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Post #530801  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 5:00 pm 
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socrates wrote:
So apparently we’ve bid £40m for White and at the same time are in the process of selling Mavropanos to Stuttgart for £7m.

Now, Mavropanos was one of the most promising young defenders in the Bundesliga last season, a regular starter for a relatively high profile club, getting plaudits for his performances and just capped for Greece.

Why are we asking a measly £7m. I’d expect to pay that for a young defender in the English League Two or Ligue 2 in France.

I've said the same thing many times. Of course we don't know exactly what the 'asking prices' really are, but why are our asking prices reported so often consistently lower (or reasonable) than any other club.

I'm hearing we're interested in Ramsdale the Sheff Utd GK. The rumours say £20m but Sheff Utd bosses want £40m because of his england call up. Ramsdale has had back to back relegations and I didn't see anything in the last two seasons that suggests he's any more than a £10m GK. He's only in the England squad because of injuries to Pope and Henderson.

If the interested club is a prem club then it seems fair game to set the price sky high. So Nketiah has 3 english clubs after him, why aren't we saying it is £25m to start the bidding? Brewster and Solanke went for that sort of price and Nketiah has a better record than both at club and international level.


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Post #530802  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 5:02 pm 
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Chris Wheatley (football Journalist )on twitter
Told that Arsenal have made offers for four players in the past week.

They're confident of wrapping up two of those deals soon - believed to be Ben White and Albert Sambi Lokonga.

Xhaka, Mavropanos & Guendouzi leaving, with Eddie Nketiah also for sale.


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Post #530803  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 5:20 pm 
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Bale missed his penalty. Shockingly poor penalty.

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Post #530804  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 5:28 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Chris Wheatley (football Journalist )on twitter
Told that Arsenal have made offers for four players in the past week.

Yeah, a lot of signs pointing to us going big this summer. Need to get the deals over the line of course, but encouraging start to the summer.


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Post #530805  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 5:38 pm 
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Despite the early misses, Ramsey is playing a blinder


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Post #530806  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 5:48 pm 
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Hazuki wrote:
Despite the early misses, Ramsey is playing a blinder

He is indeed (or at least he was until he went off).

Most entertaining game of the tournament so far.

Referee is pretty useless and officious.

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Post #530807  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 5:52 pm 
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Cracking finish to a cracking game.

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Post #530808  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 5:57 pm 
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long time gooner wrote:
Cracking finish to a cracking game.

God, who was the co-commentator on BBC1? What an annoying prat!


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Post #530809  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 5:59 pm 
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Bale is fantastic. Man of the match.
Worth staying up to watch. Fast moving football.

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Post #530810  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 5:59 pm 
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Bernard wrote:
long time gooner wrote:
Cracking finish to a cracking game.

God, who was the co-commentator on BBC1? What an annoying prat!

Is that tongue in cheek Bernard and you do know who it is? Robbie Savage, a prat at the best of times, adds nothing insightful and is even worse when he commentates on Wales


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Post #530811  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 7:19 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Top 6 sides we've had to play in the opening 6 fixtures for the past 4 seasons. Compare to Man U who don't play a top 6 side until they face Leicester in week 8.

18/19:
MCI (h)
CHE (a)

19/20:
LIV (a)
TOT (h)
UTD (a)

20/21:
LIV (a)
MCI (a)
UTD (a)

21/22:
CHE (h)
MCI (a)
TOT (h)

Don’t want to ruin a hard luck story but Spurs didn’t finish top 6 last year. So technically we have a better start than the previous year. Then of course we play Chelsea who we beat home and away last season. If we have improved then a home game against Spurs should give us a big advantage.

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Post #530812  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 7:27 pm 
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Italy are superb. The football is top top drawer.

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Post #530813  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 7:36 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Chris Wheatley (football Journalist )on twitter
Told that Arsenal have made offers for four players in the past week.

They're confident of wrapping up two of those deals soon - believed to be Ben White and Albert Sambi Lokonga.

Xhaka, Mavropanos & Guendouzi leaving, with Eddie Nketiah also for sale.

Ramsdale, white, lokonga and Maddison?

That little lot would cost around 140 odd million? Makes sense though.

Then if we sell Bellerin and Lacazette we recruit like for like replacements with the money obtained.


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Post #530814  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 8:08 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Rich wrote:
Chris Wheatley (football Journalist )on twitter
Told that Arsenal have made offers for four players in the past week.

They're confident of wrapping up two of those deals soon - believed to be Ben White and Albert Sambi Lokonga.

Xhaka, Mavropanos & Guendouzi leaving, with Eddie Nketiah also for sale.

Ramsdale, white, lokonga and Maddison?

That little lot would cost around 140 odd million? Makes sense though.

Then if we sell Bellerin and Lacazette we recruit like for like replacements with the money obtained.


White and Maddison both massively overpriced with the English premium. Is that really a good use of scarce resources? There must be better value around surely.


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Post #530815  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 8:10 pm 
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Gunfire wrote:
Italy are superb. The football is top top drawer.

Just banged in their second. They are great to watch.


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Post #530816  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 8:12 pm 
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Oh well, we can scrub Locatelli off the list of possibles.


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Post #530817  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 8:14 pm 
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socrates wrote:
Oh well, we can scrub Locatelli off the list of possibles.


Sneaky bid would be worth a shot.

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Post #530818  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 8:20 pm 
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socrates wrote:
White and Maddison both massively overpriced with the English premium. Is that really a good use of scarce resources? There must be better value around surely.

I get what you mean, sadly if you want English players you're never getting value for money. I'm not overly keen on Maddison myself, but if we have money this summer I like to see us go for the players we really want rather than finding better deals for players who are maybe not as good. Think White in particular has the potential to be an excellent, ball-playing defender.


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Post #530819  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 8:24 pm 
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socrates wrote:
Oh well, we can scrub Locatelli of the list of possibles.

Just what I was thinking. You can't let these sorts of players have great tournaments before you make a bid. £50m+ midfielder already on the back of these first two games.


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Post #530820  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 8:46 pm 
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socrates wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
Ramsdale, white, lokonga and Maddison?

That little lot would cost around 140 odd million? Makes sense though.

Then if we sell Bellerin and Lacazette we recruit like for like replacements with the money obtained.


White and Maddison both massively overpriced with the English premium. Is that really a good use of scarce resources? There must be better value around surely.


Honestly at the moment I think we need committed players and recruiting players who have already impressed in the league makes sense. I question the long term motivation of some of our recent signings like Torreira and Willian.

Luiz out white in ? That sounds like we are thinking about our future logically right ?


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Post #530821  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 8:51 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Bernard wrote:
God, who was the co-commentator on BBC1? What an annoying prat!

Is that tongue in cheek Bernard and you do know who it is? Robbie Savage, a prat at the best of times, adds nothing insightful and is even worse when he commentates on Wales

Hi Rich. No I didn’t know it was Robbie Savage, although it doesn’t surprise me to hear it was him. I didn’t see him introduced in the pre-match chat. In fact I haven’t been watching much of the Euro games. A few minutes here and there, but the only one I’ve seen all of was Germany’s loss to France.

That’s the way football is for me these days. Unless I have an emotional affinity with a team, I never watch games from the kick off to final whistle. Hence the only matches I see in full are all those involving Arsenal, and whenever Bayern Munich, Glasgow Rangers and the German national team are on live (far, far fewer). As I’ve said, I’m therefore not the person to give legitimate views on players from other clubs. Take this Ben White for example. Hazuki is very positive and socrates seems less convinced he’s worth the money.

I don’t know which of them is right as the only times I’d have seen him are when he’s played against us for Brighton, and I can’t say he really did anything to stick in my mind.


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Post #530822  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 8:51 pm 
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Locatelli looks like a player, but sadly I think he's bound for Juventus. They always seem like the top destination for Italian players, much like Bayern are for Germans.


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Post #530823  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 8:53 pm 
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Bernard wrote:
Hazuki is very positive and socrates seems less convinced he’s worth the money.

Think that tells you everything you need to know about how to rate White, to be fair.


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Post #530824  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 8:56 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
socrates wrote:

White and Maddison both massively overpriced with the English premium. Is that really a good use of scarce resources? There must be better value around surely.


Honestly at the moment I think we need committed players and recruiting players who have already impressed in the league makes sense. I question the long term motivation of some of our recent signings like Torreira and Willian.

Luiz out white in ? That sounds like we are thinking about our future logically right ?


It really depends how much money we have to spend. Of course £50m represents good value if he forms the backbone of our defence for years to come but is he really that good? I can't say I've ever really noticed him and thought he's a great player.

I'm thinking whether £100m on White and Maddison would be better spent on Grealish. It's just massive money whichever way you look at it and not something I realistically expected to be talking about.

Personally, I don't see Maddison at Arsenal. Too much money for player who's very good, but not great, and comes with some baggage.


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Post #530825  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 8:58 pm 
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Mama Mia...that was a fantastic football match from the Italians. Meanwhile, Xhaka's shop value may have dropped a bit. AS Roma may just have their bid readjusted if still interested.

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Post #530826  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:05 pm 
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Bernard wrote:
Rich wrote:
Is that tongue in cheek Bernard and you do know who it is? Robbie Savage, a prat at the best of times, adds nothing insightful and is even worse when he commentates on Wales

Hi Rich. No I didn’t know it was Robbie Savage, although it doesn’t surprise me to hear it was him. I didn’t see him introduced in the pre-match chat. In fact I haven’t been watching much of the Ruro games. A few minutes here and there, but the only one I’ve seen all of was Germany’s loss to France.

That’s the way football is for me these days. Unless I have an emotional affinity with a team, I never watch games from the kick off to final whistle. Hence the only matches I see in full are all those involving Arsenal, and whenever Bayern Munich, Glasgow Rangers and the German national team are on live (far, far fewer). As I’ve said, I’m therefore not the person to give legitimate views on players from other clubs. Take this Ben White for example. Hazuki is very positive and socrates seems less convinced he’s worth the money.

I don’t know which of them is right as the only times I’d have seen him are when he’s played against us for Brighton, and I can’t say he really did anything to stick in my mind.


Hi Bernard,

Its more the money than the player. I cant recall ever noticing him but I rarely watch Brighton.

Haz thinks he a top ball playing CB and he's probably seen much more of him than me. It just seems one heck of a lot of money unless he proves to be the real deal.

That said, if he is the real deal it would be an awesome purchase, akin to the VVD deal at Liverpool.


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Post #530827  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:06 pm 
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Donaruma is out of contract 2 weeks time, Only 22.

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Post #530828  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:07 pm 
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Gunfire wrote:
Donaruma is out of contract 2 weeks time, Only 22.


Hi Gun,

Isn't he off to Juve?


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Post #530829  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:09 pm 
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socrates wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:

Honestly at the moment I think we need committed players and recruiting players who have already impressed in the league makes sense. I question the long term motivation of some of our recent signings like Torreira and Willian.

Luiz out white in ? That sounds like we are thinking about our future logically right ?


It really depends how much money we have to spend. Of course £50m represents good value if he forms the backbone of our defence for years to come but is he really that good? I can't say I've ever really noticed him and thought he's a great player.

I'm thinking whether £100m on White and Maddison would be better spent on Grealish. It's just massive money whichever way you look at it and not something I realistically expected to be talking about.

Personally, I don't see Maddison at Arsenal. Too much money for player who's very good, but not great, and comes with some baggage.


We won’t get Grealish though surely we are a basket case of a club right now.

I’d have Maddison but have a feeling that’s too complex but white makes sense especially as we have a number of players like Nketiah and chambers we could include in the deal.


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Post #530830  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:14 pm 
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socrates wrote:
Gunfire wrote:
Donaruma is out of contract 2 weeks time, Only 22.


Hi Gun,

Isn't he off to Juve?

Think it's PSG actually.

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Post #530831  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:20 pm 
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For those interested in
Donnarumma.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/sempremila ... g-days/amp

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Post #530832  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:23 pm 
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socrates wrote:
Haz thinks he a top ball playing CB and he's probably seen much more of him than me. It just seems one heck of a lot of money unless he proves to be the real deal.

I can't say I've watched him extensively, but I saw probably 6-7 games with Brighton last season and I did take a little extra look at White because of the hype after his season at Leeds. He's not a huge guy at 6ft, but agile and pretty quick, and very good with the ball. So much of football these days are based on pressing, so defenders who can play out from the back and beat the press are essential and from what I've seen he fits that profile.


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Post #530833  Posted: Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:27 pm 
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Zed wrote:


Ok done deal.

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Post #530834  Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2021 6:09 am 
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£100m on White and Maddison is a lot of money. If we were chelsea or city and that £100m was part of a £200m summer spree AND we were safe in the knowledge that we’d do the same next year if either didn’t really work out it all sounds fine. Amazing the lack of real pressure those clubs have on their transfers.
There is a premium on English players and seemingly a premium on players with premiership experience but there are still plenty of other areas of the team to fix.

If it were me and I had that sort of money available I’d be making a big bid for someone like Jude Bellingham and really testing Dortmund’s resolve to keep him. £60m on him would be well worth it, I think he’s absolutely brilliant.

When I see bids at these values I can’t help but come back to some of the more ‘value’ transfers that could or already have happened.
Onana £5m
Sabitzer £15m
Konate £35m
Soumare £20m
Mazraoui £13m
Daka £17m
That lot is £105m and fixes every position bar back up left back


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Post #530835  Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2021 7:16 am 
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Hazuki wrote:
socrates wrote:
Haz thinks he a top ball playing CB and he's probably seen much more of him than me. It just seems one heck of a lot of money unless he proves to be the real deal.

I can't say I've watched him extensively, but I saw probably 6-7 games with Brighton last season and I did take a little extra look at White because of the hype after his season at Leeds. He's not a huge guy at 6ft, but agile and pretty quick, and very good with the ball. So much of football these days are based on pressing, so defenders who can play out from the back and beat the press are essential and from what I've seen he fits that profile.


Funnily enough the Brighton player who always caught my eye at the start of last season was Lamptey.


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Post #530836  Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2021 7:18 am 
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Rich wrote:
£100m on White and Maddison is a lot of money. If we were chelsea or city and that £100m was part of a £200m summer spree AND we were safe in the knowledge that we’d do the same next year if either didn’t really work out it all sounds fine. Amazing the lack of real pressure those clubs have on their transfers.
There is a premium on English players and seemingly a premium on players with premiership experience but there are still plenty of other areas of the team to fix.

If it were me and I had that sort of money available I’d be making a big bid for someone like Jude Bellingham and really testing Dortmund’s resolve to keep him. £60m on him would be well worth it, I think he’s absolutely brilliant.

When I see bids at these values I can’t help but come back to some of the more ‘value’ transfers that could or already have happened.
Onana £5m
Sabitzer £15m
Konate £35m
Soumare £20m
Mazraoui £13m
Daka £17m
That lot is £105m and fixes every position bar back up left back


Hi Rich,

No chance that Bellingham goes for £60m. Given his age and profile I would suggest Dortmund value him even higher than Sancho.

£100m if you could even persuade them to sell.


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Post #530837  Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2021 7:19 am 
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Rich wrote:
£100m on White and Maddison is a lot of money. If we were chelsea or city and that £100m was part of a £200m summer spree AND we were safe in the knowledge that we’d do the same next year if either didn’t really work out it all sounds fine. Amazing the lack of real pressure those clubs have on their transfers.
There is a premium on English players and seemingly a premium on players with premiership experience but there are still plenty of other areas of the team to fix.

If it were me and I had that sort of money available I’d be making a big bid for someone like Jude Bellingham and really testing Dortmund’s resolve to keep him. £60m on him would be well worth it, I think he’s absolutely brilliant.

When I see bids at these values I can’t help but come back to some of the more ‘value’ transfers that could or already have happened.
Onana £5m
Sabitzer £15m
Konate £35m
Soumare £20m
Mazraoui £13m
Daka £17m
That lot is £105m and fixes every position bar back up left back


£100m+ on White and Maddison show a huge level of ambition and I applaud the club for that but my question, like yours, would only be if that money could better be spent on 4 or 5 players rather than just 2.


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Post #530838  Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2021 7:24 am 
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Rich wrote:
When I see bids at these values I can’t help but come back to some of the more ‘value’ transfers that could or already have happened.
Onana £5m
Sabitzer £15m
Konate £35m
Soumare £20m
Mazraoui £13m
Daka £17m
That lot is £105m and fixes every position bar back up left back

The question is how much that list actually fixes - all of those players are talented, but all of them are also completely untested in the PL and might not work out. There's risk involved in every signing of course, but that risk is significantly smaller with players who have already performed at the level you want.

We often complain about how Arsenal won't go the extra mile for the players they want, well now it seems the club is willing to do just that. An opening bid of £40m for White shows they're serious in their pursuit and that White is the man they've clearly identified as someone who could improve us.


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Post #530839  Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2021 7:45 am 
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Hazuki wrote:
Rich wrote:
When I see bids at these values I can’t help but come back to some of the more ‘value’ transfers that could or already have happened.
Onana £5m
Sabitzer £15m
Konate £35m
Soumare £20m
Mazraoui £13m
Daka £17m
That lot is £105m and fixes every position bar back up left back

The question is how much that list actually fixes - all of those players are talented, but all of them are also completely untested in the PL and might not work out. There's risk involved in every signing of course, but that risk is significantly smaller with players who have already performed at the level you want.

.


Very good point here Haz, if you look at the signing of Torreira as an example where we invested 23 million plus his wages and will probably have to give him away because he doesn’t seem suited to the league or have the right mentality then this seems logical. Some of those players being mentioned are promising but still a punt especially Soumare.

If signing a player like white doesn’t work out at least we can sell him for a transfer fee. Look at Sokratis and mustafi we invested huge sums into their acquisitions and had to give them away for free.


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Post #530840  Posted: Thu Jun 17, 2021 7:46 am 
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Hazuki wrote:
Rich wrote:
When I see bids at these values I can’t help but come back to some of the more ‘value’ transfers that could or already have happened.
Onana £5m
Sabitzer £15m
Konate £35m
Soumare £20m
Mazraoui £13m
Daka £17m
That lot is £105m and fixes every position bar back up left back

The question is how much that list actually fixes - all of those players are talented, but all of them are also completely untested in the PL and might not work out. There's risk involved in every signing of course, but that risk is significantly smaller with players who have already performed at the level you want.

We often complain about how Arsenal won't go the extra mile for the players they want, well now it seems the club is willing to do just that. An opening bid of £40m for White shows they're serious in their pursuit and that White is the man they've clearly identified as someone who could improve us.

I see that, it is a delicate balancing act. All the evidence of the accounts and performance on the pitch and off the pitch show us being quite poor, but the club seem to be showing a different hand and a willingess to invest. Maybe they know a few big sales are coming, but you don't bid £40m for someone like White without the foresight of the investment needed in other areas of the pitch to simply make up the numbers in the squad - central midfield, left back and GK we simply don't have the numbers let alone the quality.

I have always thought there would be a significant turn around in players this summer, partly forced by the bang average nature of our squad, partly forced by the contract expiry dates of a lot of players and (hopefully) partly forced by our desire to be ambitious.


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