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Post #506521  Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 11:04 pm 
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thofman wrote:
What's Ranieri up to these days?


Benitez springs to mind


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Post #506522  Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 11:22 pm 
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Benitez for me. I know that is a far from progressive move but we need a really experienced manager to steady the ship. He is the type to get players to work hard on the defensive side of the game. It wouldn't be pretty but Emery has drained the confidence from most of the players and they need a strong manager to turn it around.

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Post #506523  Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 11:30 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
thofman wrote:
What's Ranieri up to these days?


Benitez springs to mind

Yes. Be a good shout

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Post #506524  Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 11:32 pm 
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Ljungberg needs to focus on the defence... Almost impossible to win when we are conceding two every game. I'd take boring 0-0 draws and 1-0 wins until the team/players regain their confidence.


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Post #506525  Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 11:53 pm 
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Goonie wrote:
Ljungberg needs to focus on the defence... Almost impossible to win when we are conceding two every game. I'd take boring 0-0 draws and 1-0 wins until the team/players regain their confidence.


4-5-1 and nothing fancy

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Post #506526  Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2019 11:54 pm 
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:1laughter:
A winless run of 9 games is the worst in 42 years, 1977.
And look which sides we have on the horizon....fancy 16th/17th place possibly.
:icon_rolleyes1:
Please come back Bernard.

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Post #506527  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 12:27 am 
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This is going to worse. We are in crisis territory. When Too Gun said we are in free fall he was dead right. This is on the owners.

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Post #506528  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 1:40 am 
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Drop Özil. He slows down our attacks. And he is hardly, or never, around to defend.

Most of our players are lazy.

Drop Luiz. Style but no substance.

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Post #506529  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 2:40 am 
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We are leaking goals to everyone. Freddie's not up to it. I've suggested as much. This season may just have to be a wash. Don't be shocked if we end up mid table. It's not the end of the world. Liverpool finished 8th a few years ago. Man Utd went through the same thing under Moyes. Chelsea nearly as bad as well.

We flog the dead weight. Get started now on targets for both January and the summer. I am willing to wait for Rodgers. Sacrifice the rest of the season to wait for him in the summer. I'd rather that than Howe or anyone else like Arteta.

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Post #506530  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 2:55 am 
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bromley gooner wrote:
Fat Sam would keep us up. Get him in for the rest of the season now - and I'm only half joking.


I agree Brom ... we are past being able to be fussy , it's all hands the the pumps and stand by the lifeboats Big Sam would be my choice .
He can organise a defence , has presence , not shy in criticising players . Ljungberg is far too lightweight
, I doubt Mertesacker is the " tell em how it is " type either
We don't want nice guys , club legends , we are at a crisis point because it is all to obvious no-one at the club has any idea what to do .


Check this out

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qN6i0Rt2WDg ... ..the panel nails the problems while the official Arsenal dude Jules somebody is in full blown defensive mode trying to deflect criticism .


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Post #506531  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 4:59 am 
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9th Dec: West Ham United (20:00) Arsenal

15th Dec: Arsenal(16:30) Manchester City

21st Dec: Everton (12:30) Arsenal

26th Dec: AFC Bournemouth (15:00)Arsenal

29th Dec: Arsenal (14:00)Chelsea

1st Jan: Arsenal (20:00) Manchester United



So where’s our next 3 points folks....


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Post #506532  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:18 am 
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TOP GUN wrote:
9th Dec: West Ham United (20:00) Arsenal

15th Dec: Arsenal(16:30) Manchester City

21st Dec: Everton (12:30) Arsenal

26th Dec: AFC Bournemouth (15:00)Arsenal

29th Dec: Arsenal (14:00)Chelsea

1st Jan: Arsenal (20:00) Manchester United



So where’s our next 3 points folks....

So 3 home wins plus wins against Everton And Westhsm + a point against Bournemouth. 16 points or we change manager/ coach - no pressure

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Post #506533  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:21 am 
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dec wrote:
Benitez for me. I know that is a far from progressive move but we need a really experienced manager to steady the ship. He is the type to get players to work hard on the defensive side of the game. It wouldn't be pretty but Emery has drained the confidence from most of the players and they need a strong manager to turn it around.

I’d go for Benitez until the end of the season as well, would he come for a 6 month job though?

We talk about the confidence being drained from the team, removing the manager has had no effect on them. No new manager bounce, no shackles off. The players have gone beyond downing tools, it’s like every single one of them has the yips, they cannot play football right now, basics are so wrong. I’ve said we’re the worst team in the division right now, every other team can muster a reaction even if for only 1 game, there is something. We’re barely registering a pulse


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Post #506534  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:24 am 
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When Liverpool finished 8th and Chelsea finished 8th you could still look at the players and see with some changes and coaching they would easily be a better team. I look at our squad (who will finish well below 8th by the way) and just don’t see it.
Who is going to want to buy any of our defence or midfield? Have any of that defence or midfield shown anything for the past 2 years that makes us think they can improve?


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Post #506535  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:27 am 
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The multiple sticking plasters we had on this team have been ripped off, and every team in the league can see how exposed we are and how to beat us. It is the easiest tactical set up for any coach. Even up until last season plenty of teams gave us too much respect and we probably beat them due to their passive play. Now everyone can truly see us for what we are.

It is humiliating


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Post #506536  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 5:43 am 
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(1) Freddie was only at Arsenal because Steve Bould was fed up of hearing Emery trying to talk Spanish to players on the training ground rather than in English. That’s how daft things are at arsenal

(2) Alexandre Lacazette has scored 25 of his 32 Premier League goals at the Emirates Stadium. We need to drop him away from home. Tough decision but needs to be done

(3) we only signed David Luiz because Edu and him have the same agent Kia Joorabchian and as a favour. As soon as you start making decisions like that you’ve lost control. Needs to be dropped


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Post #506537  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 6:14 am 
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Lacazette has 25 of his 32 league goals at home. We need to drop him when we play away from home. We’ve been crying out for balance in this team for years, stop picking the ‘best’ players and pick the best team.


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Post #506538  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 6:22 am 
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Our last 22 games in the league W6 D8 L8

26 points from 22 games. Just enough to stay in the division


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Post #506539  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 6:43 am 
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Rich wrote:
Lacazette has 25 of his 32 league goals at home. We need to drop him when we play away from home. We’ve been crying out for balance in this team for years, stop picking the ‘best’ players and pick the best team.

Drop Özil (who simply doesn't do enough) and Sokratis (who is far more calamitous than Luiz at the moment).
Play Torriera as defensive midfielder.

Beyond that ... I don't envy Ljungberg, and I doubt there are many managers who would want to take on this mess.

Scarily, the teams below us keep picking up points.

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Post #506540  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 7:03 am 
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Rich wrote:
dec wrote:
Benitez for me. I know that is a far from progressive move but we need a really experienced manager to steady the ship. He is the type to get players to work hard on the defensive side of the game. It wouldn't be pretty but Emery has drained the confidence from most of the players and they need a strong manager to turn it around.

I’d go for Benitez until the end of the season as well, would he come for a 6 month job though?

We talk about the confidence being drained from the team, removing the manager has had no effect on them. No new manager bounce, no shackles off. The players have gone beyond downing tools, it’s like every single one of them has the yips, they cannot play football right now, basics are so wrong. I’ve said we’re the worst team in the division right now, every other team can muster a reaction even if for only 1 game, there is something. We’re barely registering a pulse

D
Wish I'd said that. Oh wait I did and TG poo pooed it......

Does he still? Probably.......


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Post #506541  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 7:05 am 
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Rich wrote:
Our last 22 games in the league W6 D8 L8

26 points from 22 games. Just enough to stay in the division

In those games we won just one league game by more than a single goal (Burnley). Even before, our inability to dominate and lack of cohesion was papered over by individual performance (eg Aubameyang, Leno, and Ramsey). The chickens have now come home to roost.

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Post #506542  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 7:12 am 
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bubblechris wrote:
Rich wrote:
I’d go for Benitez until the end of the season as well, would he come for a 6 month job though?

We talk about the confidence being drained from the team, removing the manager has had no effect on them. No new manager bounce, no shackles off. The players have gone beyond downing tools, it’s like every single one of them has the yips, they cannot play football right now, basics are so wrong. I’ve said we’re the worst team in the division right now, every other team can muster a reaction even if for only 1 game, there is something. We’re barely registering a pulse

D
Wish I'd said that. Oh wait I did and TG poo pooed it......

Does he still? Probably.......


I didn’t like the idea when we had options

Now we are in free fall and we have none it’s more of a Hobson’s choice whilst still not being my preference.

Rodgers, Allegri or Ancellotti would be more preferable but all come with their own issues.

Based on our situation appointing an Arteta or Vieira is no longer feasible. Bloody mindedness is required and dismantling hierarchy and status within that squad is essential


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Post #506543  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 8:15 am 
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Wirral Gooner wrote:
Goonie wrote:
Ljungberg needs to focus on the defence... Almost impossible to win when we are conceding two every game. I'd take boring 0-0 draws and 1-0 wins until the team/players regain their confidence.


4-5-1 and nothing fancy


Formation and team set up is one thing but somehow our defending as a whole is just shambolic... I supposed instruct the full backs not to bomb forward at all? And get the DM to protect the back 4 at all times?


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Post #506544  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 8:19 am 
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Awful to see Aubameyang berate Willock for a misplaced pass - which wasn’t that bad if Aubameyang had continued the runhe wanted him to make. This is our captain bawling out a junior player on the pitch for 1 misplayed pass. I’m all for upping standards but there is a time and place and not for something like that.

Assuming we can stay in he league this season I think we have to sell Aubameyang and Lacazette. Neither will sign a new deal and we should give them Özil type wages as their final big contract that will just be a millstone. Sell both whilst they have some value. Take the £100m (if we can get it) and also get as much as we can for Xhaka, mustafi, torriera none of whom are suited to the prem. find a way to get rid of Özil even if on loan.

Even if it means a few more years in midtable we have to properly reset. Recruitment needs to be absolutely clear in identifying mentally strong players, desire, professionalism, pace, power, mobility. If you’re going to be a midtable team then you need to move away from technical but weak players and look at a more sturdy team. Any midtable team can slip in to a relegation fight.

How does anyone think our group of players would fare in a relegation scrap? Lambs to the slaughter. They’d totally give up


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Post #506545  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 8:21 am 
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Goonie wrote:
Wirral Gooner wrote:

4-5-1 and nothing fancy


Formation and team set up is one thing but somehow our defending as a whole is just shambolic... I supposed instruct the full backs not to bomb forward at all? And get the DM to protect the back 4 at all times?

Playing wingers on the wing and telling them to track back and double up with their full back would be a start. Özil and Aubameyang are not those players.

I find it staggering that in 10 years not a single person at Arsenal has made it a pre-requisite of wearing the shirt and representing the team to work hard. Theseplayers and those before them have been getting away with it for years


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Post #506546  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 8:37 am 
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Rich wrote:
Assuming we can stay in he league this season I think we have to sell Aubameyang and Lacazette.


If they won't sign new cntracts, then no choice sell them. Think Martinelli, Pépé and Saka can step up... we need our midfielders to chip in with the goal too. Or at least make the run beyond the striker to create havoc in oppo's defence. - we are missing Ramsey.


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Post #506547  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 8:41 am 
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Rich wrote:
Goonie wrote:

Formation and team set up is one thing but somehow our defending as a whole is just shambolic... I supposed instruct the full backs not to bomb forward at all? And get the DM to protect the back 4 at all times?

Playing wingers on the wing and telling them to track back and double up with their full back would be a start. Özil and Aubameyang are not those players.



If your starting those 2 wide it’s a given your full backs are in for a tough time full stop. You better have a couple of Ashley Cole’s for full backs because your going to be exposed time and time again and unless they are superhuman you won’t deal with it.

Aubameyang wide ? Our most dangerous player is moved out of centre and put wide in a less effective role. Lacazette has sulked all season anyway so drop him.

Defence, as I’ve said all season our best defence is Bellerin
, Sokratis, Holding/chambers and Tierney. ... Luiz and Mustafi are both clowns who should be only played in cup games. Sokratis has suffered playing alongside Luiz being ask to compensate for someone who isn’t defensively minded and trying to adopt Emery ridiculous passing out tactics.

Front 3... Pépé, Aubameyang, Martinelli with a mandate for the 2 youngsters to provide cover if we are defending.


Midfield.....Torreira, Guendouzi and Ceballos as a number 10 with more coaching and direction so he provide more insertion.


January window, manager looks to bring in 1 or 2 midfielders who have the passing ability to open up defences. (Signing decent defenders will be too expensive)

Mustafi, Xhaka, Özil and Kolasinac are essentially squad players due to the deficiencies in their games right now.

That’s what’s required ASAP.


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Post #506548  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 8:44 am 
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TOP GUN wrote:
(1) Freddie was only at Arsenal because Steve Bould was fed up of hearing Emery trying to talk Spanish to players on the training ground rather than in English. That’s how daft things are at arsenal

(2) Alexandre Lacazette has scored 25 of his 32 Premier League goals at the Emirates Stadium. We need to drop him away from home. Tough decision but needs to be done

(3) we only signed David Luiz because Edu and him have the same agent Kia Joorabchian and as a favour. As soon as you start making decisions like that you’ve lost control. Needs to be dropped

I hope you don't mind old chap, but what is your source for 1 & 3?

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Post #506549  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 8:45 am 
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Gaz from Oz wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
(1) Freddie was only at Arsenal because Steve Bould was fed up of hearing Emery trying to talk Spanish to players on the training ground rather than in English. That’s how daft things are at arsenal

(2) Alexandre Lacazette has scored 25 of his 32 Premier League goals at the Emirates Stadium. We need to drop him away from home. Tough decision but needs to be done

(3) we only signed David Luiz because Edu and him have the same agent Kia Joorabchian and as a favour. As soon as you start making decisions like that you’ve lost control. Needs to be dropped

I hope you don't mind old chap, but what is your source for 1 & 3?


3 is factual

1 The arsenal supporters Trust


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Post #506550  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 9:01 am 
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If we don't make the Europa league next year I think we might have a mass exodus of players wanting to leave the club:
Torreira - wants to leave even now
Aub- will want out
Lacazette - will want out
Leno - will want out when Bayern call him
Bellerin - may stay
Guendouzi - if he is not played may not want to stay
Pépé - ?'
Xhaka - probably want out but the money may hold him - not sure if that is good or bad

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Post #506551  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 9:04 am 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Gaz from Oz wrote:
I hope you don't mind old chap, but what is your source for 1 & 3?


3 is factual

1 The arsenal supporters Trust

If 3 is true then that is very bad. I know Emery wanted some other CB. I don't actually think Emery had much say in who came in during the transfer window.

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Post #506552  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 9:18 am 
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Gaz from Oz wrote:
If we don't make the Europa league next year I think we might have a mass exodus of players wanting to leave the club:
Torreira - wants to leave even now
Aub- will want out
Lacazette - will want out
Leno - will want out when Bayern call him
Bellerin - may stay
Guendouzi - if he is not played may not want to stay
Pépé - ?'
Xhaka - probably want out but the money may hold him - not sure if that is good or bad



Torreira - a shame as he had talent and we haven’t really used him right
Aub- Accept the fact he’s gone. No talent would put up with this *%^@
Lacazette - will want out but I don’t really care, he’s sulked all year not signed a new contract and if you look at his record he’s actually a bit of a flat track bully.
Leno - would be gutting to lose him but he has a contract to 2023 so we could ask for big money
Bellerin - may stay but he looks half the player he was right now
Guendouzi - I think people are way over rating him. His speed of thought and passing are not there yet for a centre mid. He’s not signed a new contract yet either so has a high opinion of himself. Has promise but I wouldn’t cry if we sold him for decent wedge

Pépé? I think he’s a talent it would be a shame to lose him. Just needs some coaching

Xhaka - a *%^@*** termite, a snivelling little maggot of a player who should be gracing the championship. Also factually the worst arsenal signing of all time given his price. Who would be upset if he went


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Post #506553  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 9:47 am 
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Gaz from Oz wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:

3 is factual

1 The arsenal supporters Trust

If 3 is true then that is very bad. I know Emery wanted some other CB. I don't actually think Emery had much say in who came in during the transfer window.

What do you mean, 'If 3 is true'? TG gave you the answer as a cold, hard, verifiable truth-bomb. What part of 'is factual' don't you understand, Gaz?

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Post #506554  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 9:56 am 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Gaz from Oz wrote:
Looks like AG was correct

About what precisely

If you throw so much faeces at a wall eventually you just have a wall covered in shite

Its his MO.
He takes a "position" and if he is wrong that is the last we hear of it. If Emery had miraculously turned things round we would now be subjected to his crowing and preening.

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Post #506555  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 9:57 am 
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Rich wrote:
Awful to see Aubameyang berate Willock for a misplaced pass - which wasn’t that bad if Aubameyang had continued the runhe wanted him to make. This is our captain bawling out a junior player on the pitch for 1 misplayed pass. I’m all for upping standards but there is a time and place and not for something like that.

Assuming we can stay in he league this season I think we have to sell Aubameyang and Lacazette. Neither will sign a new deal and we should give them Özil type wages as their final big contract that will just be a millstone. Sell both whilst they have some value. Take the £100m (if we can get it) and also get as much as we can for Xhaka, mustafi, torriera none of whom are suited to the prem. find a way to get rid of Özil even if on loan.

Even if it means a few more years in midtable we have to properly reset. Recruitment needs to be absolutely clear in identifying mentally strong players, desire, professionalism, pace, power, mobility. If you’re going to be a midtable team then you need to move away from technical but weak players and look at a more sturdy team. Any midtable team can slip in to a relegation fight.

How does anyone think our group of players would fare in a relegation scrap? Lambs to the slaughter. They’d totally give up

Well we're about to find out Rich, because make no mistake that's what we're in. I hope and pray there are 3 worse teams in this division than us, because we are bang in trouble.


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Post #506556  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 10:59 am 
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I have no idea where we go from here, we are a mess.

I thought the players were better than the performances they have been giving, but maybe they just aren't. Maybe they are just sub-standard and no amount of coaching can turn a sows ear into a silk purse.

I have seen nothing from Freddie to make me think he's some kind of managerial genius in the making. He has inherited a right mess, make no mistake, and with little or no time on the training pitch at this time of year it is is very hard to implement one's ideas but his team selections and substitutions have hardly looked the decisions of an enlightened coach.

You cannot play Aubameyang out wide, it's a waste, nor can you indulge Özil who seems now to be way past his best physically and mentally.

Kola played quite well last night in terms of going forward but essentially he is a left back who can't defend and we cannot afford that so Tierney has to come in at LB.

Dumb and dumber in the centre of defence are what they are, although it has to be said they receive no protection whatsoever. It seems we have to try something different there too. Chambers and Holding is at least worth a go as it is hard to see how they can actually do any worse.

Pépé has to start because he's one of the few players we have who can take his man on and inject some pace and quality into our static attacks. He's not in great form and his decision-making is questionable but beggars cannot be choosers.

Maybe give Martinelli a go out wide, though I am not convinced it's his best position because he seems to make the runs of a natural goalscorer. However, his energy levels are impressive.

Bellerin seems to have lost a yard of pace (perhaps understandably having had such a complex long-term injury) and when that is your biggest attribute it clearly doesn't help. He was never great defensively or even with his final balls but his pace enabled him to burst forward and to get back quickly. Now he looks a shadow of that player.


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Post #506557  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 11:15 am 
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socrates wrote:
I have no idea where we go from here, we are a mess.

I thought the players were better than the performances they have been giving, but maybe they just aren't. Maybe they are just sub-standard and no amount of coaching can turn a sows ear into a silk purse.

I have seen nothing from Freddie to make me think he's some kind of managerial genius in the making. He has inherited a right mess, make no mistake, and with little or no time on the training pitch at this time of year it is is very hard to implement one's ideas but his team selections and substitutions have hardly looked the decisions of an enlightened coach.

I can't argue with that. However, I think it is reasonable to give Ljungberg a few more games. If we are still in freefall at Xmas then we'll have to rethink.

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Post #506558  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 11:33 am 
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One of many worrying aspects about our current state is that there doesn't seem to be the 'New Manager Bounce' you often see when someone new takes over. Nobody has seemed particularly enervated or prepared to run through brick walls for Freddie in his two games so far.

That doesn't bode well.


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Post #506559  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 11:43 am 
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Joined: Mon Jan 14, 2008 4:33 pm
Posts: 1289

DHD wrote:
One of many worrying aspects about our current state is that there doesn't seem to be the 'New Manager Bounce' you often see when someone new takes over. Nobody has seemed particularly enervated or prepared to run through brick walls for Freddie in his two games so far.

That doesn't bode well.

Bang average players who aren't as good as they think they are, who also can't be arsed to put the graft in. Not a good combo. Bottom 3 material.


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Post #506560  Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2019 11:43 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2008 8:02 pm
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I’d be shocked if there’s not a new man in place by Christmas.

The board must be absolutely bricking it. We can plumb any depths currently the worst is yet to come and A 200 million wage bill in the championship is a calculation that won’t work.

They will pay the money to get the right person.

Absolutely dreading taking the kids to the city game. We will get mullered. Part of the character building process for them I guess.


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