Just disgusting - Look at the way United are celebrating.

It's just a league game, not a final.

Embarrassing.

To be fair, this was very similiar to when they beat Liverpool a few weeks back. Liverpool was the better side, dominated possession and created more, but Man Utd killed them with a counter attack.

For us a toenail for united 8 yards

I don’t understand it.

It's all about how we respond now. A draw would've been a good result going into this game, we only got one less point than that. Need to regroup quickly, two games we should win coming up next week.

Off

That was never a 3:1 game so I think we should take a lot of positives from it. There are suggestions that Arteta gambled too early and we lost control of the match when we were only a goal behind. A nice consolation to still be top of the league but its now crucial we get back to winning ways to keep the positive momentum of team and fans going.

Decent performance but very naive defending.

Jesus was amazing, too good for us at the moment if truth be told. Ødegaard was really good for 60 mins.

I thought Gabriel, Saliba and Ramsdale were not good today. Did not deal with the counter-attack threat at all. Nonsensical defending at times.

I thought we missed Partey but Lokonga did well given he was playing as a one man midfield when Xhaka moved forward.

Saka was a livewire, Martinelli disallowed goal apart was very disappointing.

We basically threw the game away with naive defending.

He gambled at 16 minutes to go.

You can’t really slate him. He goes early it’s too early and leaves it late it’s too late

I thought Maguire on Nketiah at the end was a penalty. As was the late tackle on Saka after he got the shot away.

If you ask yourself if those are fouls anywhere else on the pitch then you get your answer. I get why refs don’t give them, it’s easy to give that foul in the middle of the pitch - fans grumble but not for long - they don’t give it in the box because they’re scared it draws attention to them - it’s easier to be passive.

The Martinelli goal ruled out is the crucial one, ref 2 yards away sees it and plays on. Slow it down and any contact looks like a foul and you have var scrutinising things for any way to stop a goal being scored. Do I think Man U would have been awarded that 100% they would

And that’s the frustration.

I’ve rarely seen us dominate like that at OT

That’s why we should take hope for the season. If both those teams play like that for the rest of the season we’re miles above Man U. They’ll get a few morale boosting wins but they are miles off. I don’t think I saw them strong 5 passes in our half together and their press is non existent.

£250m has improved them but not much

ah what a bollox.

Hate doing this, but I strangely agree with G.Neville's post match analysis. The Palace game I thought we were a bit lucky and 2nd best for most of the game. Leicester we were good but managed to give them hope throughout. Bournemouth was a stroll, and Fulham and Villa were both closer than they needed to be. But after the game today I really think we're on to something.

We bossed that game. Soft VAR to stop us being 1 up. Very different game if that goal stands. Like Toppy says, I can't really understand why their 3rd goal isn't chalked off. Couple of pen decisions didn't go our way. Generally I thought we were absolutely magnificent, miles more progressive and creative than Utd. Just about everything went their way (waves at DHD.. a Salford born ref reffing a Man Utd game?? you cant make it up!), and nothing really went for us. Before the game I thought we might nick a point. Didn't expect us to outplay them the way we did. Feel more confident today than I did after any of the first 5 wins.

Some days you're the pigeon, some days you're the statue. It's absolutely abundantly clear what this team is all about, and I like it very much indeed.

I don't blame him, there was a limited amount of time to go and he had to gamble.

.. Great post.

Back to it. See you lot next Sunday

By the way we’re told there was a edict this year for referees to allow a high threshold for fouls to let the game flow. The ref did this for Ødegaard on Eriksen who was dawdling on the ball. Far less of a foul than Mings on Saka and Maguire on Nketiah and the follow through on Saka.

We want consistency. As always with subjective calls you can come down on whoever side you want to call it a right or wrong call - it’s just damn annoying to be on the wrong end so consistently of these 50/50’s

Let it go Rich. We lost.

Very well put. The mistakes we made today is stuff you can work on - much more difficult to work on becoming a dominating team after you've been outplayed.

Could be bad news re Emile Smith Rowe
Midfielder looked distressed as he was accompanied back to dressing room by #AFC assistant coach Carlos Cuesta, while rest of substitutes continued their session @TheAthleticUK

*%^@*** typical

Great Post Pompey

It's just so frustrating.
No matter the circumstances.
No matter the form of both sides.
No matter the table.
No matter how well we play we always *%^@*** lose at this dump of a stadium.
Is it a hoodoo?
Is it a mental block?
Why can't we just get over the line.
*%^@ teams will come here and beat utd so why can't we.
We were brilliant today and at 1 1 only one winner in it
. Then we end up with nothing..... again.
We will murder them at the Emirates.
Damn frustrating.

https://twitter.com/nocontextfooty/stat ... NTanlv1RUQ

I know he was booked for this, but how McTominey doesn’t have twice the reputation Xhaka has is beyond me. The guy is a walking foul every game. Awful footballer.

I don’t think that was a mental block today. We dominated the game. There was no fear, no stage fright. I’ve seen us go to OT clearly the better team with better players and throw in a stinker of a performance, that was not that.
The wrong end of a number of key 50/50 calls and a couple of lapses for counter attacking goals.

If we get the first goal as we should it throws out the only thing that Man U can do. They played better v Liverpool. I didn’t see anything from Man U that made me think they’ll make top 4 this year.

Agreed PG. Plus Saliba and Odegard had gilt edged chances in either half.

We played very well….
At 2:1 down I still thought we’d win…that’s how slick our play was…...their third goes in and I’m resigned to our fate
Five straight wins flattered to deceive a bit…there is still work to do but I’m all in on this journey…we still need to strengthen the squad in quality and numbers but I’m optimistic
Lastly and this is my immaturity……I f..ing hate Utd and their scummy fans.. I really do
McTominay is just a thug….horrible person and I never thought this would happen but for me Fernandes has overtaken Lamela as the biggest tosser in football.

Re Thurs.
Turner Cédric Tomiyasu Holding Tierney
Vieira Marquinhos Nketiah
….have to start also Emile Smith Rowe if fit. Is Reiss Nelson fit
Which two or three who played today have to play Thurs and again against Everton.

To paraphrase Pompey…ah bollox

17 of the 21 prem refs are from ‘the north’. Of the other 4, 3 are from the Bristol area and 1 is from Australia.
Of that 21, 11 of them are from the north west.

If you’re allocating refs to Man U v Arsenal why would you even risk the conspiracy theories by assigning two refs who hail from Salford and greater Manchester. I don’t think refs are consciously biased but subconsciously you’d have to be a robot to not have some things influence you. And having lived in the south and the north there is still very much a north south divide between in this country even if it is mostly jovial.

Ok next weekend. Spurs away to City and Man U away to Palace.

Exactly the two games where both spurs and Man U can get dominated and demolished, but equally can jam out victories.

I think we’ll beat Everton but I’m desperate for palace and city to smash those two. I hate that neither spurs or Man U have a style of football that dominated games, that they seem so one dimensional and rely on a fair degree of fortune. I want them both crushed

Perhaps the reasoning is that, in terms of average miles from the centre of England, the one from Australia more than makes up for the 21 from up north?

For every type of decision I’ve ever seen happen on the pitch I’ve seen an ex-ref explain why a certain decision is given….except when a striker shoots at goal and is taken out immediately afterwards by a desperate lunge from a defender?
The late foul on Saka is a free kick anywhere else on the pitch and not a single person argues against it. But yet almost without exception when a striker shoots like Saka did and gets taken out this is never given as a penalty - has this ever been explained by an ex ref? And if not why are those pundits who live and breathe football and have access to these ex refs not asking the question?

Although he’s from Salford, Tierney claims to support Wigan. Salford is the area of Manchester that has the biggest proportion of Manchester United fans. But not everyone in Salford supports them, like not everyone from Islington supports Arsenal and not everyone in Tottenham supports Tottenham. So who knows about Tierney’s favourite club? What we do know is he claims it’s Wigan.

https://www.planetsport.com/soccer/feat ... -liverpool

Hi Rich. Did you see my post 551604 on page 13791? I’ve copied it below. For reasons explained in it, I’m honestly not sure the lack of refs from London or the south works against Arsenal.

“Without getting in to the rights and wrongs of where referees come from, is the lack of referees from London necessarily a problem for Arsenal? By far the best supported clubs in London are Chelsea, Arsenal and Tottenham (West Ham are well behind). I strongly suspect the referees most likely to be biased in their decision making against Arsenal in games they’re officiating are those who support Tottenham and Chelsea (neighbourly hatred and close rivals) rather than any from the midlands or north.

For example, a Liverpool supporting referee is presumably most likely to be biased against Manchester United (traditional hatred) and City (closest rivals) than Arsenal. A City supporting referee is surely more likely to be biased against Liverpool and United (their closest and nearest rivals) than Arsenal. A United supporting referee is, I would suggest, more likely to be biased against City (near neighbours) and Liverpool (traditional hatred) than Arsenal.”

Do not play a single player who started today on Thursday.

Rest the lot.

I did see the post.
But what if these northern refs do truly support the minor teams they declare - Tierney supporting Wigan would have little axe to grind against non-rival team like Man U….but a fan f a smaller team may easily have a north/south bias.
A london ref might declare alligence to Charlton and if refereeing Arsenal v Man U may have his north/south unconscious bias swing our way. He’s a southerner, a Londoner, all his family and friends are Londoners, he’s grown up sick of northerners with a chip on their shoulder etc

I thought Ramsdale, Gabriel and Saliba were all shaky today.

Ramsdale, in particular, is a real worry for me. Thought he might have done better on a couple of goals.

His distribution was very good bar one lapse but his actual goalkeeping is a bit hit and miss at the moment.

Moving away from the disappointment of the result, I thought Vieira looked really interesting when he came on. Seemed to play as a no 8 rather than a 10, and clearly is a very talented footballer. It was not the easiest setting to make your debut, but it was encouraging to see how he got involved and didn't hide. Hit a lovely ball towards Martinelli that nearly resulted in a goal bar for some last ditch defending from the clunky and incompetent McTominay.

I thought Lokonga grew into the game and was pretty good. Showed a nice range of passing and some decent composure.

I’m really not sure about this north/south relating to local bias. For example, I have no affinity with either club but if Everton played West Ham in a cup final (teams of similar standing) I think I’d rather Everton win it. And I say that as a born and bred Londoner.

It goes without saying I wanted Liverpool to beat Tottenham in that Champions League final a few years ago. Likewise if City played Chelsea in a cup final (clubs of a similar standing), I’d definitely want City to win. I was delighted Liverpool beat Chelsea in both domestic cup finals last season, and I hold Liverpool in utter contempt.

On the ball. Fine

Off the ball dire. Out of position for the first goal and positional game was poor.

It’s hard to admit but he was big part of the defeat as was Gabriel being rash and zinny getting sucked towards the ball. No way Tierney leaves his winger like that. All good players but need to be honest

I agree socrates. Lokonga had a more than decent game, as I think gooner7 implied earlier.

What in the fresh hell is nonsense like this,

What could he have done with any of those goals. I thought he commanded his area quite well actually.

I think not buying a top class CM over the last few windows is a massive mistake.

People will say that we were unlucky because Partey was out again, but it isn't luck because he misses 40% of the games every season. That is not sustainable when he is a key element of the way Arteta wants to play.

That said we played some sweet stuff today and cut throught them many times without having that clinical final ball or finish.

But you’re saying that as an Arsenal fan who play other ‘big’ London teams regularly enough to form some sense of rivalry.
What if you were a fan of Leyton Orient, would you want Arsenal or Man U to win a game between the two?

I think if you ask fans of top 6 sides do they want the other top 6 teams to win their champions league or Europa league games and most of them will say absolutely not.
Take that same poll in league one fans and I’d wager most would say they want the English top 6 teams to win. They don’t have a rivalry with the top 6 so have an affinity to the English v foreign team. The same could easily be the same between north v south when you have no rivalry with either team

I really don’t believe refs are biased on where they were born/brought up/live etc
I question their competency occasionally but not their integrity…..they are adjudicating on a game played at a million miles an hour with players trying to con them, surrounding them screaming obscenities when a decision goes against them, the crowd questioning their parenthood as well as their knowledge of the rules of football
Honestly I don’t know why you would be a ref….the money can’t be great ….maybe they like being in the spotlight but I would not want that job for love nor money
I really don’t think VAR has helped the game much, nor the referees……I would dump it in a heart beat