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Post #532161  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 9:30 am 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
Even though football is far more widely followed than when I first got into it some 20 odd years ago (has it been that long?), some holdouts, some 'old school' friends still tease me from time to time. I had to laugh at this one though.



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Post #532162  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 9:48 am 
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C'mon Arsenal.com what are you waiting for?
https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/57873034

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Post #532163  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 10:12 am 
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Bernard wrote:
Hi Rich. I’m afraid I don’t automatically believe trusted sources. Reports say we’ve bid £17m for Aouar. To me that sounds more realistic than offers up to £40m for a central midfielder or £30m for a creative midfielder.

I think the Aouar situation is quite interesting and shows how fans (including myself probably) get carried away when assassing players we don't watch regularly. Last summer he was seen as a can't miss signing after some really good performances in the CL - one of those players we'd only get one chance of getting before they inevitably went to a much bigger club. Had we paid 50-60m for him then a lot of fans would've been completely fine with it.

This summer many of the same fans seem annoyed by every article linking him to us, whethe it's reliable or not, and he's suddenly someone we shouldn't pay more than 20-25m for, if we should even bother signing him at all. And that's after one season at 23 years old that wasn't great but certainly not disastrous when looking from a statistical point of view - 7 goals and 3 assists from a central midfielder isn't that poor really.


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Post #532164  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 12:40 pm 
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Anyone know if the Rangers game is available free to Gold members or does everyone have to pay the £7.99 'match pass'?


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Post #532165  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 12:53 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
On the white fee. Apparently Leeds offered 30m for him last season and chelsea were interested now hence we had to move quickly. As expensive as it seems it sounds the going rate

Apparently, the 'going rate' for Macallan 1926 whiskey is £1.45m. But that doesn't mean you should cough up the £1.45m. First, you should bear in mind the following
a) can you afford it?
b) is it actually any good?
c) it's really pointless if you intend to mix it with coke.

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Post #532166  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 12:57 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Rich wrote:
We need the home grown core. With the restrictions on 17 non home grown players we need to find a way to have the best home grown players. Man U have consistently paid a lot of money for these sorts of players to ensure it gives them maximum flexibility when signing foreign players.
£50m is an awful lot of money but that English premium stays with the player. I’ve not watched him enough but I don’t think you desperately sign a young English CB for £50m from a club like Brighton if you haven’t really considered how he fits in the team and the quality he will bring. Seems like a modern CB and by that I mean a player who pretty m h has the technical and passing ability of a top level central midfielder. Plenty of pace as well

Could end up..

Ramsdale - Tierney, Holding, White, Chambers.

A defence littered with revolting English people

Unless the intention is to buy White for £50m and then loan him out to Spata Prague for the next three seasons.

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Post #532167  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 1:11 pm 
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Decaf wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
Could end up..

Ramsdale - Tierney, Holding, White, Chambers.

A defence littered with revolting English people

Unless the intention is to buy White for £50m and then loan him out to Spata Prague for the next three seasons.


To be honest white is a good example of the loan system working well as he impressed during his time at Leeds when he was loaned at the same age as Saliba.


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Post #532168  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 1:40 pm 
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Balogun looks quality


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Post #532169  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 2:17 pm 
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1979gooner wrote:

Balogun looks quality

Brilliant. An unexpected bonus.

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Post #532170  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 3:00 pm 
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:icon_question1: How strange, two for one Balogun on both sides, same number subbed at same time?

Am I missing something?

How did our Balogun play? The one playing in Red :1laughter:


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Post #532171  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 3:26 pm 
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Good luck in Italy, Giroud. I've always liked you even when some gooners didn't. :7laughter:

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/57873043

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Post #532172  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 3:52 pm 
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Decaf wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
On the white fee. Apparently Leeds offered 30m for him last season and chelsea were interested now hence we had to move quickly. As expensive as it seems it sounds the going rate

Apparently, the 'going rate' for Macallan 1926 whiskey is £1.45m. But that doesn't mean you should cough up the £1.45m. First, you should bear in mind the following
a) can you afford it?
b) is it actually any good?
c) it's really pointless if you intend to mix it with coke.

Most expensive Macallan whiskey I could find was their 55 year old which is £145,000 for a 70cl bottle. 55 years ago is obviously 1966. If the 1926 is £1.45m, does another 40 years really make a difference of £1,305,000 (£1,450,000 - £145,000)? Or did you put an m instead of a k?

I know little about whiskey and rarely drink it, unless I go to Jockland and am offered it and it would be rude not to. But I was once told that age makes little difference to its taste, unlike age can do with fine wine. I don’t know if that is true as I was either told it or saw it on a telly documentary (I can’t recall). But if it is true, I’m surprised if 40 years makes a difference of £1.3m+.


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Post #532173  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 5:27 pm 
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Age does make a difference to whiskey, Bernard, but unlike wine it does not mature once bottled. It is the time in the barrel that counts. Irish whiskey must be matured in the barrel for at least 3 years, but a 12 year whiskey will generally be much better as it softens at it ages. It also evaporates. I doubt there is much value in terms of taste in a 100 year old whiskey. Chances are it wouldn't taste good.

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Post #532174  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 6:02 pm 
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Bernard wrote:
Decaf wrote:
Apparently, the 'going rate' for Macallan 1926 whiskey is £1.45m. But that doesn't mean you should cough up the £1.45m. First, you should bear in mind the following
a) can you afford it?
b) is it actually any good?
c) it's really pointless if you intend to mix it with coke.

Most expensive Macallan whiskey I could find was their 55 year old which is £145,000 for a 70cl bottle. 55 years ago is obviously 1966. If the 1926 is £1.45m, does another 40 years really make a difference of £1,305,000 (£1,450,000 - £145,000)? Or did you put an m instead of a k?

I know little about whiskey and rarely drink it, unless I go to Jockland and am offered it and it would be rude not to. But I was once told that age makes little difference to its taste, unlike age can do with fine wine. I don’t know if that is true as I was either told it or saw it on a telly documentary (I can’t recall). But if it is true, I’m surprised if 40 years makes a difference of £1.3m+.

Greetings Bernard. Such a whiskey would be available only on special auctions, and would come to market fairly rarely. You'd need to wait for such an auction or track down a collector.

The value of something like whiskey, beyond a certain level, depends on what people are prepared to pay for it.

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Post #532175  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 6:04 pm 
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dec wrote:
Age does make a difference to whiskey, Bernard, but unlike wine it does not mature once bottled. It is the time in the barrel that counts. Irish whiskey must be matured in the barrel for at least 3 years, but a 12 year whiskey will generally be much better as it softens at it ages. It also evaporates. I doubt there is much value in terms of taste in a 100 year old whiskey. Chances are it wouldn't taste good.

Ah yes, that’s right it was age once bottled. Thanks, as I say I’m not an expert in whiskey.


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Post #532176  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 6:04 pm 
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dec wrote:
Age does make a difference to whiskey, Bernard, but unlike wine it does not mature once bottled. It is the time in the barrel that counts. Irish whiskey must be matured in the barrel for at least 3 years, but a 12 year whiskey will generally be much better as it softens at it ages. It also evaporates. I doubt there is much value in terms of taste in a 100 year old whiskey. Chances are it wouldn't taste good.

Perhaps. But I can see the allure and wouldn't mind giving it a try. Good thing I don't have a spare couple of million!

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Post #532177  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 6:40 pm 
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2-2 draw with Rangers today.
Tavares started and scored our first, got in down the left and slotted a nice finish with his right in the far corner.
Nketiah got the 2nd.
We’d fallen behind twice to goals from corners.
By all accounts we had all the game, loads of guilt edge chances but only took 2 while conceding from 2 set pieces from maybe only 3 chances they had.

Apparently Aubameyang missed 3 total sitters


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Post #532178  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 7:38 pm 
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1979gooner wrote:

Balogun looks quality


Thanks 79. Much appreciated.


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Post #532179  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 8:16 pm 
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Decaf wrote:
dec wrote:
Age does make a difference to whiskey, Bernard, but unlike wine it does not mature once bottled. It is the time in the barrel that counts. Irish whiskey must be matured in the barrel for at least 3 years, but a 12 year whiskey will generally be much better as it softens at it ages. It also evaporates. I doubt there is much value in terms of taste in a 100 year old whiskey. Chances are it wouldn't taste good.

Perhaps. But I can see the allure and wouldn't mind giving it a try. Good thing I don't have a spare couple of million!

Oh I would definitely give it a go, as long as I knew it wouldn't kill me.

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Post #532180  Posted: Sat Jul 17, 2021 9:11 pm 
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Next season is a big season for Pépé. He ended the season on his best form for us.
I also think Smith-Rowe could really step up a notch for us next year.

The other player I’m really keen to see more of is Balogun.

Desperately need to get rid of the deadwood and put our energy in to these guys with ‘high ceilings’


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Post #532181  Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 9:06 am 
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Arteta: “We’re going to have some new faces arriving probably, so very positive

I’m sure he’s talking about Lokonga which is basically done and Ben White which is meant to be done when he returns from his holiday on July 26.

Back up young LB for a bargain fee, young Dynamic CM probably as a Ceballos replacement and a right sided Young English CB. That’s not a bad start to the window but I think 3 key positions to add still are creative midfield and a deeper central midfielder to replace Xhaka assuming he goes. And a first choice RB, Also needed is a back up Gk. so still plenty of work to do in the market. Fill those 4 positions with quality and we should as a minimum be getting back in the top 6.

Then it depends what we can get rid of. Kolasinac, willian, Bellerin, xhaka, Nketiah, torreira, Nelson, Willock, AMN, Lacazette all need a decision and there is money to be recouped


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Post #532182  Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 9:34 am 
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Rich wrote:
Arteta: “We’re going to have some new faces arriving probably, so very positive

I’m sure he’s talking about Lokonga which is basically done and Ben White which is meant to be done when he returns from his holiday on July 26.

Back up young LB for a bargain fee, young Dynamic CM probably as a Ceballos replacement and a right sided Young English CB. That’s not a bad start to the window but I think 3 key positions to add still are creative midfield and a deeper central midfielder to replace Xhaka assuming he goes. And a first choice RB, Also needed is a back up Gk. so still plenty of work to do in the market. Fill those 4 positions with quality and we should as a minimum be getting back in the top 6.

Then it depends what we can get rid of. Kolasinac, willian, Bellerin, xhaka, Nketiah, torreira, Nelson, Willock, AMN, Lacazette all need a decision and there is money to be recouped


People say this every year. There are none out there as far as I can see for sale.

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Post #532183  Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 11:08 am 
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I'm making absolutely nothing of Aubameyang's missed chances. It's preseason. After a lay off. I'm just happy he was free and clear for such chances. I'd love to see more of that.

Balogun and Martinelli for the future. :58big-emoticons:

If we get Smith and a creative center mid, we should improve.

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Post #532184  Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 11:15 am 
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Rich wrote:
Arteta: “We’re going to have some new faces arriving probably, so very positive

I’m sure he’s talking about Lokonga which is basically done and Ben White which is meant to be done when he returns from his holiday on July 26.

Back up young LB for a bargain fee, young Dynamic CM probably as a Ceballos replacement and a right sided Young English CB. That’s not a bad start to the window but I think 3 key positions to add still are creative midfield and a deeper central midfielder to replace Xhaka assuming he goes. And a first choice RB, Also needed is a back up Gk. so still plenty of work to do in the market. Fill those 4 positions with quality and we should as a minimum be getting back in the top 6.

Then it depends what we can get rid of. Kolasinac, willian, Bellerin, xhaka, Nketiah, torreira, Nelson, Willock, AMN, Lacazette all need a decision and there is money to be recouped


We are going to have to give away Torreira, Kolasinac and Willian aren’t we. Just finding someone to pay their wages will be a challenge. Those 3 players salary alone is costing us about 400k a week ! For players not involved really. Our transfer business has been bonkers paying fortunes to average or past it talent

I wouldn’t be in a hurry to offload Lacazette personally.

What I don’t understand is what is the difference between a loan with obligation or a transfer simply paid on instalments ? Sounds the same? all these players are moving on loans right now.


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Post #532185  Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 11:48 am 
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When we were first linked to Neves I was a bit underwhelmed as I thought he was a like for like Xhaka replacement, decent passer but not pacey or mobile enough. Xhaka without the brain farts. But looking at Neves stats he’s far more than that, his rate of tackles, interceptions and turnovers is miles better than Xhaka, and at Wolves he tended to play a lot more longer passes which is probably why his stats are lower there.
If we can get the price right for him it could be a savvy move. People raised eyebrows at £40m for Jota from Wolves.

Outside of the prem there are bargain deals to be done. Aouar for £20m is good but Camavinga for £25m is outstanding.


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Post #532186  Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 12:08 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Arteta: “We’re going to have some new faces arriving probably, so very positive

I’m sure he’s talking about Lokonga which is basically done and Ben White which is meant to be done when he returns from his holiday on July 26.

Back up young LB for a bargain fee, young Dynamic CM probably as a Ceballos replacement and a right sided Young English CB. That’s not a bad start to the window but I think 3 key positions to add still are creative midfield and a deeper central midfielder to replace Xhaka assuming he goes. And a first choice RB, Also needed is a back up Gk. so still plenty of work to do in the market. Fill those 4 positions with quality and we should as a minimum be getting back in the top 6.

Then it depends what we can get rid of. Kolasinac, willian, Bellerin, xhaka, Nketiah, torreira, Nelson, Willock, AMN, Lacazette all need a decision and there is money to be recouped

I'd keep Lacazette, especially if we are going to be relying more on younger players. I though he was impressive last season, both as a leader and and terms of his play. It was very unfortunate that he was injured towards the end of the season.

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Post #532187  Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 12:13 pm 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
I'm making absolutely nothing of Aubameyang's missed chances. It's preseason. After a lay off. I'm just happy he was free and clear for such chances. I'd love to see more of that.

I think you are quite correct. I think the same applies to Lacca. The thing is that they are are getting into those positions. Its when the chances aren't coming that you know they are out of sorts.

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Post #532188  Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 12:58 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Arteta: “We’re going to have some new faces arriving probably, so very positive"

Maybe his wife is expecting twins ?


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Post #532189  Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 4:12 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
What I don’t understand is what is the difference between a loan with obligation or a transfer simply paid on instalments ? Sounds the same? all these players are moving on loans right now.

I assume the loan with an obligation to buy means the buying club has nothing to pay for a full year, before they then start the payments of the transfer fee no doubt in instalments. It presumably delays having to pay anything for twelve months.

Who knows but some conditions could limit the obligation to buy. Would the obligation still be in place if, for an extreme example, the player dies in a car crash (or of anything else)? That’s obviously the most extreme ‘get out’ of any possible exceptions to the obligation but it wouldn’t surprise me if there were routinely some in place.


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Post #532190  Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 4:45 pm 
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Eff Danny Mills

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Post #532191  Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 8:53 pm 
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Ben White’s stats last season vs all our CB


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Post #532192  Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 10:42 pm 
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Have to agree with the Romford Pele, £50m is a bit OTT for Ben White, even though English. Hope he won't disappoint when the time comes. At least not for Arteta, Arsenal supporters everywhere, the current players. As the MSM will be salivating to rip the club and the hiarchy to bits. The word flop comes to mind.

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Post #532193  Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 10:44 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Ben White’s stats last season vs all our CB


So partly I’m taking from that Holding isn’t the shitbucket everyone keeps making him out to be.

You can see the thinking behind signing him quite clearly in those stats, in case we already didn’t know. We haven’t actually signed him yet though have we?


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Post #532194  Posted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 11:50 pm 
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Ash wrote:
Rich wrote:
Ben White’s stats last season vs all our CB

So partly I’m taking from that Holding isn’t the shitbucket everyone keeps making him out to be.

You can see the thinking behind signing him quite clearly in those stats, in case we already didn’t know. We haven’t actually signed him yet though have we?

Does Holding get much criticism here? If he does, I’ve not noticed it. It generally seems quite gentle good but not great type stuff. But I would warn against putting absolute faith in player stats.

A comparison of the stats for Maguire and Mustafi at the end of Maguire’s last season at Leicester (2018/19) implied Mustafi had outplayed him that season. From memory there was only one single category where Maguire had the better stats. But Manchester United still coughed up £85m for him.


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Post #532195  Posted: Mon Jul 19, 2021 4:20 am 
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Rich wrote:
Ben White’s stats last season vs all our CB


I raised my eyebrow at the fee but he's a good defender and may become a great one. Who knows. We need a developed CB alongside Gabriel and White is.

People said at the time Man Utd grossly overpaid for Rio, 28 mil was it? Even by today's money its still not a small amount. We paid way more than we normally did for players when we bought Sol. When we put it into his salary. First, 100k a week player.

Liverpool paid 75 mil for van Dijk. All the aforementioned defenders were integral to a title. Not that White will win us a title but we need a solid defense. We can't leak goals as we have been or keep giving up leads and closing out games.

We are developing a good defense. Partey in front of a quality back 4 and keeper.

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Post #532196  Posted: Mon Jul 19, 2021 4:33 am 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
We paid way more than we normally did for players when we bough Sol.

I’m probably one of the posters he has blocked. So can someone else explain to him that we didn’t buy Sol Campbell for “way more than we normally did” spend on players? We signed him at the end of his contract at Tottenham. I don’t suppose Tottenham would have considered for one second selling him to Arsenal.


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Post #532197  Posted: Mon Jul 19, 2021 5:42 am 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
Eff Danny Mills

Mills really hates Arsenal. It’s strange really, I get that in his time we were one of the top two teams and regularly beat his teams and our left side gave him a torrid time so he might be bitter about it but it was all 15 years ago. He needs to get over whatever grudge he has and it makes him look stupid as a pundit.

In the last 24 hours he’s said Pires was the first player to bring diving in to this league and that he’s amazed Ben white is going anywhere near us because we don’t win things.

Mills doesn’t get the mainstream gigs anymore, whenever I’ve heard him on radio on our games he just can’t hide his disdain for us. He works on some of the clickbait radio/tv/online stuff - if it’s just a wind up method to get fans phoning in to disagree then fair enough to make your living but you can’t be taken seriously as a pundit at all then


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Post #532198  Posted: Mon Jul 19, 2021 5:49 am 
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We had the 3rd best defence in the league last year so I think we’re targeting White to improve our build up and attacking play. He’s very good on the ball and dribbles the ball out of defence. It was a big problem for us last year of not being able to transition the ball quickly enough forwards meaning we often had to break down defences with lots of men behind the ball and at least for the first part of the season trying to do that without a creative mid!


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Post #532199  Posted: Mon Jul 19, 2021 6:58 am 
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You'd think he'd hate Man Utd more. I don't understand the Michael Owen hatred as well. I get Sherringscum's hatred of us. Fat Sam blames Wenger and by extension Arsenal's management for the managerial jobs at the biggest clubs going to foreigners.

I am hoping some of that hate isn't a wee bit of xenophobia. A lot of people thought we were a bit too French/Foreign in those days.

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Post #532200  Posted: Mon Jul 19, 2021 7:06 am 
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In sports similar to football (ice hockey, basketball, American football) there are some similar strategies and that is to build from the back, specifically, when you build a side from the ground up, start with the defense. This can take on a few different looks. It can be defense by ball possession (Brazil, Barcelona) or just having a damn good, no compromising tough defense that looks scary (1986 Chicago Bears, Arsenal's of the 90s and frankly, Arsenal of the early 00s, Leeds in the Revie era from what I understand, Oakland Raiders of the '70s).

There are some sides that will simply outscore you as a strategy (Golden State Warriors, Keegan's Newcastle, Liverpool of the 70s and 80s) but I am a fan of having a solid, air tight defense. You can be 1-0 to the Arsenal when you need be but also 'Scoring, Scoring Arsenal' as well.

I thought Wenger in the last several years of his time with us spent way too much of the little money we had on attacking players and rolled the dice on the defense, with some success (Kos) but more than a few duds.

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