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Post #529761  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:03 pm 
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Rich wrote:
So quite ridiculously if West Ham lose or draw tonight (currently losing), and then each of West Ham, Everton and Spurs fail to win on the last day and we beat Brighton we will finish 6th.

Obviously that is a lot of things that need to happen but
Man City v Everton
Leicester v Spurs
West Ham v Southampton
Arsenal v Brighton

If you were a betting man you wouldn't give Everton or Spurs much chance of a win in their games. West Ham could easily win but they are in stinking form.

We might end up 7th and in this new Europa Conference League thing. I don't know who else might be in that but I'd wager we'd be the strongest side by a long way considering we're regularly one of the strongest 4 sides in the European competition that is the next step up

It's the hope that kills you.


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Post #529762  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:05 pm 
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I *%^@*** hate Palace.
At 0 1 I could feel the tide turning.
Their crowd were making more noise and they were slowly edging back.
We never seem to be able to beat them and with Zaha and Townsend they can always nick a goal.
I was really worried they would equalise.
Literally moments later they *%^@*** well did.
Infuriating.
Really thought we had blown the chance to at least take it to the last day.
Was gutted.
Palace are a real irritating team and I thought we had blown any slim hope we had.
Step forward Martinelli!!
Yesssss!!!!!!
God no VAR do not cancel the goal!!!!
Just our luck but thankfully it stood.
Then Pépé to make it 3!!!
Fingers crossed we can nick 6th
Come on West Brom!!!!


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Post #529763  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:05 pm 
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bromley gooner wrote:
Rich wrote:
So quite ridiculously if West Ham lose or draw tonight (currently losing), and then each of West Ham, Everton and Spurs fail to win on the last day and we beat Brighton we will finish 6th.

Obviously that is a lot of things that need to happen but
Man City v Everton
Leicester v Spurs
West Ham v Southampton
Arsenal v Brighton

If you were a betting man you wouldn't give Everton or Spurs much chance of a win in their games. West Ham could easily win but they are in stinking form.

We might end up 7th and in this new Europa Conference League thing. I don't know who else might be in that but I'd wager we'd be the strongest side by a long way considering we're regularly one of the strongest 4 sides in the European competition that is the next step up

It's the hope that kills you.

Right. It’s as unlikely as winning by two goals ay Anfield in the final match of the season. (he said hopefully).

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Post #529764  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:11 pm 
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Three big things our team is missing and would improve us immensely
1. A right back with attacking quality and true technical ability, especially if Arteta likes the opposite full back to tuck in to those midfield half spaces.
2. A proper partner for Partey. I'm convinced Partey is not the box-to-box midfielder we thought he might be once he was released from the shackles of Simeone's system. Partey should sit and protect the defence, take the ball from defenders and move it forward quickly. Get someone alongside him. A Cazorla or Modric type, good enough defensively and positionally to play in the 2 man midfield but technically good enough to dictate the game from deep
3. Extra creativity from a wide position. The wide areas is maybe the least of our problems on paper with Saka, Pépé, Martinelli, Willian, Emile Smith Rowe, Aubameyang all being able to play there, but I think the way to balance out some of the creativity issues the side has is to bring in a naturally creative player on the left wing. Someone in the Jack Grealish mould. Not a natural wide man, but someone who starts wide and drifts in creating numbers in the middle of the pitch, creating chances and scoring goals. I'd sign Grealish in a heart-beat if we could (which we can't)


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Post #529765  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:14 pm 
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When was the last time we scored a 90th+ minute winner?

We got a late equaliser against Fulham at home but I don't remember a late winner this season, or under Arteta at all?


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Post #529766  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:15 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Three big things our team is missing and would improve us immensely
1. A right back with attacking quality and true technical ability, especially if Arteta likes the opposite full back to tuck in to those midfield half spaces.
2. A proper partner for Partey. I'm convinced Partey is not the box-to-box midfielder we thought he might be once he was released from the shackles of Simeone's system. Partey should sit and protect the defence, take the ball from defenders and move it forward quickly. Get someone alongside him. A Cazorla or Modric type, good enough defensively and positionally to play in the 2 man midfield but technically good enough to dictate the game from deep
3. Extra creativity from a wide position. The wide areas is maybe the least of our problems on paper with Saka, Pépé, Martinelli, Willian, Emile Smith Rowe, Aubameyang all being able to play there, but I think the way to balance out some of the creativity issues the side has is to bring in a naturally creative player on the left wing. Someone in the Jack Grealish mould. Not a natural wide man, but someone who starts wide and drifts in creating numbers in the middle of the pitch, creating chances and scoring goals. I'd sign Grealish in a heart-beat if we could (which we can't)


To be honest if we spunked our entire summer budget on Jack Grealish and signed nobody else I’d consider that an excellent summers business. We are desperate for that type of player


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Post #529767  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:17 pm 
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That was shaping up to be a shitfest of a last half an hour.......too slow with our passing, no intensity, too many backwards and sideways passes, a lack of quality and invention in the final third, substitutions made too late in the game despite needing a goal........and then boom two late goals out of nothing.

Only Arsenal :laughing7:


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Post #529768  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:18 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Rich wrote:
Three big things our team is missing and would improve us immensely
1. A right back with attacking quality and true technical ability, especially if Arteta likes the opposite full back to tuck in to those midfield half spaces.
2. A proper partner for Partey. I'm convinced Partey is not the box-to-box midfielder we thought he might be once he was released from the shackles of Simeone's system. Partey should sit and protect the defence, take the ball from defenders and move it forward quickly. Get someone alongside him. A Cazorla or Modric type, good enough defensively and positionally to play in the 2 man midfield but technically good enough to dictate the game from deep
3. Extra creativity from a wide position. The wide areas is maybe the least of our problems on paper with Saka, Pépé, Martinelli, Willian, Emile Smith Rowe, Aubameyang all being able to play there, but I think the way to balance out some of the creativity issues the side has is to bring in a naturally creative player on the left wing. Someone in the Jack Grealish mould. Not a natural wide man, but someone who starts wide and drifts in creating numbers in the middle of the pitch, creating chances and scoring goals. I'd sign Grealish in a heart-beat if we could (which we can't)


To be honest if we spunked our entire summer budget on Jack Grealish and signed nobody else I’d consider that an excellent summers business. We are desperate for that type of player

You realize that would mean Xhaka starting every single game basically?


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Post #529769  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:19 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Rich wrote:
Three big things our team is missing and would improve us immensely
1. A right back with attacking quality and true technical ability, especially if Arteta likes the opposite full back to tuck in to those midfield half spaces.
2. A proper partner for Partey. I'm convinced Partey is not the box-to-box midfielder we thought he might be once he was released from the shackles of Simeone's system. Partey should sit and protect the defence, take the ball from defenders and move it forward quickly. Get someone alongside him. A Cazorla or Modric type, good enough defensively and positionally to play in the 2 man midfield but technically good enough to dictate the game from deep
3. Extra creativity from a wide position. The wide areas is maybe the least of our problems on paper with Saka, Pépé, Martinelli, Willian, Emile Smith Rowe, Aubameyang all being able to play there, but I think the way to balance out some of the creativity issues the side has is to bring in a naturally creative player on the left wing. Someone in the Jack Grealish mould. Not a natural wide man, but someone who starts wide and drifts in creating numbers in the middle of the pitch, creating chances and scoring goals. I'd sign Grealish in a heart-beat if we could (which we can't)


To be honest if we spunked our entire summer budget on Jack Grealish and signed nobody else I’d consider that an excellent summers business. We are desperate for that type of player


Emile Smith Rowe is of that ilk, I like the fact that he can run with the ball and make ground. Grealish is the master at that. Grealish would be a monster signing but, realistically, its not going to happen.


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Post #529770  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:21 pm 
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Hazuki wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:

To be honest if we spunked our entire summer budget on Jack Grealish and signed nobody else I’d consider that an excellent summers business. We are desperate for that type of player

You realize that would mean Xhaka starting every single game basically?


Not really El Nenny and Partey


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Post #529771  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:22 pm 
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Hard to believe but over the last 23 games in the league we're the 2nd best team in the entire division. Creating the cut off point of 23 games to suit the argument!


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Post #529772  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:24 pm 
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socrates wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:

To be honest if we spunked our entire summer budget on Jack Grealish and signed nobody else I’d consider that an excellent summers business. We are desperate for that type of player


Emile Smith Rowe is of that ilk, I like the fact that he can run with the ball and make ground. Grealish is the master at that. Grealish would be a monster signing but, realistically, its not going to happen.


It’s never going to happen but I can dream. That would be some statement of intent and exactly what’s missing.


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Post #529773  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:28 pm 
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socrates wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:

To be honest if we spunked our entire summer budget on Jack Grealish and signed nobody else I’d consider that an excellent summers business. We are desperate for that type of player


Emile Smith Rowe is of that ilk, I like the fact that he can run with the ball and make ground. Grealish is the master at that. Grealish would be a monster signing but, realistically, its not going to happen.

Definitely, that game v Spurs at home (bar the last 10 minutes) when we had Ødegaard central and Emile Smith Rowe playing in a nominal left wing position but with licence to drift was a very well balanced and good attacking performance.


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Post #529774  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:38 pm 
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socrates wrote:
Emile Smith Rowe is of that ilk, I like the fact that he can run with the ball and make ground. Grealish is the master at that. Grealish would be a monster signing but, realistically, its not going to happen.

Grealish seems like a pipe dream, but Arteta has come out in very vocal support of the Arsenal ownership in a way he certainly didn't have to. If the summer plays out like I imagine most Arsenal fans expect you have to question that to be honest.


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Post #529775  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:48 pm 
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With the players we have under contract, ignoring whatever may happen in the summer as we don't know, I would like to see us try a 4-3-3 at some point. It seems better suited to pretty much all of our current midfielders. Xhaka may step his game up further as the pivot with two strong midfielders beside him. Partey can focus more on the things he does best. Even someone like Willock may be unlocked when given more freedom to roam forward like he's doing at Newcastle. Could see Saka, Pépé, Smith-Rowe getting more of the ball higher up the pitch as well, where they can really hurt teams.


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Post #529776  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 8:54 pm 
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Not sure about Ødegaard. Silky touch but very, very left footed which slows us down at times.

I'm just not sure he's what we need at the moment or even if his game is suited to the pace and power of the PL, especially if he would cost £40m or something. That said, David Silva did great things and so is Phil Foden.

I know we lack that door opening quality around the box but I can't help but feel there are other priorities to explore before him.


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Post #529777  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 9:22 pm 
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Watching this again, it's actually incredible that's not deemed a red card considering the standard they've set for incidents like that.


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Post #529778  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 9:49 pm 
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DHD wrote:
mcquilkie wrote:
Hi Rich, we're currently nine points from fourth - a minuscule margin over the course of a 38-game campaign. Yes, we've been terrible for a lot of the season, but why shouldn't we get a handful of points more in 2021/22, rather than less? (I can't help thinking I'm arguing a point you've been making for most of the season!) This is a statistical outlier, but I love the fact that, comparing 2014/15 with 2015/16, Leicester picked up 65 points on Chelsea. So ... 10 or 20 is surely doable.


Morning McQ

9 points is almost 17% of our total. I wouldn't describe that as "miniscule". As of today, we're 11 points off 4th - that's over 20% adrift of the points required for Europe.

Sorry but the table doesn't lie. It never lies. We are currently 10th with the possibility of reaching 6th in the unlikely event we win both our remaining games and none of the 4 teams above get another point from their last games. We won't finish lower than 10th but 8th place is probably the best we can hope for. We finished 8th last year so at least we are consistent.

Nowadays, we are a mid-table club. This season we have performed like a mid-table team.

People say 'the table doesn't lie' but ...
when we finished second a few years ago ... it was 'nah, the table is having a laugh. not a good season.'
or this season, if we do the improbable and finish in the top 7, it will be 'the table is generally honest, but it told a big fib at the end there'.

We've been a lot better than a mid-table club for the second half of the season.

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Post #529779  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 9:57 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Hard to believe but over the last 23 games in the league we're the 2nd best team in the entire division. Creating the cut off point of 23 games to suit the argument!

That's a pretty good sample.
Its not like looking at just the last 4 games, for example :laughing7:
American Gooner will sleep easy tonight, knowing we have at least nailed down that coveted 9th place pennant. There will be moaning and gnashing of teeth in Yorkshire tonight.
Edit: I see they are only two places behind, so not quite time to pack away the rubber sheets!

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Post #529780  Posted: Wed May 19, 2021 10:03 pm 
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bubblechris wrote:
Pépé looks good at times but rarely finds the killer pass. His game is much better when he runs on to the ball not when he's stuck on the wing.

Well done Martinelli maybe Arteta will realise who has to start in future.

Pépé's a striker or wide forward not a traditional winger, in my view.

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Post #529781  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 1:01 am 
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We are the most in form club in the league. No other club has won 4 straight. Some good performances but mostly winning ugly. I'm guessing Arteta will buy himself another season. However, my guess is that if we are performing poorly after the first 2 or 3 months and seem to be in mid table he'll get fired. Top 6 or sacked is what I'm guessing.

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Post #529782  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 3:35 am 
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Completely reasonable if not expected for Arsenal fans to play the 'if this happens then this' last match scenario regarding the table. I get it. I'd probably be caught up in that most years if not all. I'm not playing at that this game. Whatever happens...happens. I'm far more concerned with the summer transfer period and cutting some players loose once and for all and bringing in needed talent. Maybe I should be but I'm not concerned with 8th, 9th or 10th or whatever the final place in the table is. It won't change a cr@p season. No European football won't bother me. At least right now. We lose money and get a lower coefficient thingy but I'm concerned with the squad for next season. Even if no Euro football may damage us in buying players.

Hope Chelsea and Man Utd lose their finals. Frankly, semi finals is darn good considering the season we've had.

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Post #529783  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 6:19 am 
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Watched the highlights and it is shocking officiating that Palace weren’t down to 9 men.
Schlupp on chambers was identical to what Aubameyang was sent off for.
Then Benteke throwing his elbow/forearm in to the chin/neck of Elneny, how on earth has that not been deemed violent conduct?


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Post #529784  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 6:23 am 
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44 points in the last 23 games. Extrapolate that over the season and we have 72/73 points. More often than not that gets you top 4. We can’t expect Liverpool to have such a poor season next year but we need to be getting to that 70 ish point marker as a minimum next year


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Post #529785  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 6:46 am 
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Thoroughly enjoyed Fat Sam getting relegated and his defensive and prickly interview after the game. He loves the idea that he gets under the skin of the big teams often giving them a bloody nose, which was only vaguely true 15 years ago. He hates that he’s stereotyped (rightly) by boring, long ball, percentage football and of course every team that beats his teams didn’t deserve it and we’re very lucky.
Good riddance


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Post #529786  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 9:04 am 
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Rich wrote:
Thoroughly enjoyed Fat Sam getting relegated and his defensive and prickly interview after the game. He loves the idea that he gets under the skin of the big teams often giving them a bloody nose, which was only vaguely true 15 years ago. He hates that he’s stereotyped (rightly) by boring, long ball, percentage football and of course every team that beats his teams didn’t deserve it and we’re very lucky.
Good riddance

Just watched that interview. Wow. How many chips does he have on his shoulders? I had thought that he was better than that.

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Post #529787  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 9:10 am 
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socrates wrote:
Not sure about Ødegaard. Silky touch but very, very left footed which slows us down at times.

I'm just not sure he's what we need at the moment or even if his game is suited to the pace and power of the PL, especially if he would cost £40m or something. That said, David Silva did great things and so is Phil Foden.

I know we lack that door opening quality around the box but I can't help but feel there are other priorities to explore before him.


IMO, I would not buy Ødegaard. And definitely not in the expected high price to get him. We badly need an Ozil-type or Carzola-type player. Ødegaard had his chances to show he can be that player, but he isn't even close.

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Post #529788  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 9:48 am 
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gooner7 wrote:
IMO, I would not buy Ødegaard. And definitely not in the expected high price to get him. We badly need an Ozil-type or Carzola-type player. Ødegaard had his chances to show he can be that player, but he isn't even close.

Well, to be fair he's better than Cazorla was at 22. Özil was world class at 22 though, possibly the best playmaker in the world at that point, so I don't think we can expect anyone to be at that level really. Going by paper talk it looks very unlikely that we'll sign Ødegaard anyway.


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Post #529789  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 9:52 am 
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Decaf wrote:


We've been a lot better than a mid-table club for the second half of the season.


...which is spookily balanced by the fact we were worse than a mid-table club in the first half.

Weird, eh?


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Post #529790  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 10:11 am 
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Hazuki wrote:
gooner7 wrote:
IMO, I would not buy Ødegaard. And definitely not in the expected high price to get him. We badly need an Ozil-type or Carzola-type player. Ødegaard had his chances to show he can be that player, but he isn't even close.

Well, to be fair he's better than Cazorla was at 22. Özil was world class at 22 though, possibly the best playmaker in the world at that point, so I don't think we can expect anyone to be at that level really. Going by paper talk it looks very unlikely that we'll sign Ødegaard anyway.

The ball for Martinelli's goal was magnificent. That's what you want him to produce and he did. I'd be delighted if we signed him permanently, but like you, I'm not sure it will happen.

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Post #529791  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 10:16 am 
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Anyone going on Sunday?

Bern??


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Post #529792  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 10:40 am 
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DHD wrote:
Decaf wrote:


We've been a lot better than a mid-table club for the second half of the season.


...which is spookily balanced by the fact we were worse than a mid-table club in the first half.

Weird, eh?

Hi DHD, I wouldn't call it spookily balanced. When we were a few points from the relegation zone in December, there was nothing inevitable about us having the second or third-best record in the league for the rest of the season. I'm quite pleased about it, and I think it hints at better times ahead in 2021/22 ... maybe.

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Post #529793  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 11:15 am 
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DHD wrote:
Anyone going on Sunday?

Bern??

Yep, I am. Are you? Got the ticket and printed it. Haven’t received the questionnaire yet but I think they’re sending them tonight.


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Post #529794  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 12:05 pm 
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I stand corrected. Liverpool has a better record in the last handful of matches. A draw and 4 straight wins to our loss and 4 straight wins. Be that as it may, we are on a roll. Wish we had this form for most of the season. We still look vulnerable but at least we are getting wins.

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Post #529795  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 12:08 pm 
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Apparently Arsenal have never lost a game when a teenager has scored for us. Apparently there have been sixty such games, of which we’ve won fifty and drawn ten.

How’s this for a brilliant suggestion for turning our fortunes around. The only players allowed to play for us after their 20th birthday are goalkeepers. Once any outfield players have their 20th birthday, get rid of them.


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Post #529796  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 1:01 pm 
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Fat Sam's main gripe is the influx of foreign managers into the league. He relied on foreign players, the effen hypocrite, but he feels foreign managers have taken the big club positions away from British managers. He hates Wenger because he was so successful he started a wave of hiring foreign managers. Yes, there have been foreign managers before but British managers regularly got the top jobs once they've proven themselves.

He's held a personal animus against us specifically since then. Even with Wenger gone. We had too many foreign players for his liking. Weren't we the first club I think to have an all foreign outfield players one match? Not 100% sure but I think I read that once.

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Post #529797  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 3:03 pm 
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mcquilkie wrote:
DHD wrote:

...which is spookily balanced by the fact we were worse than a mid-table club in the first half.

Weird, eh?

Hi DHD, I wouldn't call it spookily balanced. When we were a few points from the relegation zone in December, there was nothing inevitable about us having the second or third-best record in the league for the rest of the season. I'm quite pleased about it, and I think it hints at better times ahead in 2021/22 ... maybe.


G'Day McQ

We have been alarmingly mediocre for chunks of the season but like you, I'm pleased we're looking better in recent weeks.

I saw a quote from (I think) Arseblog who noted that from the 18 points available from our games against Villa, Wolves and Burnley, we took only 1. From our current perspective, you'd like to think that was a different team - but it wasn't.


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Post #529798  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 3:06 pm 
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Bernard wrote:
DHD wrote:
Anyone going on Sunday?

Bern??

Yep, I am. Are you? Got the ticket and printed it. Haven’t received the questionnaire yet but I think they’re sending them tonight.


No Bern. Never got around to entering the ballot. Can't be arsed with testing protocols.

How much are the tickets? Is the upper tier open?

I see Totts charged £60 a pop for last nights admission.


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Post #529799  Posted: Thu May 20, 2021 3:38 pm 
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DHD wrote:
I see Totts charged £60 a pop for last nights admission.

I'd have paid that to watch that comedy show last night. Would have been hilarious.

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DHD wrote:
Bernard wrote:
Yep, I am. Are you? Got the ticket and printed it. Haven’t received the questionnaire yet but I think they’re sending them tonight.

No Bern. Never got around to entering the ballot. Can't be arsed with testing protocols.

How much are the tickets? Is the upper tier open?

I see Totts charged £60 a pop for last nights admission.

I’m not sitting in my normal seat but without knowing presume the upper tier is open. The seat was £35.50 but as I say, that isn’t for my normal seat.


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