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Post #393841  Posted: Fri Oct 18, 2024 6:50 pm 
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Vince Ordinaire wrote:
Rich wrote:
Howard Webb....These guys just tie themselves in knots trying to explain away the inconsistencies.

Couldn't agree more about this. It's obvious, pathetic and dishonest.

Dishonest is the word. The people responsible for implementing the rules of the game are self-serving to the point of dishonesty. They are making money from being on TV shows backing up their mates. There is no integrity.

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Post #393842  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 7:38 am 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Gaz from Oz wrote:
OMG, the media and pundits are knock themselves out over the Tuckel appointment. I think they should have appointed Garry Neville and Jamie Carragher as joint managers. They are so good at telling everyone what should be done that it would be a breeze for them.

Feels very brexity and embarrassing. This paired with the nonsense about Carsley not singing the national anthem really makes us look like an Island of complete dickheads

You just had a loss to Greece. I think he deserves a bit of time to settle in. There are some really good young England players but simply the team is totally unbalanced so someone has to have the courage to work out which players work with each other. I was lucky enough to meet and speak with Bobby Robson (outside the WC final) just before he took over England in 1982 and he was such a gentleman and I said to him I don't envy your new job but good luck. He looked at me and nodded and just said thanks and left it at that. The expectations of English fans is something else.

Australia just changed managers after a disasterous start to our WC qualifiying. The new manager got a win against China and then a draw with Japan. Now we haven't beaten Japan in 25 years and we did play very negative football but some of the comments by fans about us was way over the top. I will take the draw every time.

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Post #393843  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 9:25 am 
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Vince Ordinaire wrote:
...The issue of the big clubs all having foreign managers is chicken and egg really, the big clubs just want to win things so they will hire someone who looks capable of that, regardless of nationality...
Yes, it is all about the employment policy of the very few who have the resources to win the Premiership - say half a dozen clubs at most. There is a huge list of non-English managers who have worked in our top league who have never been anywhere near winning or even competing for the title, simply because they haven't been employed by the big boys. There is also a substantial list of those who having been employed by the big boys still failed to lift the title - Chelsea and Spurs each have double figure examples of that.

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Post #393844  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 9:57 am 
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old man of hoy wrote:
Vince Ordinaire wrote:
...The issue of the big clubs all having foreign managers is chicken and egg really, the big clubs just want to win things so they will hire someone who looks capable of that, regardless of nationality...
Yes, it is all about the employment policy of the very few who have the resources to win the Premiership - say half a dozen clubs at most. There is a huge list of non-English managers who have worked in our top league who have never been anywhere near winning or even competing for the title, simply because they haven't been employed by the big boys. There is also a substantial list of those who having been employed by the big boys still failed to lift the title - Chelsea and Spurs each have double figure examples of that.

Nevertheless it is telling that the big clubs treat the pool of english managers rather like a leper colony, and on the few occasions big clubs have hired English managers (Gerrard, Lampard) they have been unsuccessful.

Your last point: only one team can win the title in any year. So yes.

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Post #393845  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 2:01 pm 
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old man of hoy wrote:
Ash wrote:
...this “statesman” bollocks has to go. How about the sole requirement being results on the pitch?
In fact it mostly is the results that do for them in the end rather than their character failings. I don't think it is a bad thing that the FA expect high personal standards from their manager - after all it is a position under the national spotlight. One way or another Revie, Venables and Allardyce were all authors of their own downfall - the rest were moved on by results. Of the England managers only Walter Winterbotham had what felt like a sinecure in the job. Even so, although he was in post from 1946-1962, he was never allowed to select his own teams! Since Ramsey the FA have employed many good, even great coaches, without gaining that final success. Probably the biggest mistake was not hiring Brian Clough and Peter Taylor when they were at their peak.


Fair enough, but having high personal standards is different to your remit being beyond the football. Tuchel’s remit is the football, as well it should be, and as it should have been for Southgate and every other manager before him. Being asked to comment on every social issue and taking responsibility for football in England beyond the 22 players in your squad is such a pointless distraction for an England manager, and should be treated as such.


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Post #393846  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 2:17 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Ash wrote:

I think the moment he leads England to a victory they aren’t favourites for he’ll have achieved something Southgate’s England never did.

Think this is a little unfair. Southgate knocked Germany out of a euros, beat Italy away in the nations league for the first time in ages, beat Netherlands in euro 2024.




Maybe, only a little. Germany were at a low ebb and we were relegated from the top tier of the nations league under his watch with some awful results.

I didn’t think he was that good, the way he managed to alienate Ben white when you could have had the club understanding down the right with Saka pissed me off no end. Also the way he and then the players reacted to completely justified criticism from people who are avowed England cheerleaders in Lineker and Shearer was so small time.

Kane is a problem, and has always been a problem for England. Southgate giving him every available minute also wound me up.

TOP GUN wrote:
I actually think England have done the right thing although Tuchel won’t have a clue what’s in store for him.


Yes I think it’s a great appointment, not a strong England candidate in sight and we’ve already had Sven and Capello and an Aussie of all things in charge of the rugby team! I’m interested to see what Tuchel does as Harry Kane won the golden boot under his management. International football seems a bit of a crap shoot anyway, often some nobody has a stellar tournament and makes a huge difference for a team, or you miss one crucial type of player and another team has 3 of them. it might fall into place for him. I’ll be much more interested to watch now anyway.


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Post #393847  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 2:49 pm 
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Great to see ex-Arsenal players who were good servants for the club doing well.
Leno with an assist :26surprise:
And Wellbeck with another goal.

It was interesting to hear Wellbeck talking about his injuries after the Spurs game. I think some players get branded injury prone when they have just had a run of bad luck.

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Post #393848  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 2:55 pm 
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Ash wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
Think this is a little unfair. Southgate knocked Germany out of a euros, beat Italy away in the nations league for the first time in ages, beat Netherlands in euro 2024.




Maybe, only a little. Germany were at a low ebb and we were relegated from the top tier of the nations league under his watch with some awful results.

I didn’t think he was that good, the way he managed to alienate Ben white when you could have had the club understanding down the right with Saka pissed me off no end. Also the way he and then the players reacted to completely justified criticism from people who are avowed England cheerleaders in Lineker and Shearer was so small time.

Kane is a problem, and has always been a problem for England. Southgate giving him every available minute also wound me up.

TOP GUN wrote:
I actually think England have done the right thing although Tuchel won’t have a clue what’s in store for him.


Yes I think it’s a great appointment, not a strong England candidate in sight and we’ve already had Sven and Capello and an Aussie of all things in charge of the rugby team! I’m interested to see what Tuchel does as Harry Kane won the golden boot under his management. International football seems a bit of a crap shoot anyway, often some nobody has a stellar tournament and makes a huge difference for a team, or you miss one crucial type of player and another team has 3 of them. it might fall into place for him. I’ll be much more interested to watch now anyway.

It will be interesting.
Southgate had his strengths as a manager, and his style was quite well suited to tournament play. However, you feel a more imaginative coach might be able to make more of what is a very talented group of players.

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Post #393849  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 2:59 pm 
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Spurs only 4 points behind us.
Its a bit like having a smelly tramp standing too close behind one in a queue.
In both case, one isn't really worried they will overtake, but just wishes they were a bit further back.

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Post #393850  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 3:19 pm 
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Saka out. Timber not in the squad either.


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Post #393851  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 3:56 pm 
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Location: Turnford, Broxbourne, Herts

Number
22,David Raya
Number
33,R. Calafiori
Number
6,Gabriel Magalhães (c), Captain
Number
2,W. Saliba
Number4,
B. White
Number23,
Mikel Merino
Number5,
T. Partey
Number41,
D. Rice
Number19,
L. Trossard
Number29,
K. Havertz
Number30,
R. Sterling

Substitutes
Number20,
Jorginho
Number36,
T. Setford
Number46,
I. Kabia
Number15,
J. Kiwior
Number49,
M. Lewis-Skelly
Number11,
Gabriel Martinelli
Number53,
E. Nwaneri
Number17,
O. Zinchenko
Number9,
Gabriel Jesus
s
Match Officials
Referee: Robert Jones


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Post #393852  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 4:12 pm 
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bubblechris wrote:
Number
22,David Raya
Number
33,R. Calafiori
Number
6,Gabriel Magalhães (c), Captain
Number
2,W. Saliba
Number4,
B. White
Number23,
Mikel Merino
Number5,
T. Partey
Number41,
D. Rice
Number19,
L. Trossard
Number29,
K. Havertz
Number30,
R. Sterling

Substitutes
Number20,
Jorginho
Number36,
T. Setford
Number46,
I. Kabia
Number15,
J. Kiwior
Number49,
M. Lewis-Skelly
Number11,
Gabriel Martinelli
Number53,
E. Nwaneri
Number17,
O. Zinchenko
Number9,
Gabriel Jesus
s
Match Officials
Referee: Robert Jones

Pretty strong. But how can we do without our talisman?

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Post #393853  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 4:46 pm 
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Decaf wrote:
bubblechris wrote:
Number
22,David Raya
Number
33,R. Calafiori
Number
6,Gabriel Magalhães (c), Captain
Number
2,W. Saliba
Number4,
B. White
Number23,
Mikel Merino
Number5,
T. Partey
Number41,
D. Rice
Number19,
L. Trossard
Number29,
K. Havertz
Number30,
R. Sterling

Substitutes
Number20,
Jorginho
Number36,
T. Setford
Number46,
I. Kabia
Number15,
J. Kiwior
Number49,
M. Lewis-Skelly
Number11,
Gabriel Martinelli
Number53,
E. Nwaneri
Number17,
O. Zinchenko
Number9,
Gabriel Jesus
s
Match Officials
Referee: Robert Jones

Pretty strong. But how can we do without our talisman?

Not the best first 15 minutes from Sterling in his place.


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Post #393854  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 4:55 pm 
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Lincoln gooner wrote:
Decaf wrote:
Pretty strong. But how can we do without our talisman?

Not the best first 15 minutes from Sterling in his place.

Some promising signs?
Very disjointed going forward. Its not too surprising given how many new partnerships there are in the team.

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Post #393855  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 4:58 pm 
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Playing like England.

Possible saliba red


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Post #393856  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 4:58 pm 
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Why or why? We sabotage ourselves again :36angers:

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Post #393857  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 4:59 pm 
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gooner7 wrote:
Lucky yellow, could have been red


Ben white was level, so far out this will be b%*&s%*^ if it goes to red. *%^@ this.


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Post #393858  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 4:59 pm 
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gooner7 wrote:
Lucky yellow, could have been red


Very. Ten yards closer to goal and it would have been.

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Post #393859  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:00 pm 
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Jesus. Ffs

Seems harsh but you can’t complain really

Misses Liverpool. *%^@*** nightmare


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Post #393860  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:01 pm 
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:8angers:

No complaints, though.

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Post #393861  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:01 pm 
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3rd red card already this season

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Post #393862  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:01 pm 
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And there’s the b%*&s%*^ rub of the green that goes against again. *%^@’s sake!!!

YOU can’t say Ben white won’t get there!!!

Lost him for Liverpool as well. These reds could legitimately cost us the league.


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Post #393863  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:03 pm 
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Held to a higher standard than any other team. 45 yards from goal doesn’t even have the ball under control and they are certain that’s a clear goal scoring opportunity.

Var is Jared Gillet self confessed Liverpool fan and he’s done this to us many many times before


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Post #393864  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:04 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Held to a higher standard than any other team. 45 yards from goal doesn’t even have the ball under control and they are certain that’s a clear goal scoring opportunity.

Var is Jared Gillet self confessed Liverpool fan and he’s done this to us many many times before


Oh **** off you baby. It's a feckin clear red.

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Post #393865  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:05 pm 
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Sigh.


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Post #393866  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:06 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Held to a higher standard than any other team. 45 yards from goal doesn’t even have the ball under control and they are certain that’s a clear goal scoring opportunity.

Var is Jared Gillet self confessed Liverpool fan and he’s done this to us many many times before

It was a fair decision.


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Post #393867  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:07 pm 
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Liverpool fan on var ensures Saliba is sent off to be suspended for the Arsenal v Liverpool game


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Post #393868  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:07 pm 
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Sterling off, we were carrying him anyway tbh.


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Post #393869  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:08 pm 
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Kiwior for Sterling.


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Post #393870  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:09 pm 
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Gunfire wrote:
Rich wrote:
Held to a higher standard than any other team. 45 yards from goal doesn’t even have the ball under control and they are certain that’s a clear goal scoring opportunity.

Var is Jared Gillet self confessed Liverpool fan and he’s done this to us many many times before


Oh **** off you baby. It's a feckin clear red.

They simply aren’t all given. I’d refer you to an Arsenal game v Leicester when aubameyang was clear through in a similar position and was wrestled to the floor by Jonny Evans and he only got a yellow.

The problem is not the decision in isolation - as I always say - it’s the consistency and that we never get the benefit of the doubt


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Post #393871  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:09 pm 
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Lincoln gooner wrote:
Rich wrote:
Held to a higher standard than any other team. 45 yards from goal doesn’t even have the ball under control and they are certain that’s a clear goal scoring opportunity.

Var is Jared Gillet self confessed Liverpool fan and he’s done this to us many many times before

It was a fair decision.


Problem as ever is the threshold. If the ref gave it that’s one thing. But to overturn, clear and obvious?? Not for me.


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Post #393872  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:09 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Liverpool fan on var ensures Saliba is sent off to be suspended for the Arsenal v Liverpool game

If that had been Virgil next week against us you would have been screaming red.


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Post #393873  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:09 pm 
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He misses Chelsea and Newcastle as well. Ffs


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Post #393874  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:11 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
He misses Chelsea and Newcastle as well. Ffs


Is it three games? Isn’t that only for violent conduct?


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Post #393875  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:12 pm 
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Martinelli on at some point you’d think. Maybe wait for the second half…


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Post #393876  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:13 pm 
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I think it’s a yellow. It’s a long way out on the halfway line . Asking for trouble though.


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Post #393877  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:16 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
I think it’s a yellow. It’s a long way out on the halfway line . Asking for trouble though.


And that seems reasonable. Some think red - also reasonable. How is that the condition of overturning a clear and obvious error?

It’s probably some bollocks about assessing a red so clear and obvious doesn’t come into it. I bet it’s that.


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Post #393878  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:18 pm 
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It will be a major achievement if we can win this with 10 men and without our 3 best players, Saka Ødegaard and Saliba.


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Post #393879  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:21 pm 
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Ash wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
I think it’s a yellow. It’s a long way out on the halfway line . Asking for trouble though.


And that seems reasonable. Some think red - also reasonable. How is that the condition of overturning a clear and obvious error?

It’s probably some bollocks about assessing a red so clear and obvious doesn’t come into it. I bet it’s that.

It’s re refereeing a game that the ref had a perfectly clear view of. Re refereeing games is exactly what PGMOL have said they are strictly avoiding.


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Post #393880  Posted: Sat Oct 19, 2024 5:24 pm 
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Ash wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
I think it’s a yellow. It’s a long way out on the halfway line . Asking for trouble though.


And that seems reasonable. Some think red - also reasonable. How is that the condition of overturning a clear and obvious error?

It’s probably some bollocks about assessing a red so clear and obvious doesn’t come into it. I bet it’s that.


When it goes to VAR the ref always bottles it.

You can’t really say it’s clear and obvious


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