failure to significantly improve the squad or is it still plenty of time to the start of the season and Arteta has it under control. I still expect another attacking midfielder but it’s starting to be tight on time to get them playing with the team.

long time gooner · **#489944**

Gaz from Oz wrote:

Is it okay to now be worried about our failure to significantly improve the squad or is it still plenty of time to the start of the season and Arteta has it under control. I still expect another attacking midfielder but it’s starting to be tight on time to get them playing with the team.

Given that it seems to take about 3 weeks from a player being spoken of us ‘definitely coming’ to their actual arrival I hold out no hope.

So far this transfer window has been immensely disappointing and offers little hope for the season to come. More of the same looks to be the order of the day.

TOP GUN · **#489945**

It’s a quite simple problem really.

The club only has about 70 to 100 million to spend each summer but probably needs to spend 250 million to get the team competing at the highest level again.

It’s not going to happen and *%^@ me it’s depressing. There are too many problems to fix.

You can debate the fine details of it all and attribute blame if your frustrated which is understandable but I doubt our fortunes will turn around until a new owner arrives. I mean *%^@*** hell We are about to start another premier league campaign without a backup keeper or competent right back never mind midfield.

Gaz from Oz · **#489946**

Just watched a 30 minute program on the undefeated season. I feel like weeping about our current team.

TOP GUN · **#489947**

long time gooner wrote:

Gaz from Oz wrote:

Is it okay to now be worried about our failure to significantly improve the squad or is it still plenty of time to the start of the season and Arteta has it under control. I still expect another attacking midfielder but it’s starting to be tight on time to get them playing with the team.

Given that it seems to take about 3 weeks from a player being spoken of us ‘definitely coming’ to their actual arrival I hold out no hope.

So far this transfer window has been immensely disappointing and offers little hope for the season to come. More of the same looks to be the order of the day.

Would you agree the signings we have made are promising though ? I think so. Just not enough.

We are like a faulty version of software that constantly needs to be patched and no sooner has one thing been fixed something else crops up.

TOP GUN · **#489948**

Newcastle happy to offer 22 for willock

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/20 ... ted-leave/

Will probably have to sell him to fund a back up keeper

long time gooner · **#489949**

TOP GUN wrote:

long time gooner wrote:

Given that it seems to take about 3 weeks from a player being spoken of us ‘definitely coming’ to their actual arrival I hold out no hope.

So far this transfer window has been immensely disappointing and offers little hope for the season to come. More of the same looks to be the order of the day.

Would you agree the signings we have made are promising though ? I think so. Just not enough.

We are like a faulty version of software that constantly needs to be patched and no sooner has one thing been fixed something else crops up.

I would agree. They are fine in themselves but serve to highlight just how far away we are from being competitive again.

Rich · **#489950**

TOP GUN wrote:

Newcastle happy to offer 22 for willock

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/20 ... ted-leave/

Will probably have to sell him to fund a back up keeper

I find it crazy to think Arsenal are looking to spend significant money on a back up GK. Go and find another loan or a GK with not long on his contract. We need an experienced pro who can step in and do a job. A loan would be ideal because it means we can shelve the issue for another 12 months.

If we decide £22m for Willock is enough - I think we should be pushing for more then all that money should be invested back in to a central midfielder.

Given how much playing time Nketiah, AMN and Nelson will get we need to find willing buyers for all of them and ship them on. We should be able to generate £35m from those 3 I reckon, that can buy you a very good attacking midfielder (Aoaur available for £25m) or put a chunk of it towards a competent right back.

long time gooner · **#489951**

Yay! Some good news. Hopefully it’s not AFC being unduly optimistic. https://newsjust24all.com/partey-injury ... jJimdfhcKY

Rich · **#489952**

Former England U18's manager Kevin Betsy is appointed as Arsenal's new U23 manager. It has been rumoured for some time. I don't know anything about him but it seems those that do consider this a very good appointment.

Bernard · **#489953**

TOP GUN wrote:

You can debate the fine details of it all and attribute blame if your frustrated which is understandable but I doubt our fortunes will turn around until a new owner arrives.

That I do agree with you about. Sadly I don’t expect Stan (as the sole owner of KSE) to sell anytime soon. Indeed, my own guess is that our next owner will be Josh, who I’m assuming he’ll leave KSE to in his will. Or perhaps he’ll leaves it to his wife Ann and she’ll let Josh run things.

Some may think things will improve then. I’m not so sure. The only thing Josh, as far as I can see, may be better at than Stan is saying the right thing publicly. His announcements are often more positive about building the club to compete at the highest levels again.

Myself, I see Josh’s comments as little more than verbal diarrhoea. They are always qualified by his father aiming for exactly the same thing, and what a great job the Kroenke family is doing as owners. Understandably too, as Josh isn’t going to say his father’s a rubbish owner and things will change when Stan snuffs it.

Sure, it’s been said here recently that Arsenal spend a lot of money on new players. Compared to most we do. But Arsenal should do because it’s one of the richest clubs in Europe through its own resources. The size of its worldwide fan base, and from that filling a very big stadium with people willing to pay high ticket prices, its commercial potential, sponsorship revenues, television income and so on. Added to which the Kroenke family is one of the wealthiest owners in football.

Bloody right we should spend a lot of money on players. That’s why I get frustrated when people say Arsenal don’t have the money to compete at the highest level again. It almost sounds like an excuse. With the club’s own resources and the owner’s wealth, Arsenal should have the funds to challenge at the very top of European football. It’s just Kroenke doesn’t let it.

TOP GUN · **#489954**

Bernard wrote:

TOP GUN wrote:

You can debate the fine details of it all and attribute blame if your frustrated which is understandable but I doubt our fortunes will turn around until a new owner arrives.

That I do agree with you about. Sadly I don’t expect Stan (as the sole owner of KSE) to sell anytime soon. Indeed, my own guess is that our next owner will be Josh, who I’m assuming he’ll leave KSE to in his will. Or perhaps he’ll leaves it to his wife Ann and she’ll let Josh run things.

Some may think things will improve then. I’m not so sure. The only thing Josh, as far as I can see, may be better at than Stan is saying the right thing publicly. His announcements are often more positive about building the club to compete at the highest levels again.

Myself, I see Josh’s comments as little more than verbal diarrhoea. They are always qualified by his father aiming for exactly the same thing, and what a great job the Kroenke family is doing as owners. Understandably too, as Josh isn’t going to say his father’s a rubbish owner and things will change when Stan snuffs it.

Sure, it’s been said here recently that Arsenal spend a lot of money on new players. Compared to most we do. But Arsenal should do because it’s one of the richest clubs in Europe through its own resources. The size of its worldwide fan base, and from that filling a very big stadium with people willing to pay high ticket prices, its commercial potential, sponsorship revenues, television income and so on. Added to which the Kroenke family is one of the wealthiest owners in football.

Bloody right we should spend a lot of money on players. That’s why I get frustrated when people say Arsenal don’t have the money to compete at the highest level again. It almost sounds like an excuse for being careful. With the club’s own resources and the owner’s wealth, Arsenal should have the funds to challenge at the very top of European football. It’s just Kroenke doesn’t let it.

Really good post Bernard

if your mates support a different club tell them how much you pay for your season ticket and their eyes fall back into their heads I guarantee you. Now tell me Arsenal shouldnt be able to acquire the best players.

We also change our kit every season now fleecing the fans with kids like myself with exorbitant costs on an annual basis.

Baby josh when not eating crayons can at least pretend he cares about the club whilst making mistake after mistake. Would it hurt him to say look Dad we make 70 million in share profits each year but can we chuck the club that 70 to invest this year as they are totally screwed.

Rich · **#489955**

I think the last few weeks of the window will be a hive of scrambled activity. Lots of clubs in Europe are up to their necks in debt because of covid and desperately need to sell someone. They will want the best possible price and the english clubs vying to buy them will want to knock that down - because it seems only english clubs have any money. The end of the window is always a case of who blinks first but this season more than any because there is a much greater need for so many clubs to balance the books.

Rich · **#489956**

Few reports saying we have offered Leicester a player plus cash deal for James Maddison. Player supposedly AMN. Leicester have a terrific record of getting top whack for their players and replacing them much more cheaply - or already having that replacement in their squad.

Going back over the big Leicester sales, Kante, Mahrez, Maguire, Chilwell - they've all been a success. (Drinkwater is the outlier) I wouldn't be against the move if the price is sensible and that would mean AMN price in any deal being a minimum £20m.

It does seem like there are similar players available for less on the continent but Arsenal look like their looking at home grown players and premier league experience. Both are useful to have.

One thing Maddison would do is increase the quantity and quality of shots on target from us from that 18-30 yards range - where we are pretty awful

HoddGooner · **#489957**

Rich wrote:

Former England U18's manager Kevin Betsy is appointed as Arsenal's new U23 manager. It has been rumoured for some time. I don't know anything about him but it seems those that do consider this a very good appointment.

Excellent coach - the boys that have played for England under his guidance speak very highly of him
Hopefully this will help maintain the pipeline of bright young talent flowing into the 1st team

Ash · **#489958**

long time gooner wrote:

Where’s Gabriel?

I think he got injured in the preparation for the Brazil Olympic squad. The club are being quite quiet about him which is worrying. He’s the obvious best partner for White we have.

Rich · **#489959**

Xhaka set to sign a new contract with us until 2025, I think he had 2 years left on his current deal so effectively adds 2 more years.

If we could have a central midfield of Partey, new CM, Xhaka, Lokonga, Azeez I’d be happy with that.

Zed · **#489960**

Kroenke's LA Rams kick off pre season Aug 21 at SoFi Stadium in LA. This is what he's focussed on.

Fixtures	Sunday April 28th - Tottenham Hotspur - Tottenham Hotspur Stadium - 2:00 Pm	Kick-Off

	Injuries	Steve Gleiber

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