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Post #536801  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 12:35 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Bernard wrote:
To be fair Rich you fell into exactly the same trap when questioning Manchester United’s interest in Declan Rice. Not that long ago if my memory serves, although it wasn’t in the last few days (and I’d rather not define ‘last few days’). In my view Rice fits the current profile of what they need almost perfectly, and far better than Bellingham who I’m sure you spoke of your admiration for in the same post.

For me Bellingham is a better player than Rice. If I had £80m I know which one I’d buy. I think Bellingham is on a different level technically.

I’m not sure what the ‘trap’ is that you mention? I think Rice would improve Man U but that’s only because he’s better than what they have. I’m not quite convinced he’s right up there as a top level CM yet. Sancho certainly was at the top level given his goals and assists record in Germany. It hasn’t worked out for him yet though

The trap is that you were ignoring the point that Rice is exactly what they need to a bigger extent than Bellingham. Ipso facto, Rice would improve them the most.


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Post #536802  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 12:59 pm 
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https://twitter.com/footyaccums/status/ ... 56162?s=21
From yesterday, and why I think Bellingham is a class above Declan Rice.


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Post #536803  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 1:05 pm 
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Bernard wrote:
Rich wrote:
For me Bellingham is a better player than Rice. If I had £80m I know which one I’d buy. I think Bellingham is on a different level technically.

I’m not sure what the ‘trap’ is that you mention? I think Rice would improve Man U but that’s only because he’s better than what they have. I’m not quite convinced he’s right up there as a top level CM yet. Sancho certainly was at the top level given his goals and assists record in Germany. It hasn’t worked out for him yet though

The trap is that you were ignoring the point that Rice is exactly what they need to a bigger extent than Bellingham. Ipso facto, Rice would improve them the most.

Ok, I can see that a true defensive mid might serve Man U better than a type of mid Bellingham is but I just think Bellingham is so good that I’d be far more worried if Man U got Bellingham than Rice. I think a midfield of Bellingham and Fred is better than Rice and Fred.

Also I’m not sure what the correlation is between the rice/Bellingham conversation and me saying there has been a lack of scrutiny on Sancho not starting life well at Man U. Other than Sancho and Bellingham both played for Dortmund but I’m not sure how that is relevant to the points being discussed?


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Post #536804  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 1:15 pm 
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I think Sancho is what Man U have needed, most Man U fans I know have been crying out for a proper right winger in their team, even back to when they signed Sanchez from us a few were saying 'nice signing but he plays on the left, where is the right winger'. The problem Man U have is they are playing Greenwood on the right so have to accommodate Sancho on the left, now they have Rashford coming back who is best on the left. Greenwood has the potential to end up as the main centre-forward but the ego signing of Ronaldo will stop that this season.
Ronaldo will win games for them, and has done already, and there will be those silly stories like all the players now dodging pudding because Ronaldo did, but I don't think he's a good signing for them when you weigh everything up.

The thing with Man U was when was the last time they signed a player where you thought, that's interesting, they've done some serious homework and thinking there? Their transfer policy is like a 12 year old kid of Fifa, it doesn't mean they aren't good players or won't improve them. I thought Maguire and Wan-Bissaka were particularly good examples of this. For £130m combined I really think they could have done a lot better.


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Post #536805  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 1:27 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Ok, I can see that a true defensive mid might serve Man U better than a type of mid Bellingham is but I just think Bellingham is so good that I’d be far more worried if Man U got Bellingham than Rice. I think a midfield of Bellingham and Fred is better than Rice and Fred.

Also I’m not sure what the correlation is between the rice/Bellingham conversation and me saying there has been a lack of scrutiny on Sancho not starting life well at Man U. Other than Sancho and Bellingham both played for Dortmund but I’m not sure how that is relevant to the points being discussed?

The correlation is that you feel their recent signings are, to quote you verbatim, “without huge consideration for the balance of the squad and team”. In my view Rice would be the most obvious replacement for McTominay. Whereas for me Bellingham would be a more obvious replacement for Pogba or Fernandez rather than for McTominay.

In my opinion, Rice instead of McTominay would represent a more significant improvement than Bellingham instead of McTominay, when they already have Pogba and Fernandez to put in their team.


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Post #536806  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 1:43 pm 
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Gaz from Oz wrote:
come on Brentford , Westham & Man U. Man U only to protect our unbeaten season record.


First two yes but I'd like Liverpool to win. Manure are far bigger rivals for a Europa or, being very optimistic here, 4th place. The less they win the better.

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Post #536807  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 1:59 pm 
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Gunfire wrote:
Gaz from Oz wrote:
come on Brentford , Westham & Man U. Man U only to protect our unbeaten season record.

First two yes but I'd like Liverpool to win. Manure are far bigger rivals for a Europa or, being very optimistic here, 4th place. The less they win the better.

That’s a very good point Gunfire. We also have to remember that we’re still a week away from the end of October. If it wasn’t for our friend from across the Atlantic mentioning it so much, there would be many games to go before I’d even give Liverpool going the season undefeated a second thought.


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Post #536808  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 2:56 pm 
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The 'Ammers are 'appy tonight. :58big-emoticons:

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Post #536809  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 3:31 pm 
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Way too early in the season to start worrying about unbeaten records. We're 8 games in, Liverpool will lose at some point, but I hope they absolutely smash Man Utd today.


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Post #536810  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 3:42 pm 
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Incredible to see the amount of money Man Utd have spent on this squad to try and fight for the title, and still start with two central midfielders who doesn't belong in a top 6 club.


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Post #536811  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 3:45 pm 
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Man Utd missed a great chance to be 1 up and in a minute or two later down a goal. The miss at that range for Man Utd was unforgivable in such a big game. Nerves maybe.

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Post #536812  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 3:55 pm 
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Hazuki wrote:
Way too early in the season to start worrying about unbeaten records. We're 8 games in, Liverpool will lose at some point, but I hope they absolutely smash Man Utd today.

2-0 already. The worry might be that it gets so embarrassing that they give Ole the chop and get a real manager in.


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Post #536813  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:05 pm 
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bromley gooner wrote:
Hazuki wrote:
Way too early in the season to start worrying about unbeaten records. We're 8 games in, Liverpool will lose at some point, but I hope they absolutely smash Man Utd today.

2-0 already. The worry might be that it gets so embarrassing that they give Ole the chop and get a real manager in.

Was thinking the same! It's a fine line between wanting them to get smashed and wanting Ole to remain in charge because they're going nowhere under him. Such a poor team, only saved by having a couple of absolute elite players.


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Post #536814  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:11 pm 
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Hazuki wrote:
bromley gooner wrote:
2-0 already. The worry might be that it gets so embarrassing that they give Ole the chop and get a real manager in.

Was thinking the same! It's a fine line between wanting them to get smashed and wanting Ole to remain in charge because they're going nowhere under him. Such a poor team, only saved by having a couple of absolute elite players.

And now it's 3. If I was a Glazer I'd be on the phone to Antonio Conte by now.


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Post #536815  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:20 pm 
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At this rate we might go past them on goal difference. :icon_mrgreen1:

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Post #536816  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:22 pm 
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Stop stop, he's dead already


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Post #536817  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:30 pm 
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Hazuki wrote:
Stop stop, he's dead already

:laughing7:


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Post #536818  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:30 pm 
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bromley gooner wrote:
Hazuki wrote:
Way too early in the season to start worrying about unbeaten records. We're 8 games in, Liverpool will lose at some point, but I hope they absolutely smash Man Utd today.

2-0 already. The worry might be that it gets so embarrassing that they give Ole the chop and get a real manager in.

Yes that's a worry. Conte is reportedly hovering the wings.

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Post #536819  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:33 pm 
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Hazuki wrote:
bromley gooner wrote:
2-0 already. The worry might be that it gets so embarrassing that they give Ole the chop and get a real manager in.

Was thinking the same! It's a fine line between wanting them to get smashed and wanting Ole to remain in charge because they're going nowhere under him. Such a poor team, only saved by having a couple of absolute elite players.

Nah. There's no fine line here for me. This is far too enjoyable. Another four from Liverpool in the second half would be super.

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Post #536820  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:37 pm 
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dec wrote:
Hazuki wrote:
Was thinking the same! It's a fine line between wanting them to get smashed and wanting Ole to remain in charge because they're going nowhere under him. Such a poor team, only saved by having a couple of absolute elite players.

Nah. There's no fine line here for me. This is far too enjoyable. Another four from Liverpool in the second half would be super.


You get my vote! :58big-emoticons:


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Post #536821  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:40 pm 
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long time gooner wrote:
At this rate we might go past them on goal difference. :icon_mrgreen1:

Still on course. :42laughter:

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Post #536822  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:43 pm 
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Wait a minute. The comeback's on :laughing7:

Edit: VAR :laughing7:


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Post #536823  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:46 pm 
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dec wrote:
Hazuki wrote:
Was thinking the same! It's a fine line between wanting them to get smashed and wanting Ole to remain in charge because they're going nowhere under him. Such a poor team, only saved by having a couple of absolute elite players.

Nah. There's no fine line here for me. This is far too enjoyable. Another four from Liverpool in the second half would be super.

Can't argue with this.


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Post #536824  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:49 pm 
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bromley gooner wrote:
Wait a minute. The comeback's on :laughing7:

Edit: VAR :laughing7:

Looked really harsh. Karma eh?

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Post #536825  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:50 pm 
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Pogba has to go for that.


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Post #536826  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:51 pm 
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dec wrote:
Hazuki wrote:
Was thinking the same! It's a fine line between wanting them to get smashed and wanting Ole to remain in charge because they're going nowhere under him. Such a poor team, only saved by having a couple of absolute elite players.

Nah. There's no fine line here for me. This is far too enjoyable. Another four from Liverpool in the second half would be super.

Yeah. And the sheer pleasure of Salah's brilliance.

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Post #536827  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:51 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
It never ceases to amaze me how people who have accumulated such vast wealth are still willing to compromise everything for even more money. Wenger a prime example who is telling the world and it’s mother a World Cup every 2 years is a great idea because he’s being paid to do so. *%^@*** hell Arsene. How much money do you need?
Money may be one reason, but knowing how obsessed the man is with football I can imagine him wanting to see as many "quality" games before he pegs it! The man simply loves the game - he is addicted.

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Post #536828  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 4:52 pm 
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This is too good. Like a Hollywood script.


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Post #536829  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:01 pm 
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Come on Liverpool, this isn't good enough. You're slacking.


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Post #536830  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:03 pm 
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At this point, I'd like to see Liverpool win by a scoreline better than 8-2. :42laughter:

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Post #536831  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:26 pm 
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old man of hoy wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
It never ceases to amaze me how people who have accumulated such vast wealth are still willing to compromise everything for even more money. Wenger a prime example who is telling the world and it’s mother a World Cup every 2 years is a great idea because he’s being paid to do so. *%^@*** hell Arsene. How much money do you need?
Money may be one reason, but knowing how obsessed the man is with football I can imagine him wanting to see as many "quality" games before he pegs it! The man simply loves the game - he is addicted.

You are right. If Wenger had been a money or glory hunter, he would have cashed in at Real or Barca. Top Gun is full of it again. In any case, Wenger is quite right that the international calendar needs reforming.

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Post #536832  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:48 pm 
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Decaf wrote:
old man of hoy wrote:
Money may be one reason, but knowing how obsessed the man is with football I can imagine him wanting to see as many "quality" games before he pegs it! The man simply loves the game - he is addicted.

You are right. If Wenger had been a money or glory hunter, he would have cashed in at Real or Barca. Top Gun is full of it again. In any case, Wenger is quite right that the international calendar needs reforming.

If Arsene has sold out or not is a matter open to debate but my opinion is no way would he have backed this ridiculous 2 year World Cup idea 8 years ago.

What isn’t up for debate though is that you are a muggy little snide.


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Post #536833  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 5:54 pm 
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old man of hoy wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
It never ceases to amaze me how people who have accumulated such vast wealth are still willing to compromise everything for even more money. Wenger a prime example who is telling the world and it’s mother a World Cup every 2 years is a great idea because he’s being paid to do so. *%^@*** hell Arsene. How much money do you need?
Money may be one reason, but knowing how obsessed the man is with football I can imagine him wanting to see as many "quality" games before he pegs it! The man simply loves the game - he is addicted.


He works for FIFA.. they have one agenda themselves.

There’s no absence of football he can indulge in we don’t need a World Cup every 2 years and it’s been rightly vetoed for the time being.

He visibly doesn’t believe the words he’s saying.


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Post #536834  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 6:54 pm 
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That thrashing had been coming for Man U. This has been in the making for a number of games. The comebacks and the romance of Ronaldo have let far too many people who should know better gloss over what a disorganised mess Man U are. A Gk who stays rooted to his line, a back 4 whose leader is so slow and clumsy and the rest barely look like they know each other, a midfield that is not even top half quality and a forward line that can bail them out with moments of brilliance but can’t or won’t do any dirty work off the ball. I feel like Arsenal have been there before but we didn’t spend what Man U have to achieve it.
Man U deserve what they’re getting because they’ve been too arrogant thinking ‘The Man U way’ and other romantic history is enough. No vision, no future planning and their displays on the pitch look like they’ve been unwilling to do the hard things on the training pitch.

I hope Ole stays longer though.


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Post #536835  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 7:22 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Man U deserve what they’re getting because they’ve been too arrogant thinking ‘The Man U way’ and other romantic history is enough. No vision, no future planning and their displays on the pitch look like they’ve been unwilling to do the hard things on the training pitch.

I was bewildered this summer by how many people ranked the Man Utd squad next to or even above Liverpool. If you only look at the best 3-4 players perhaps, but it's horribly unbalanced and top heavy. Great options going forward, extremely weak midfield, weak central defense apart from Varane. Wan-Bissaka is a non-factor offensively. If they were just starting a re-build that would've been a fine position to be in, but with the amount of money they've spent they should be the finished product basically. And Ole is just a nothing coach.


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Post #536836  Posted: Sun Oct 24, 2021 9:07 pm 
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The real problem for Man U started when they fell for the Man City scam again. Man City show an interest in an ageing player who all the fans want, Man U can't be upstaged by City so they pay over the top, giving no thought as to whether the player fits into the team or even unbalances the team. Then they are forced to try and make it work: step forward Alexis Sanchez and Ronaldo. The real question is can Man City do the trick again. I hope so.

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Post #536837  Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2021 1:27 am 
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Good to see Spurs lose :53big-emoticons:

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Post #536838  Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2021 1:28 am 
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Wow oh wow, what an anti-climax of a match. Pool is smashing it!

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Post #536839  Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2021 1:33 am 
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Surprised to see we are at touching distance of top 4, point-wise. Our 2 away games in Nov against Leicester & Pool will be good tests for us.

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Post #536840  Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2021 5:49 am 
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The odds on OGS being sacked have got to have changed a lot.

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