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Post #552481  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 11:40 am 
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Darren wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
He’s just abolished the top rate of tax.

I’m thousands better off from April.

This is mental. This is just not normal.

They are literally trying to buy votes now. How does this help the poorest in society? Why are we obsessed in this country with the notion of paying tax as being a bad thing? They are burning everything as quickly as they can, regulations, workers rights. They're essentially trying to turn this country into a tax haven, which of course is what they wanted all along with the concept of Brexit.

Don't know if you've been watching The Capture on iPlayer? The second season is very pertinent. Features a company who are using data to infiltrate politics. Clearly based on Cambridge Analytica and their Brexit work. Really good series btw.

Don’t get me wrong I love a nice tax break, I’ll get the kitchen done next year now :laughing7:

It’s basically a bribe. They are doing this for votes and it’s amazing how they are doing stuff they know damages the country for the retention of power.

I’ll check out that series


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Post #552482  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 12:51 pm 
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Rich wrote:
https://twitter.com/talksport/status/1572622442148790277?s=46&t=hkY4nrvC-1ZXuogshNb1pQ

Here’s another one. Massive furore in the media over Gabriel mimicking Toney’s tweet from when they beat us. I get the idea that Brentford are the smaller club but people were absolutely lining up for Brentford to beat us last weekend, all the headlines were written they were desperate for it. So if Brentford can take the mick when they beat us and Toney’s tweet was widely laughed at at the time, why can’t Arsenal have a little pop back. It’s all so harmless but some people have lost their sh*t over it.

You could make a very long list of the things we’ve been criticised for even just this season, where other clubs are given a free pass.

Of course we’re a massive club so we’ll naturally generate more interest and headlines but that doesn’t explain why this scrutiny doesn’t land on the other very big clubs.


Honestly Rich, who cares? Media will write stories to generate clicks and generate income. That's it. The fact that Arsenal are more of a topic of news headlines is because there are more people that want to click that mouse button to see us either winning or losing and any other topic that generates a "those tossers from Arsenal" response. It's all mathematics and bots.


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Post #552483  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 12:51 pm 
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The Harvey Elliot tribunal fee was £4.3m that Liverpool had to pay Fulham. It wasn’t all up front, a chunk of it is based on appearances.


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Post #552484  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 12:55 pm 
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grantyboy wrote:
Rich wrote:
https://twitter.com/talksport/status/1572622442148790277?s=46&t=hkY4nrvC-1ZXuogshNb1pQ

Here’s another one. Massive furore in the media over Gabriel mimicking Toney’s tweet from when they beat us. I get the idea that Brentford are the smaller club but people were absolutely lining up for Brentford to beat us last weekend, all the headlines were written they were desperate for it. So if Brentford can take the mick when they beat us and Toney’s tweet was widely laughed at at the time, why can’t Arsenal have a little pop back. It’s all so harmless but some people have lost their sh*t over it.

You could make a very long list of the things we’ve been criticised for even just this season, where other clubs are given a free pass.

Of course we’re a massive club so we’ll naturally generate more interest and headlines but that doesn’t explain why this scrutiny doesn’t land on the other very big clubs.


Honestly Rich, who cares? Media will write stories to generate clicks and generate income. That's it. The fact that Arsenal are more of a topic of news headlines is because there are more people that want to click that mouse button to see us either winning or losing and any other topic that generates a "those tossers from Arsenal" response. It's all mathematics and bots.

I don’t care that much, it doesn’t keep me up at night….just something to talk about during the slow international break.
I completely get that Arsenal generate responses and clicks- but so would Liverpool and to a lesser degree Spurs, Liverpool have more fans than us in the UK and they can be quite a precious bunch as can we. So when they over celebrate, or play 16 year old Harvey Elliot we hear not a peep?
I think we got more criticism for actually beating Fulham than Liverpool did drawing with them.


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Post #552485  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:00 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Darren wrote:
They are literally trying to buy votes now. How does this help the poorest in society? Why are we obsessed in this country with the notion of paying tax as being a bad thing? They are burning everything as quickly as they can, regulations, workers rights. They're essentially trying to turn this country into a tax haven, which of course is what they wanted all along with the concept of Brexit.

Don't know if you've been watching The Capture on iPlayer? The second season is very pertinent. Features a company who are using data to infiltrate politics. Clearly based on Cambridge Analytica and their Brexit work. Really good series btw.

Don’t get me wrong I love a nice tax break, I’ll get the kitchen done next year now :laughing7:

It’s basically a bribe. They are doing this for votes and it’s amazing how they are doing stuff they know damages the country for the retention of power.

I’ll check out that series


Parties are a figurative element in populist politics. There is a dying allegiance to one side or the other but there also is a huge number of people that have become overfed on confirmation bias and are being so battered by facebook and youtube that they've lost the ability to think objectively or with any sense of fact based reasoning.

There will always be people that support one another but politicians are a bunch of self serving arseholes who will never have the greater good as front of mind.


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Post #552486  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:06 pm 
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Rich wrote:
grantyboy wrote:

Honestly Rich, who cares? Media will write stories to generate clicks and generate income. That's it. The fact that Arsenal are more of a topic of news headlines is because there are more people that want to click that mouse button to see us either winning or losing and any other topic that generates a "those tossers from Arsenal" response. It's all mathematics and bots.

I don’t care that much, it doesn’t keep me up at night….just something to talk about during the slow international break.
I completely get that Arsenal generate responses and clicks- but so would Liverpool and to a lesser degree Spurs, Liverpool have more fans than us in the UK and they can be quite a precious bunch as can we. So when they over celebrate, or play 16 year old Harvey Elliot we hear not a peep?
I think we got more criticism for actually beating Fulham than Liverpool did drawing with them.


It's cyclical though. Liverpool have had blips like that in the past and then come roaring back. So a jouro isnt going to go all in on a blip and then be embarrassed a week later. Arsenal on the other hand were expected to beat them so the journo can't lose if they're critical.

Look there may be a "I hate Arsenal" bias but it is also because we're still one of the biggest clubs in the world and 80% want to see the big clubs lose.


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Post #552487  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:27 pm 
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grantyboy wrote:
Parties are a figurative element in populist politics. There is a dying allegiance to one side or the other but there also is a huge number of people that have become overfed on confirmation bias and are being so battered by facebook and youtube that they've lost the ability to think objectively or with any sense of fact based reasoning.

There will always be people that support one another but politicians are a bunch of self serving arseholes who will never have the greater good as front of mind.

This is what Cambridge Analytica did in the US elections, Brexit and other elections around the world (Kenya was one they trialed, I think off the top of my head). They used algorithms to see how people's political allegiances tended to sway towards one side. They then used these algorithms to feed stories, videos, adverts to those people. Much of it was misinformation - Turkey joining the EU for example - but they didn't care as long as it played on the fears, prejudices and biases of huge numbers of people to manipulate their feeds, hence reinforcing a particular political persuasion. Absolutely terrifying yet amazing in equal measures. I remember many years ago hearing someone explain to me how data is king and will be one of the most valuable commodities in the future. I didn't understand how or why. Now I do.

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Post #552488  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:41 pm 
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grantyboy wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
Don’t get me wrong I love a nice tax break, I’ll get the kitchen done next year now :laughing7:

It’s basically a bribe. They are doing this for votes and it’s amazing how they are doing stuff they know damages the country for the retention of power.

I’ll check out that series


Parties are a figurative element in populist politics. There is a dying allegiance to one side or the other but there also is a huge number of people that have become overfed on confirmation bias and are being so battered by facebook and youtube that they've lost the ability to think objectively or with any sense of fact based reasoning.

There will always be people that support one another but politicians are a bunch of self serving arseholes who will never have the greater good as front of mind.

I don't know about that. If a company hires a plumber who blames foreigners for the state of the drains, and promises to fix them while actually doing nothing and handing over the money to his rich friends ... the company is going to look at the idiot that hired the plumber as hard as the plumber himself. Particularly if he keeps hiring that plumber.

Politicians only get away with it because people don't even take the time to do a little bit of genuine research, or overlook obvious character flaws because they think their guys have 'owned the libs' (a bizarre goal to have in life). These are educated adults, who are unable to understand what would be blinding obvious to a 9 year old child.

No, the problem isn't with the politicians.

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Post #552489  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:46 pm 
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Darren wrote:
grantyboy wrote:
Parties are a figurative element in populist politics. There is a dying allegiance to one side or the other but there also is a huge number of people that have become overfed on confirmation bias and are being so battered by facebook and youtube that they've lost the ability to think objectively or with any sense of fact based reasoning.

There will always be people that support one another but politicians are a bunch of self serving arseholes who will never have the greater good as front of mind.

This is what Cambridge Analytica did in the US elections, Brexit and other elections around the world (Kenya was one they trialed, I think off the top of my head). They used algorithms to see how people's political allegiances tended to sway towards one side. They then used these algorithms to feed stories, videos, adverts to those people. Much of it was misinformation - Turkey joining the EU for example - but they didn't care as long as it played on the fears, prejudices and biases of huge numbers of people to manipulate their feeds, hence reinforcing a particular political persuasion. Absolutely terrifying yet amazing in equal measures. I remember many years ago hearing someone explain to me how data is king and will be one of the most valuable commodities in the future. I didn't understand how or why. Now I do.

I read somewhere that in Sweden teaching school-kids to detect echo-chambers and epistemic bubbles is something that is taken very seriously. Critical thinking skills need to be very high on the agenda.

The problem we when the adult and school-teachers are themselves caught in those! Nightmarish.

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Post #552490  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:48 pm 
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Decaf wrote:
grantyboy wrote:

Parties are a figurative element in populist politics. There is a dying allegiance to one side or the other but there also is a huge number of people that have become overfed on confirmation bias and are being so battered by facebook and youtube that they've lost the ability to think objectively or with any sense of fact based reasoning.

There will always be people that support one another but politicians are a bunch of self serving arseholes who will never have the greater good as front of mind.

I don't know about that. If a company hires a plumber who blames foreigners for the state of the drains, and promises to fix them while actually doing nothing and handing over the money to his rich friends ... the company is going to look at the idiot that hired the plumber as hard as the plumber himself. Particularly if he keeps hiring that plumber.

Politicians only get away with it because people don't even take the time to do a little bit of genuine research, or overlook obvious character flaws because they think their guys have 'owned the libs' (a bizarre goal to have in life). These are educated adults, who are unable to understand what would be blinding obvious to a 9 year old child.

No, the problem isn't with the politicians.


It’s two fold really.

They know voters are passive and pander to their obvious character flaws. The obsession with immigration for example.

The problem is also the politicians though they can’t be excused. As a patriotic British citizen would you honestly hand on heart do things you knew vandalised the country financially & diplomatically to progress your career. I wouldn’t. What about your kids futures


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Post #552491  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:49 pm 
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Darren wrote:
grantyboy wrote:
Parties are a figurative element in populist politics. There is a dying allegiance to one side or the other but there also is a huge number of people that have become overfed on confirmation bias and are being so battered by facebook and youtube that they've lost the ability to think objectively or with any sense of fact based reasoning.

There will always be people that support one another but politicians are a bunch of self serving arseholes who will never have the greater good as front of mind.

This is what Cambridge Analytica did in the US elections, Brexit and other elections around the world (Kenya was one they trialed, I think off the top of my head). They used algorithms to see how people's political allegiances tended to sway towards one side. They then used these algorithms to feed stories, videos, adverts to those people. Much of it was misinformation - Turkey joining the EU for example - but they didn't care as long as it played on the fears, prejudices and biases of huge numbers of people to manipulate their feeds, hence reinforcing a particular political persuasion. Absolutely terrifying yet amazing in equal measures. I remember many years ago hearing someone explain to me how data is king and will be one of the most valuable commodities in the future. I didn't understand how or why. Now I do.


Absolutely right. The way tech companies like Facebook feed the biases of people with these algorithms just to feed their ad machine is ridiculous. "The social dilemma" was a good watch. I have a friend who absolutely hates smart phones and isn't a tech guru and he was telling me how we saw the pattern of escalating drivel on Youtube and deliberately looked up the opposite just to get some kind of balanced opinion.


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Post #552492  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:53 pm 
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Decaf wrote:
grantyboy wrote:

Parties are a figurative element in populist politics. There is a dying allegiance to one side or the other but there also is a huge number of people that have become overfed on confirmation bias and are being so battered by facebook and youtube that they've lost the ability to think objectively or with any sense of fact based reasoning.

There will always be people that support one another but politicians are a bunch of self serving arseholes who will never have the greater good as front of mind.

I don't know about that. If a company hires a plumber who blames foreigners for the state of the drains, and promises to fix them while actually doing nothing and handing over the money to his rich friends ... the company is going to look at the idiot that hired the plumber as hard as the plumber himself. Particularly if he keeps hiring that plumber.

Politicians only get away with it because people don't even take the time to do a little bit of genuine research, or overlook obvious character flaws because they think their guys have 'owned the libs' (a bizarre goal to have in life). These are educated adults, who are unable to understand what would be blinding obvious to a 9 year old child.

No, the problem isn't with the politicians.


I agree that it's not as singular responsibility as I'd suggested. There is certainly a huge level of deliberate ignorance that allows the pollies to behave as they have. Whether it be disinterest, disinformation or just ignorance. The thing that sh/tz me is that the Politicians deliberately prey on these things to fund their own pensions when they could be earning just like everyone else and that to me it parasitic.


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Post #552493  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:59 pm 
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Bernard wrote:
Decaf wrote:
A serial killer bumps off, if he has a good run, somewhere between 5 and 20 people.

Those engaged in organised crime do a lot more harm. Also, their criminality is more despicable because they don't have the excuse of being mentally ill.

Serial killers aren’t all mentally ill. Many just enjoy killing people. That makes them unusual but not mentally ill. Money laundering (if that’s what you mean by organised crime) routinely does nothing remotely comparable to what serial killers do and it’s silly to claim anything else. Remember the negative consequences of money laundering is spread so widely, possibly even across entire populations, to an almost marginal extent it often makes a negligible difference to the individuals within those populations or groups.

Serial killers end the lives of their victims, added to which are the often extremely negative consequences for their relatives. I wouldn’t want to be the victim of money laundering. But I would much, much prefer being a victim of money laundering than the victim of a serial killer, as being a direct victim of the latter would end my life.


Sorry Bernard, but that is completely incorrect.

Corruption undermines development and is responsible for mass misery. The life expectancy of least developed countries is typically more than 10 years less than middle income countries. Look at a place like Zimbabwe. Fairly well educated, wonderful climate and resources, etc. But appallingly corrupt government.

You are looking millions of excess deaths (with unfortunate consequence for relatives, indeed!), caused not just by disease but by higher murder rates (corrupt law enforcement), political instability, and natural disasters (corrupt politician don't look after storm drains or prevent people living on floodplains, or both with fire safety) .. compared to a few hundred, admittedly luridly awful, deaths caused by serial killers.

And sorry, serial killers are nuts, albeit not necessary in a barking at the moon manner.

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Post #552494  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 2:00 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Decaf wrote:
I don't know about that. If a company hires a plumber who blames foreigners for the state of the drains, and promises to fix them while actually doing nothing and handing over the money to his rich friends ... the company is going to look at the idiot that hired the plumber as hard as the plumber himself. Particularly if he keeps hiring that plumber.

Politicians only get away with it because people don't even take the time to do a little bit of genuine research, or overlook obvious character flaws because they think their guys have 'owned the libs' (a bizarre goal to have in life). These are educated adults, who are unable to understand what would be blinding obvious to a 9 year old child.

No, the problem isn't with the politicians.


It’s two fold really.

They know voters are passive and pander to their obvious character flaws. The obsession with immigration for example.

The problem is also the politicians though they can’t be excused. As a patriotic British citizen would you honestly hand on heart do things you knew vandalised the country financially & diplomatically to progress your career. I wouldn’t. What about your kids futures


Funnily enough I think it's because the pollies know that they can be excused. If I was to lie outrageously in my job I'd be sacked. If I did it in society I could be prosecuted / persecuted. In politics it seems to have become a badge of honour to see who can lie the most while generating poll-based support and there seem to be minimal repercussions.


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Post #552495  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 2:05 pm 
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grantyboy wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:

It’s two fold really.

They know voters are passive and pander to their obvious character flaws. The obsession with immigration for example.

The problem is also the politicians though they can’t be excused. As a patriotic British citizen would you honestly hand on heart do things you knew vandalised the country financially & diplomatically to progress your career. I wouldn’t. What about your kids futures


Funnily enough I think it's because the pollies know that they can be excused. If I was to lie outrageously in my job I'd be sacked. If I did it in society I could be prosecuted / persecuted. In politics it seems to have become a badge of honour to see who can lie the most while generating poll-based support and there seem to be minimal repercussions.

That my point exactly. People who are responsible, nice, and smart in their own jobs and families, tend to be the opposite in the economic and political views. It is because there are no consequence for the latter.

If people don't understand that it is their civic duty to at least try to understand both side of a debate, then we are screwed. We'll get the leader we deserve.

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Post #552496  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 2:14 pm 
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Decaf wrote:
grantyboy wrote:

Funnily enough I think it's because the pollies know that they can be excused. If I was to lie outrageously in my job I'd be sacked. If I did it in society I could be prosecuted / persecuted. In politics it seems to have become a badge of honour to see who can lie the most while generating poll-based support and there seem to be minimal repercussions.

That my point exactly. People who are responsible, nice, and smart in their own jobs and families, tend to be the opposite in the economic and political views. It is because there are no consequence for the latter.

If people don't understand that it is their civic duty to at least try to understand both side of a debate, then we are screwed. We'll get the leader we deserve.


We'll also get the leader that we've been told to believe is the best one. This is where the media / social media is corrupting / screening / validating the truth for most people and also where Corporations like Facebook, Amazon and Google are now taking it to the next level in the same way that Murdoch did. Here in Aus I always felt like the ABC and SBS were grounded non-biased media organisations but then in the last couple of years there has been an escalating pattern of hyperbolic headlines that have skewed statistics into headlines. E.g. "Massive drop in housing applications by 15%" when they neglected to mentioned that it was off all time highs that were 50% above the norm and also cyclical.


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Post #552497  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 2:20 pm 
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grantyboy wrote:
Decaf wrote:
That my point exactly. People who are responsible, nice, and smart in their own jobs and families, tend to be the opposite in the economic and political views. It is because there are no consequence for the latter.

If people don't understand that it is their civic duty to at least try to understand both side of a debate, then we are screwed. We'll get the leader we deserve.


We'll also get the leader that we've been told to believe is the best one. This is where the media / social media is corrupting / screening / validating the truth for most people and also where Corporations like Facebook, Amazon and Google are now taking it to the next level in the same way that Murdoch did.

Facebook ... yes I tried that ... until I realised that Chocolate Gooner was nowhere near as much of an outlier as I had imagined. What a mess!

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Post #552498  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 2:23 pm 
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Decaf wrote:
grantyboy wrote:

We'll also get the leader that we've been told to believe is the best one. This is where the media / social media is corrupting / screening / validating the truth for most people and also where Corporations like Facebook, Amazon and Google are now taking it to the next level in the same way that Murdoch did.

Facebook ... yes I tried that ... until I realised that Chocolate Gooner was nowhere near as much of an outlier as I had imagined. What a mess!



Lol yep no Facebook for me either. Full of nutters so I retreat to the safe haven of the Gleiber forum.


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Post #552499  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 2:25 pm 
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grantyboy wrote:
Decaf wrote:
Facebook ... yes I tried that ... until I realised that Chocolate Gooner was nowhere near as much of an outlier as I had imagined. What a mess!


Lol yep no Facebook for me either. Full of nutters so I retreat to the safe haven of the Gleiber forum.

Not to mention the soothing green baize background and Steve's Jolly face.

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Post #552500  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 2:26 pm 
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grantyboy wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:

It’s two fold really.

They know voters are passive and pander to their obvious character flaws. The obsession with immigration for example.

The problem is also the politicians though they can’t be excused. As a patriotic British citizen would you honestly hand on heart do things you knew vandalised the country financially & diplomatically to progress your career. I wouldn’t. What about your kids futures


Funnily enough I think it's because the pollies know that they can be excused. If I was to lie outrageously in my job I'd be sacked. If I did it in society I could be prosecuted / persecuted. In politics it seems to have become a badge of honour to see who can lie the most while generating poll-based support and there seem to be minimal repercussions.

100% they know there’s no consequences

Mogg telling everyone they would get cheaper trainers after brexit. Boris saying no checks on the Irish Sea and now the issue with the NI protocol.

I mean in the private sector you would unceremoniously fired in a heartbeat.

Only yesterday mogg suggested in parliament people who are againest fracking are likely connected to Putin. He actually said this with a straight face. It’s dire, just dire


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Post #552501  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 3:17 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
The best analysis I’ve seen on xhakas transformation

https://twitter.com/jj_bull/status/1572 ... fS9mBfNGkA

It’s quite strange. The new formation seems to protect the side from his weaknesses and exploit his strengths. He has a manager that understands him for the first time. He was literally allergic to going in the penalty area under wenger and always used to stop his run forward.

Doesn’t mean he’s amazing now and wasn’t before and neither does it mean he’s always been incredible. Doesn’t always have to be one thing or another.

What certainly is the case is for the first time he’s adding real value and consistency in performance

That seems pretty fair. I think one of his underrated qualities is how nuggety he is. Of course the downside of that is that he can be a bit hot-headed :laughing7: But really, our problem hasn't ever been Xhaka.

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Post #552502  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 3:19 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
grantyboy wrote:

Funnily enough I think it's because the pollies know that they can be excused. If I was to lie outrageously in my job I'd be sacked. If I did it in society I could be prosecuted / persecuted. In politics it seems to have become a badge of honour to see who can lie the most while generating poll-based support and there seem to be minimal repercussions.

100% they know there’s no consequences

Mogg telling everyone they would get cheaper trainers after brexit. Boris saying no checks on the Irish Sea and now the issue with the NI protocol.

I mean in the private sector you would unceremoniously fired in a heartbeat.

Only yesterday mogg suggested in parliament people who are againest fracking are likely connected to Putin. He actually said this with a straight face. It’s dire, just dire


My point is that in the private sector you would be fired if you bought this nonsense, not once, but over and over again. There'd be a memo to procurements about the company not needing more snake oil, accompanied by a directive to HR to start issuing pink slips.

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Post #552503  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 4:12 pm 
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Decaf wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
100% they know there’s no consequences

Mogg telling everyone they would get cheaper trainers after brexit. Boris saying no checks on the Irish Sea and now the issue with the NI protocol.

I mean in the private sector you would unceremoniously fired in a heartbeat.

Only yesterday mogg suggested in parliament people who are againest fracking are likely connected to Putin. He actually said this with a straight face. It’s dire, just dire


My point is that in the private sector you would be fired if you bought this nonsense, not once, but over and over again. There'd be a memo to procurements about the company not needing more snake oil, accompanied by a directive to HR to start issuing pink slips.


Oh 100% I agree.

If you were making deliberate decisions you knew were to the detriment of your company you would be fired without question and depending on the decision in some cases there could be legal consequences.


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Post #552504  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:14 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
100% they know there’s no consequences

Mogg telling everyone they would get cheaper trainers after brexit. Boris saying no checks on the Irish Sea and now the issue with the NI protocol.

I mean in the private sector you would unceremoniously fired in a heartbeat.

Only yesterday mogg suggested in parliament people who are againest fracking are likely connected to Putin. He actually said this with a straight face. It’s dire, just dire

They know exactly what they're doing. Honestly watch The Capture. It's a police thriller but it's *%^@*** great. Season one is excellent but season two is where it really moves up a level and all this data stuff really hits home. I know it's fictional but the second season is clearly based on Cambridge Analytica and it really makes you realise that the truth doesn't matter as long as what people say polls with certain demographics. As Decaf said, it's snake oil, but as long as that snake oil routine hits the mark, they'll keep on keeping on. They don't care about the consequences for us as long as we, as a nation keep letting them have the ball to play with. I hate the right, but *%^@ me they are much smarter than the left when it comes to this stuff.

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Post #552505  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:16 pm 
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Decaf wrote:
Bernard wrote:
Serial killers aren’t all mentally ill. Many just enjoy killing people. That makes them unusual but not mentally ill. Money laundering (if that’s what you mean by organised crime) routinely does nothing remotely comparable to what serial killers do and it’s silly to claim anything else. Remember the negative consequences of money laundering is spread so widely, possibly even across entire populations, to an almost marginal extent it often makes a negligible difference to the individuals within those populations or groups.

Serial killers end the lives of their victims, added to which are the often extremely negative consequences for their relatives. I wouldn’t want to be the victim of money laundering. But I would much, much prefer being a victim of money laundering than the victim of a serial killer, as being a direct victim of the latter would end my life.


Sorry Bernard, but that is completely incorrect.

Corruption undermines development and is responsible for mass misery. The life expectancy of least developed countries is typically more than 10 years less than middle income countries. Look at a place like Zimbabwe. Fairly well educated, wonderful climate and resources, etc. But appallingly corrupt government.

You are looking millions of excess deaths (with unfortunate consequence for relatives, indeed!), caused not just by disease but by higher murder rates (corrupt law enforcement), political instability, and natural disasters (corrupt politician don't look after storm drains or prevent people living on floodplains, or both with fire safety) .. compared to a few hundred, admittedly luridly awful, deaths caused by serial killers.

And sorry, serial killers are nuts, albeit not necessary in a barking at the moon manner.

What a stupid thing to say. Are you seriously claiming you would rather be murdered than live under a corrupt government? I simply don’t believe you. Serial killers enjoy killing. That makes them unusual but not insane.


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Post #552506  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:19 pm 
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Bernard, have you ever asked yourself why you're fascinated with serial killers? Or more importantly, has your wife?

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Post #552507  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:20 pm 
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Anyway, taking my girlfriend and the kids to the ladies game v Tottenham at the Ems tomorrow. Apparently, over 50,000 tickets have been sold. Really looking forward to it.

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Post #552508  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:32 pm 
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Decaf wrote:
My point is that in the private sector you would be fired if you bought this nonsense, not once, but over and over again. There'd be a memo to procurements about the company not needing more snake oil, accompanied by a directive to HR to start issuing pink slips.
What, like they did in the USA in the sub-prime mortgage crisis, which created a world recession! Always, always step back and ask yourself if it really is true that the private sector is more efficient, or less corrupt than the public sector. This is bandied about so often, yet strange how it is frequently the public purse which has to come to the rescue of private sector obscenities.

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Post #552509  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:37 pm 
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Darren wrote:
Bernard, have you ever asked yourself why you're fascinated with serial killers? Or more importantly, has your wife?

Probably it’s being normal. My interest is fairly limited anyway. It’s very heavily UK serial killers, and narrowing it down further, those from the UK and female. I’m way less interested in serial killers than you are with politics anyway.


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Post #552510  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:42 pm 
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grantyboy wrote:
Rich wrote:
I don’t care that much, it doesn’t keep me up at night….just something to talk about during the slow international break.
I completely get that Arsenal generate responses and clicks- but so would Liverpool and to a lesser degree Spurs, Liverpool have more fans than us in the UK and they can be quite a precious bunch as can we. So when they over celebrate, or play 16 year old Harvey Elliot we hear not a peep?
I think we got more criticism for actually beating Fulham than Liverpool did drawing with them.

It's cyclical though. Liverpool have had blips like that in the past and then come roaring back. So a jouro isnt going to go all in on a blip and then be embarrassed a week later. Arsenal on the other hand were expected to beat them so the journo can't lose if they're critical.

Look there may be a "I hate Arsenal" bias but it is also because we're still one of the biggest clubs in the world and 80% want to see the big clubs lose.

Good post Grantyboy. Arsenal will be in big trouble if the general football public stop showing bias towards us..


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Post #552511  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:50 pm 
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Bernard wrote:
Darren wrote:
Bernard, have you ever asked yourself why you're fascinated with serial killers? Or more importantly, has your wife?

Probably it’s being normal. My interest is fairly limited anyway. It’s Uk serial killers, and narrowing it down further, those from the UK and female. I’m way less interested in serial killers than you are with politics anyway.

I know it's the US but there's a new Netflix programme on Jeffrey Dahmer that's meant to be very good.

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Post #552512  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:54 pm 
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old man of hoy wrote:
Decaf wrote:
My point is that in the private sector you would be fired if you bought this nonsense, not once, but over and over again. There'd be a memo to procurements about the company not needing more snake oil, accompanied by a directive to HR to start issuing pink slips.
What, like they did in the USA in the sub-prime mortgage crisis, which created a world recession! Always, always step back and ask yourself if it really is true that the private sector is more efficient, or less corrupt than the public sector. This is bandied about so often, yet strange how it is frequently the public purse which has to come to the rescue of private sector obscenities.

Spot on. Privatisation leads to less efficiency, less accountability, higher prices and worse service. But that's not the point of it, is it? It's about a few being able to profiteer from something that worked perfectly well prior to it being privatised.

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Post #552513  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:59 pm 
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Darren wrote:
Bernard wrote:
Probably it’s being normal. My interest is fairly limited anyway. It’s Uk serial killers, and narrowing it down further, those from the UK and female. I’m way less interested in serial killers than you are with politics anyway.

I know it's the US but there's a new Netflix programme on Jeffrey Dahmer that's meant to be very good.

I’ve heard of Jeffrey Dahmer, as I have Ted Bundy and Aileen Wuornos. But I won’t watch it as Dahmer was neither British or a woman.


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Post #552514  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 6:34 pm 
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Bernard wrote:
Decaf wrote:

Sorry Bernard, but that is completely incorrect.

Corruption undermines development and is responsible for mass misery. The life expectancy of least developed countries is typically more than 10 years less than middle income countries. Look at a place like Zimbabwe. Fairly well educated, wonderful climate and resources, etc. But appallingly corrupt government.

You are looking millions of excess deaths (with unfortunate consequence for relatives, indeed!), caused not just by disease but by higher murder rates (corrupt law enforcement), political instability, and natural disasters (corrupt politician don't look after storm drains or prevent people living on floodplains, or both with fire safety) .. compared to a few hundred, admittedly luridly awful, deaths caused by serial killers.

And sorry, serial killers are nuts, albeit not necessary in a barking at the moon manner.

What a stupid thing to say. Are you seriously claiming you would rather be murdered than live under a corrupt government? I simply don’t believe you. Serial killers enjoy killing. That makes them unusual but not insane.

If you honestly think I am stupid please ignore my posts.

I'll ignore yours until you learn some manners.

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Post #552515  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 6:41 pm 
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old man of hoy wrote:
Decaf wrote:
My point is that in the private sector you would be fired if you bought this nonsense, not once, but over and over again. There'd be a memo to procurements about the company not needing more snake oil, accompanied by a directive to HR to start issuing pink slips.
What, like they did in the USA in the sub-prime mortgage crisis, which created a world recession! Always, always step back and ask yourself if it really is true that the private sector is more efficient, or less corrupt than the public sector. This is bandied about so often, yet strange how it is frequently the public purse which has to come to the rescue of private sector obscenities.

I wasn't comparing the private sector to the public sector. I was comparing the private sector to the voter, and the tendency of the latter to be a major consumer of political snake oil. The private sector has its problems, without doubt, but it usually acts in its own interest at least.

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Post #552516  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 7:10 pm 
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Decaf wrote:
Bernard wrote:
What a stupid thing to say. Are you seriously claiming you would rather be murdered than live under a corrupt government? I simply don’t believe you. Serial killers enjoy killing. That makes them unusual but not insane.

If you honestly think I am stupid please ignore my posts.

I'll ignore yours until you learn some manners.

I don’t think you’re stupid at all. I never said you were. I feel you said something stupid in that post, which isn’t the same as calling you stupid. Just saying something that is stupid doesn’t make one stupid.

Are you seriously saying you would rather be murdered than live under a corrupt government? Because that is surely what you strongly implied. Hence I think that was a stupid thing to say.

I am sorry if you feel I was being rude. But I think that has more to do with you taking what I said the wrong way rather than me lacking manners.


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Post #552517  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 8:18 pm 
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Summers: “Between Brexit, how far the Bank of England got behind the curve and now these fiscal policies, I think Britain will be remembered for having pursuing the worst macroeconomic policies of any major country in a long time.”


https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/statu ... dVU8j3l-Lg


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Post #552518  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 8:38 pm 
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Thomas Partey has pulled out of the Ghana starting XI against Brazil due to a knock picked up during the warm-up.

Hey ho.

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Post #552519  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 9:02 pm 
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long time gooner wrote:
Thomas Partey has pulled out of the Ghana starting XI against Brazil due to a knock picked up during the warm-up.

Hey ho.


What is this man made of?? The finest porcelain.


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Post #552520  Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2022 9:03 pm 
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And honestly the warm up. Designed to minimise injury in the game. Of course that’s when he’s been injured.


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