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Post #502521  Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 1:14 pm 
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I was angry and frustrated at the end of the game HOWEVER, I know where Arsenal are right now in the long road back and we are a 6th or 7th place side with a lot of issues. That kind of side are going to have games like this. I am not happy with where we are but I am not naïve about where we are, if that makes sense. I think we are on the right track. We have the right manager for us. A manager who has both managed and had success at a smaller club (Sevilla) but also has experience with a big club in the elite of Europe (PSG) who can handle that kind of club if or when we get back to that status.

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Post #502522  Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:15 pm 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
I was angry and frustrated at the end of the game HOWEVER, I know where Arsenal are right now in the long road back and we are a 6th or 7th place side with a lot of issues. That kind of side are going to have games like this. I am not happy with where we are but I am not naïve about where we are, if that makes sense. I think we are on the right track. We have the right manager for us. A manager who has both managed and had success at a smaller club (Sevilla) but also has experience with a big club in the elite of Europe (PSG) who can handle that kind of club if or when we get back to that status.


What makes you say we are a 6th or 7th pace side with a lot of issues? We should have finished 4th last year and we spent well in the summer, buying one of the world's supposed best up-an-coming talents in Pépé, a young LB tipped for great things and bringing in a very talented Spanish CM on loan.

We cleared out a lot of deadwood and lowered the average age of the squad dramatically to take us from one of the oldest to one of the youngest squads. We still have issues, yes, but far less than before the summer, at least on paper.

City and Liverpool are untouchable but with the investments we made in the Summer Emery has no excuse not to challenge for 3rd or 4th spot.


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Post #502523  Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 3:48 pm 
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Just want to add to the chorus of disapproval at yesterday's performance. Wouldn't be an exaggeration to say Watford could have totally demolished us - they had 8 or 9 really good chances/efforts.

The manager just isn't convincing anyone right now and that is a big problem. When you take our end of season form into account we have been pretty dire for a good while now.

The excitement of adding all the new players is quickly turning to the feeling of same auld shite. In September! Even Arsene dragged it out to January most years!!

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Post #502524  Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 3:52 pm 
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socrates wrote:
AmericanGooner wrote:
I was angry and frustrated at the end of the game HOWEVER, I know where Arsenal are right now in the long road back and we are a 6th or 7th place side with a lot of issues. That kind of side are going to have games like this. I am not happy with where we are but I am not naïve about where we are, if that makes sense. I think we are on the right track. We have the right manager for us. A manager who has both managed and had success at a smaller club (Sevilla) but also has experience with a big club in the elite of Europe (PSG) who can handle that kind of club if or when we get back to that status.


What makes you say we are a 6th or 7th pace side with a lot of issues? We should have finished 4th last year and we spent well in the summer, buying one of the world's supposed best up-an-coming talents in Pépé, a young LB tipped for great things and bringing in a very talented Spanish CM on loan.

We cleared out a lot of deadwood and lowered the average age of the squad dramatically to take us from one of the oldest to one of the youngest squads. We still have issues, yes, but far less than before the summer, at least on paper.

City and Liverpool are untouchable but with the investments we made in the Summer Emery has no excuse not to challenge for 3rd or 4th spot.


We had no midfield yesterday. How huge a gap did we leave at times in the middle in our half defending? Absolutely huge. Guendouzi was too far right, Ceballos left, leaving Xhaka exposed particularly if he had to cover one of the other midfielders; and no defensive effort from Özil and in the second half Pépé. It was a farce.

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Post #502525  Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:30 pm 
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I’ve watched some clips again of us playing out from goal kicks and just can’t fathom what the idea is? I mean even with the opposition as cones in training it wouldn’t be obvious how we planned to move the ball upfield.

The typical set up had Sokratis and Luiz on the corners of the 6 yard box, the two full backs about 5 yards in from touch and slightly deeper than the edge of the box, and Guendouzi central on the edge of the box.
The typical play went Leno to Sokratis, as he’s closed it goes to Guendouzi who collects it facing his own goal rather than on the half turn, he’s rapidly closed and the ball goes square ish to AMN, who also has a player on him in a second. He can’t go back to Guendouzi or Sokratis so he goes down the line to Pépé who has come short, maybe 30 yards from our goal, close to the touchline and with a defender right up his backside. His only option is back to amn who then pumped a ball downfield to a lone forward with no support because all our players are within 30 yards of our own box......that is only if we haven’t lost it before the hoof.

For it to work with as little risk as possible you can’t rely on a player beating a man with skill (too risky in your own last 3rd) also you should rely on fantastic first touch or one touch football. It has to be reliant on movement and switches of play. If you’re intent on sucking the opposition in then you have to look for the space, not play it in ever decreasing small passes.

Just ditch it because we aren’t good enough to do it. Personally I’ve only seen two teams in my lifetime who are good enough to do it, the famous Barca team of 2009 (and surrounding years) and some of the most recent Man City teams - and even they conceded doing it recently.

I think Arsenal need to wake up to the fact that even teams at the bottom of the prem have very good players who are more than skilled enough to embarrass a top 6 side of given any kind of encouragement. Gone are the days when teams pack 10 men behind the ball against us


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Post #502526  Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:32 pm 
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Niall wrote:
socrates wrote:

What makes you say we are a 6th or 7th pace side with a lot of issues? We should have finished 4th last year and we spent well in the summer, buying one of the world's supposed best up-an-coming talents in Pépé, a young LB tipped for great things and bringing in a very talented Spanish CM on loan.

We cleared out a lot of deadwood and lowered the average age of the squad dramatically to take us from one of the oldest to one of the youngest squads. We still have issues, yes, but far less than before the summer, at least on paper.

City and Liverpool are untouchable but with the investments we made in the Summer Emery has no excuse not to challenge for 3rd or 4th spot.


We had no midfield yesterday. How huge a gap did we leave at times in the middle in our half defending? Absolutely huge. Guendouzi was too far right, Ceballos left, leaving Xhaka exposed particularly if he had to cover one of the other midfielders; and no defensive effort from Özil and in the second half Pépé. It was a farce.


I agree, I said earlier you could have driven a double-decker bus through the centre of our midfield. Emerys tactical diamond he seems so enamoured with just does not work with the personnel he plays.

The problem with Özil is that he plays the game at his pace and his languid manner and lack of defensive effort seems to bring everyone else down to that pace. He played some brilliant passes but was a passenger defensively. His time is up.

Pépé was hugely disappointing but let's hope its just a settling-in period because he has showed glimpses of real talent in other games.


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Post #502527  Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:39 pm 
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Rich wrote:
I’ve watched some clips again of us playing out from goal kicks and just can’t fathom what the idea is? I mean even with the opposition as cones in training it wouldn’t be obvious how we planned to move the ball upfield.

The typical set up had Sokratis and Luiz on the corners of the 6 yard box, the two full backs about 5 yards in from touch and slightly deeper than the edge of the box, and Guendouzi central on the edge of the box.
The typical play went Leno to Sokratis, as he’s closed it goes to Guendouzi who collects it facing his own goal rather than on the half turn, he’s rapidly closed and the ball goes square ish to AMN, who also has a player on him in a second. He can’t go back to Guendouzi or Sokratis so he goes down the line to Pépé who has come short, maybe 30 yards from our goal, close to the touchline and with a defender right up his backside. His only option is back to amn who then pumped a ball downfield to a lone forward with no support because all our players are within 30 yards of our own box......that is only if we haven’t lost it before the hoof.



That was my observation as well, Rich. We might as well have cut out the middle men and let Leno hoof it forward because that's all we ended up doing.


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Post #502528  Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 4:39 pm 
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Rich wrote:
I’ve watched some clips again of us playing out from goal kicks and just can’t fathom what the idea is? I mean even with the opposition as cones in training it wouldn’t be obvious how we planned to move the ball upfield.

The typical set up had Sokratis and Luiz on the corners of the 6 yard box, the two full backs about 5 yards in from touch and slightly deeper than the edge of the box, and Guendouzi central on the edge of the box.
The typical play went Leno to Sokratis, as he’s closed it goes to Guendouzi who collects it facing his own goal rather than on the half turn, he’s rapidly closed and the ball goes square ish to AMN, who also has a player on him in a second. He can’t go back to Guendouzi or Sokratis so he goes down the line to Pépé who has come short, maybe 30 yards from our goal, close to the touchline and with a defender right up his backside. His only option is back to amn who then pumped a ball downfield to a lone forward with no support because all our players are within 30 yards of our own box......that is only if we haven’t lost it before the hoof.

For it to work with as little risk as possible you can’t rely on a player beating a man with skill (too risky in your own last 3rd) also you should rely on fantastic first touch or one touch football. It has to be reliant on movement and switches of play. If you’re intent on sucking the opposition in then you have to look for the space, not play it in ever decreasing small passes.

Just ditch it because we aren’t good enough to do it. Personally I’ve only seen two teams in my lifetime who are good enough to do it, the famous Barca team of 2009 (and surrounding years) and some of the most recent Man City teams - and even they conceded doing it recently.

us


I think Kevin Whitchers comments today nail this

This playing it out from the back thing. Shouldn’t it be a) done quickly before the opposition is set and b) not have to be an unbreakable policy – as in give the other side some element of doubt as to what is going to happen.


..... surely continuing to do so when the opportunity has passed and the opposition have had the chance to get themselves ready to press is utterly stupid. I mean mind numbingly utterly stupid so much so it deserves to get punished. As far as I’m concerned we drew that match purely off the back of ridiculous tactics and the coach and his management team were culpable.


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Post #502529  Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 5:03 pm 
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long time gooner wrote:
AmericanGooner wrote:
Frustrating draw and definitely sympathize how we all must feel but I try to look it at all in its larger and proper context. We are in a big transitional period. No where near settled as a squad, weak defense, given where we are as a squad, I don't expect 'invincibles' football if I may be a little over the top.

We went up 2-0 at half time at a tough away ground. That's huge given where we are right now. I didn't expect them to write off the game in the 2nd half nor expect us to look as good. Both goals were individual mistakes. We were much better in the 2nd half but we also had more than few counters and opportunities going forward in the 2nd half and never capitalized. They scored from individual mistakes out of central defense. It wasn't from a build up where they took us apart as a team. That's a fact. They were dangerous but the didn't score on us like Liverpool and others did.

So, yes, given where we are it was a decent "team" performance but I definitely see how you (and probably others) may see it differently.

As you say each person will have their own view.

Despite the brilliance of Aubameyang I saw a relentless succession of tactical errors and individual errors. It was about as far removed from my view of a “decent team performance” as is possible.

That’s nothing to do with comparing them to the invincibles. It’s just a basic expectation of us looking like a football team instead of a disorganised rabble.

I glad that you’re happy with things though. That is a comfort that unfortunately I do not have.

Each person is entitled to their views and to believe what they want ... but that doesn't mean they aren't just plain wrong.

It was a rabble indeed. There was more organisation in the crowd moving off after the game than there was in the Arsenal 11.

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Post #502530  Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 9:33 pm 
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Hey Rich, LTG and Soc,

Obviously City and Liverpool are miles ahead of everyone. And we lost to Chelsea handily in the Europa Cup final and until we actually show we can beat them, I have to consider them better. Good draw against Tottenham at home but I wouldn't say we are a better side right now. Man Utd is debatable but again, until we start being more consistent against them, they are a better side.

Would anyone say we can beat Soton, Leicester or Everton with any consistency? So, 6th or 7th is what we may be in here and now until we show we prove we are not. We collapsed last season. We didn't get 4th because we didn't deserve it. The old adage, the table never lies.

We have the potential to be a top 4 side this season. Chelsea aren't looking as strong, Tottenham are dropping points early. Man Utd aren't playing particularly well so far, so I think we may have an opportunity this season if erratic form is going to be rule this season for the aforementioned. So, 4th based on that. Not because we are looking particularly good. We look decent but not great. Too many new faces, etc, to get sorted, early days in the season. But I am cautiously optimistic.

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Post #502531  Posted: Mon Sep 16, 2019 10:04 pm 
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Rich wrote:
I’ve watched some clips again of us playing out from goal kicks and just can’t fathom what the idea is? I mean even with the opposition as cones in training it wouldn’t be obvious how we planned to move the ball upfield.

The typical set up had Sokratis and Luiz on the corners of the 6 yard box, the two full backs about 5 yards in from touch and slightly deeper than the edge of the box, and Guendouzi central on the edge of the box.
The typical play went Leno to Sokratis, as he’s closed it goes to Guendouzi who collects it facing his own goal rather than on the half turn, he’s rapidly closed and the ball goes square ish to AMN, who also has a player on him in a second. He can’t go back to Guendouzi or Sokratis so he goes down the line to Pépé who has come short, maybe 30 yards from our goal, close to the touchline and with a defender right up his backside. His only option is back to amn who then pumped a ball downfield to a lone forward with no support because all our players are within 30 yards of our own box......that is only if we haven’t lost it before the hoof.

For it to work with as little risk as possible you can’t rely on a player beating a man with skill (too risky in your own last 3rd) also you should rely on fantastic first touch or one touch football. It has to be reliant on movement and switches of play. If you’re intent on sucking the opposition in then you have to look for the space, not play it in ever decreasing small passes.

Just ditch it because we aren’t good enough to do it. Personally I’ve only seen two teams in my lifetime who are good enough to do it, the famous Barca team of 2009 (and surrounding years) and some of the most recent Man City teams - and even they conceded doing it recently.

I think Arsenal need to wake up to the fact that even teams at the bottom of the prem have very good players who are more than skilled enough to embarrass a top 6 side of given any kind of encouragement. Gone are the days when teams pack 10 men behind the ball against us

Well you'll love this. The coach of my son's U15 team has them trying to do it. The fullbacks are positioned just outside the 6 yard box, the CBs in the D and the wingers at the touchline about 25 yards from the goal line. My son usually plays right back and frigging hates it.

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Post #502532  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 4:00 am 
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dec wrote:
Rich wrote:
I’ve watched some clips again of us playing out from goal kicks and just can’t fathom what the idea is? I mean even with the opposition as cones in training it wouldn’t be obvious how we planned to move the ball upfield.

The typical set up had Sokratis and Luiz on the corners of the 6 yard box, the two full backs about 5 yards in from touch and slightly deeper than the edge of the box, and Guendouzi central on the edge of the box.
The typical play went Leno to Sokratis, as he’s closed it goes to Guendouzi who collects it facing his own goal rather than on the half turn, he’s rapidly closed and the ball goes square ish to AMN, who also has a player on him in a second. He can’t go back to Guendouzi or Sokratis so he goes down the line to Pépé who has come short, maybe 30 yards from our goal, close to the touchline and with a defender right up his backside. His only option is back to amn who then pumped a ball downfield to a lone forward with no support because all our players are within 30 yards of our own box......that is only if we haven’t lost it before the hoof.

For it to work with as little risk as possible you can’t rely on a player beating a man with skill (too risky in your own last 3rd) also you should rely on fantastic first touch or one touch football. It has to be reliant on movement and switches of play. If you’re intent on sucking the opposition in then you have to look for the space, not play it in ever decreasing small passes.

Just ditch it because we aren’t good enough to do it. Personally I’ve only seen two teams in my lifetime who are good enough to do it, the famous Barca team of 2009 (and surrounding years) and some of the most recent Man City teams - and even they conceded doing it recently.

I think Arsenal need to wake up to the fact that even teams at the bottom of the prem have very good players who are more than skilled enough to embarrass a top 6 side of given any kind of encouragement. Gone are the days when teams pack 10 men behind the ball against us

Well you'll love this. The coach of my son's U15 team has them trying to do it. The fullbacks are positioned just outside the 6 yard box, the CBs in the D and the wingers at the touchline about 25 yards from the goal line. My son usually plays right back and frigging hates it.

Is this bloke available to take over an EPL club?

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Post #502533  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 4:17 am 
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I think we should pay tribute to Frank Lampards tactical nouse. Facing a transfer ban he has proved himself capable of neutralising one of the rival clubs for the top 4, and getting them to pay 8mil in the process.

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Post #502534  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 4:48 am 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
We look decent but not great.

Sadly this is the bit where we differ. I can’t think of any performance this season that I’d describe as decent. The tactics, shape, structure and quality of much of our play is well below decent. We look a bit like an under nines team. Or as Graeme Souness summed it up - a semi pro team.

I really wish that it wasn’t that way. And we are regressing rather than progressing.

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Post #502535  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 6:55 am 
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socrates wrote:
City and Liverpool are untouchable but with the investments we made in the Summer Emery has no excuse not to challenge for 3rd or 4th spot.

Yeah, not really sure what AG is on about with us having to beat Chelsea and United to show we’re better when we actually won matches against both of them last year. We have gotten stronger on paper since then, and they haven’t, so 4th place is the absolute minimum we should accept this season.

Dreadful performance against Watford. We showed all of our flaws and very little of our potentially good sides. It’s a bit worrying that we basically have one good performance out of five games so far this season. The defensive side is one thing, I think we need our full backs and reinforcement centrally before we start to see real improvement theere, but there is no reason why we shouldn’t be able to put more pressure on Watford offensively with the players we have. We’re right where we need to be points wise, but we need to improve fast.


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Post #502536  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 6:57 am 
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Read this amazing stat this morning:
Over the course of 13 matches en route to the champions league final last year Spurs only led for 173 minutes. That’s 1270 minutes of matches. I thought they were jammy but that proves it


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Post #502537  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 7:01 am 
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Hazuki wrote:
socrates wrote:
City and Liverpool are untouchable but with the investments we made in the Summer Emery has no excuse not to challenge for 3rd or 4th spot.

It’s a bit worrying that we basically have one good performance out of five games so far this season.

I’m not sure we’ve even had 1 good performance.
Newcastle was disjointed, very few shots on goal and could easily have been a 0-0
Burnley was better but we still played a lot of that game messing around in our own final 3rd as Burnley pressed us high.
We had a good 45 mins v spurs in the second half but if Kane’s shot goes in instead of hitting the post at 2-1 we lose that game.

We’ve got a run of games where we should win 8 of the next 10 or so. We urgently need to start finding some form.


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Post #502538  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 7:08 am 
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Rich wrote:
We had a good 45 mins v spurs in the second half but if Kane’s shot goes in instead of hitting the post at 2-1 we lose that game.

Nah, we were good for the whole match against Tottenham. I think people's judgement of that game is skewed because of the ridiculous goals we gifted them, we bossed the midfield throughout the entire game and actually looked consistently threatening. Something we didn't do against Burnley, Newcastle or Watford.

But to be honest, at this point I wouldn't change the starting eleven much if anything at all. Don't think we're going to find any sort of rhythm by changing our formation and lineup every game.


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Post #502539  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:15 am 
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I think Emery who won the Europa cup three times in a row is capable of better than this, as is this squad of players.

The best starts to the season I remember were when we we pre seasoned in Austria. Everyone would tip Arsenal to drop out of the top four and we’d start the season like the proverbial well-oiled machine and by the time the wheels fell off in Feb-March we’d already built a decent points total and had loads of momentum.

Particularly compared to that I think we’re still ridiculously unsettled. Both first choice full backs and arguably a starting or a least supporting CB are out and only now looking to slowly integrate over the next couple of months. Pépé has had no preseason with us at all. Torreria came back so late he’s not been an option. The young players are clearly going to need a lot of support and time and even if they do start well like Willock we know from experience that tends to dry up and they shouldn’t be first choice.

It’s as far away from a fairly settled team with a settled philosophy having a smooth preseason as you could get.

My prediction was that we’d be a bit ropey at points but we’d muddle through at just below par (so on course for 5th/6th I suppose) until Christmas, then after the new year when Pépé’s settled, Holding Bellerin and Tierney have had a few games and Emery decides what we’re doing and we’ve given the young players some Europa experience we’d start to motor as a team. But it’d be too late to be anywhere near the top two and we’d be fourth maybe third depending on how much Chelsea Utd and Spurs struggle. My hope was third.

What I didn’t count on was this interminable *%^@ up and getting the balance of the team and tactics SO badly wrong. You can cope with muddling along and it’s a decent platform to improve. If it all implodes and recriminations start and Xhaka keeps saying we’re scared and we keep playing out from the back we’ll have no platform to kick on in Jan. If the club as a whole (looking at Edu and Sanlehi maybe) can keep their heads we should still make top four.

It feels like the equivalent of a boxer who if he can just survive the first round could go on to win on points.

Also you know when you hear something and you go “Yeah that feels right” Vieira to take over at the end of the season?


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Post #502540  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 10:02 am 
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Gaz from Oz wrote:
I think we should pay tribute to Frank Lampards tactical nouse. Facing a transfer ban he has proved himself capable of neutralising one of the rival clubs for the top 4, and getting them to pay 8mil in the process.

:laughing7:

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Post #502541  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 10:46 am 
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long time gooner wrote:
AmericanGooner wrote:
We look decent but not great.

Sadly this is the bit where we differ. I can’t think of any performance this season that I’d describe as decent. The tactics, shape, structure and quality of much of our play is well below decent. We look a bit like an under nines team. Or as Graeme Souness summed it up - a semi pro team.

I really wish that it wasn’t that way. And we are regressing rather than progressing.


Fair point and I would say our views depend on what greater context you view our side with. I view it our side presently as XI players, many of whom in vital positions (play making center mid for example as in Ceballos) that have never played together competitively and had to contend with Liverpool and Tottenham in its first 4 matches, as well as play away to a very tough ground like St. James Park.

Do we have a settled XI? Özil hasn't started for weeks and this was his first start. Pépé is still figuring out the language much less the country, culture, team, league.
Until Sunday, I'd say we had as good of a start as we could expect. We won against the sides below us. We drew against Tottenham who have a much better side than we do and we showed some testicular fortitude coming back. Losing to Liverpool away these days is no crime. Losing "only" 3-1, isn't either when we have lost to much worse Liverpool sides by a much bigger scoreline.

Not sure what we are all expecting this season at this point. Yes, we had a great transfer period, now we have to incorporate those players as well as wait on injured players like Bellerin and Tierney.

Again, do we even know what our first choice XI are? And even if anyone can answer that, they have to include Bellerin and Tierney who are out. No crime being frustrated and angry. I am. Trust me, I was dropping as many F bombs at the TV screen as I did on my trolls a half a decade or so ago (wow, its been that long? :icon_mrgreen: ) but after my tirade and I took a xanax and a glass of New Zealand wine ( :icon_mrgreen: ) logic and reason returned and I saw us in our proper place. A 2nd tier premier league club, on the cusp of first tier, in the midst of a transition.

We scored twice within :30 minutes away at grounds that is not easy to do so. Many fans are overlooking that. We aren't going to be famous for clean sheets ala 2004 Chelsea are we? Given how weak we are defensively. Watford was bound to score at least once. I don't think we can say with much confidence we can keep a clean sheet against at least 3/4 of the clubs in the league at a bare minimum. That's the state of things, its a known defect we have and until that is sorted, we will just have to live with that fact.

The calls for Emery to be sacked I see on the comments section online are..hmmm...what's that Brit word again? "Barmy" I think it is. :icon_mrgreen: We aren't going to sack him and bring in Zidane or Allegri fellas. We are going to get top club failures at best (Sarri, etc, ) We aren't at the point where we are hiring PL journeman managers like fat Sam, Warnock, Bruce or Coleman but we aren't going to get Pep to leave either. I am not even sure Mourinho would take the reigns if offered. Maybe but I wouldn't be shocked if he declined (not that I would want him).

Put it this way, I'd much rather be in our position, than Chelsea for example...they are in decline, we are building, slowly, but surely. I doubt Lamps can turn that around as well as OGS at Man Utd. Poch will have to deliver something soon as well.

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Post #502542  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 11:59 am 
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So the upcoming EPL remembering we haven't won in the last 3 games.
Aston Villa, Man U, Bournemouth, Sheffield Utd

IMO we must get 3 wins and at worst a draw versus Utd. I see no reason why we should not beat Utd but lets say we only get a draw I could live with it. Therefore 10/12 points.

Europa League - first 3 games must have 7 points with a draw at Frankfurt

League Cup must beat Forest.

Anything less and Emery should go.

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Post #502543  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 12:57 pm 
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Got bored with looking up more scathing reports and mused on what could be the best formation to get the required balance.

Was thinking a 4-2-1-3 seems to be the closest fit for the players we have.

but a 4-2-3-1 would provide more options to get out of the back and more cover in midfield.

Maybe a shift between the 2 depending on what's happening on the pitch as the adjustment doesn't require wholesale positional change.

About the best and most positive I can think of at the moment. :)


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Post #502544  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 3:48 pm 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
Not sure what we are all expecting this season at this point.

How about feeling at least reasonably confident of hanging on to a two goal lead against the bottom club in the division?

Even the best teams throw away leads. The problem is it is no longer a surprise when we do.

And the 'team in transition' excuse is wearing very thin too.

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Post #502545  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 3:58 pm 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
Watford was bound to score at least once. I don't think we can say with much confidence we can keep a clean sheet against at least 3/4 of the clubs in the league at a bare minimum. That's the state of things, its a known defect we have and until that is sorted, we will just have to live with that fact.

That's a very strange defense!

I am not calling for Emery to be sacked. I'm calling for him to remove his head from his culo and figure out how to get clean sheets away from home.

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Post #502546  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 4:34 pm 
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Headline: arsenal players fed up and confused by Emery’s repetitive training

If emery keeps getting us to train at the same thing we should see some improvement in whatever that thing is. Or are the players unable, unwilling to play how emery wants. Or is the way emery wants us to play completely flawed.
Or all of the above!


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Post #502547  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 4:51 pm 
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I read some people saying that they view emery as the manager simply tasked with keeping the seat warm whilst we undergo a complete change in playing staff and restructure of the club.
2 of the 3 men who hired emery are no longer at the club. It seems that 90% if transfer business has been taken away from the manager.


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Post #502548  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:10 pm 
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I hope we retain Emery and involve him in the transfers. It seems crazy to me when you have clubs with a sporting director that gets players with no input from the manager. A few American professional teams do that. We call that position "General Manager".

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Post #502549  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 9:40 pm 
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Rich wrote:
I read some people saying that they view emery as the manager simply tasked with keeping the seat warm whilst we undergo a complete change in playing staff and restructure of the club.
2 of the 3 men who hired emery are no longer at the club. It seems that 90% if transfer business has been taken away from the manager.

Hi Rich, Gazidis is obviously one of the men who hired him. Who is the other one who has left? It’s probably me forgetting who else was in the hierarchy at the time because I very much doubt Mislintat was involved in the appointment. This stuff about Emery keeping the seat warm while the overhaul in playing staff and restructuring takes place sounds to me a bit like ITKs who in reality are really NITKs (not in the know).

I still think the length of Emery’s time in post will be driven by whether Arsenal qualify for next season’s Champions League. If we do, whether through a top four place or winning the Europa League, I reckon he’ll keep his job for 2020/21. If we don’t, I believe Emery will get his P45 and be replaced. I’ll be surprised if that single issue isn’t by far the most decisive factor,


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Post #502550  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 11:07 pm 
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Bernard wrote:
Rich wrote:
I read some people saying that they view emery as the manager simply tasked with keeping the seat warm whilst we undergo a complete change in playing staff and restructure of the club.
2 of the 3 men who hired emery are no longer at the club. It seems that 90% if transfer business has been taken away from the manager.

Hi Rich, Gazidis is obviously one of the men who hired him. Who is the other one who has left? It’s probably me forgetting who else was in the hierarchy at the time because I very much doubt Mislintat was involved in the appointment. This stuff about Emery keeping the seat warm while the overhaul in playing staff and restructuring takes place sounds to me a bit like ITKs who in reality are really NITKs (not in the know).

I still think the length of Emery’s time in post will be driven by whether Arsenal qualify for next season’s Champions League. If we do, whether through a top four place or winning the Europa League, I reckon he’ll keep his job for 2020/21. If we don’t, I believe Emery will get his P45 and be replaced. I’ll be surprised if that single issue isn’t by far the most decisive factor,

It was Mislantat, Bernard out of the 3. Raul is only one left from that panel. Raul wanted Luis Enrique, not Emery, but ultimately it was Ivan' G's decision as noted from this quote...

"Unai has an outstanding track record of success throughout his career, has developed some of the best young talent in Europe and plays an exciting, progressive style of football that fits Arsenal perfectly," Arsenal chief executive Ivan Gazidis said. "His hard-working and passionate approach and his sense of values on and off the pitch make him the ideal person to take us forward."

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Post #502551  Posted: Tue Sep 17, 2019 11:26 pm 
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Zed wrote:
Bernard wrote:
Hi Rich, Gazidis is obviously one of the men who hired him. Who is the other one who has left? It’s probably me forgetting who else was in the hierarchy at the time because I very much doubt Mislintat was involved in the appointment. This stuff about Emery keeping the seat warm while the overhaul in playing staff and restructuring takes place sounds to me a bit like ITKs who in reality are really NITKs (not in the know).

I still think the length of Emery’s time in post will be driven by whether Arsenal qualify for next season’s Champions League. If we do, whether through a top four place or winning the Europa League, I reckon he’ll keep his job for 2020/21. If we don’t, I believe Emery will get his P45 and be replaced. I’ll be surprised if that single issue isn’t by far the most decisive factor,

It was Mislantat, Bernard out of the 3. Raul is only one left from that panel. Raul wanted Luis Enrique, not Emery, but ultimately it was Ivan' G's decision as noted from this quote...

"Unai has an outstanding track record of success throughout his career, has developed some of the best young talent in Europe and plays an exciting, progressive style of football that fits Arsenal perfectly," Arsenal chief executive Ivan Gazidis said. "His hard-working and passionate approach and his sense of values on and off the pitch make him the ideal person to take us forward."

Okay, I stand corrected. I had always assumed Mislintat’s job focussed on the recruitment of players, not the head coach.


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Post #502552  Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2019 1:27 am 
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Results in CL today were pretty good. If other clubs fighting for top 4 have to stretch their squad for the group stages all the better for us

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Post #502553  Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2019 5:19 am 
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Gaz from Oz wrote:
Results in CL today were pretty good. If other clubs fighting for top 4 have to stretch their squad for the group stages all the better for us

Agreed, but we want all 4 to qualify for the KO round so they don’t drop in to the Europa League


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Post #502554  Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2019 6:09 am 
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Bernard wrote:
Rich wrote:
I read some people saying that they view emery as the manager simply tasked with keeping the seat warm whilst we undergo a complete change in playing staff and restructure of the club.
2 of the 3 men who hired emery are no longer at the club. It seems that 90% if transfer business has been taken away from the manager.

Hi Rich, Gazidis is obviously one of the men who hired him. Who is the other one who has left? It’s probably me forgetting who else was in the hierarchy at the time because I very much doubt Mislintat was involved in the appointment. This stuff about Emery keeping the seat warm while the overhaul in playing staff and restructuring takes place sounds to me a bit like ITKs who in reality are really NITKs (not in the know).

I still think the length of Emery’s time in post will be driven by whether Arsenal qualify for next season’s Champions League. If we do, whether through a top four place or winning the Europa League, I reckon he’ll keep his job for 2020/21. If we don’t, I believe Emery will get his P45 and be replaced. I’ll be surprised if that single issue isn’t by far the most decisive factor,

Hi Bernard, I don’t know but I suspect the ‘keeping the seat warm’ wasn’t so much that he was appointed to do that but more that it has turned out that way....as it may have done for any manager coming in to the mess we were and the amount of player churn we needed. That is not to say that emery has helped himself here though


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Post #502555  Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2019 6:20 am 
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Alf inge Halaand’s son is playing football for RB Salzburg, he’s 19, just scored a champions league hat trick and has 17 goals in 9 games so far this season. One to watch


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Post #502556  Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2019 7:07 am 
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Rich wrote:
Bernard wrote:
Hi Rich, Gazidis is obviously one of the men who hired him. Who is the other one who has left? It’s probably me forgetting who else was in the hierarchy at the time because I very much doubt Mislintat was involved in the appointment. This stuff about Emery keeping the seat warm while the overhaul in playing staff and restructuring takes place sounds to me a bit like ITKs who in reality are really NITKs (not in the know).

I still think the length of Emery’s time in post will be driven by whether Arsenal qualify for next season’s Champions League. If we do, whether through a top four place or winning the Europa League, I reckon he’ll keep his job for 2020/21. If we don’t, I believe Emery will get his P45 and be replaced. I’ll be surprised if that single issue isn’t by far the most decisive factor,

Hi Bernard, I don’t know but I suspect the ‘keeping the seat warm’ wasn’t so much that he was appointed to do that but more that it has turned out that way....as it may have done for any manager coming in to the mess we were and the amount of player churn we needed. That is not to say that emery has helped himself here though

Rich, I really don’t think it has turned out that way yet. People are reacting to and dare I say jumping to conclusions too quickly after a dismal performance at Watford. A few wins and what’s being written will change, I reckon. I really don’t think it’s certain Emery will be sacked. If we qualify for the Champions League I fully expect him to still be in post next season. If we don’t, I think he’ll be gone. I see it as that simple.


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Post #502557  Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2019 7:31 am 
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Ffs get your finger out Emery.

Dislike all the calls, okay a few calls, for Mourinho to sort us out.

If he has to go I'd rather keep it in house.


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Post #502558  Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2019 9:09 am 
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Xhaka completely open prior to the Sokratis gift. Why couldn't Leno just throw it over the 2 Watford players? I recall that being a Lehman favourite usually to the full backs / Wingers so why on Earth can't Leno do it. Surely easier than a Goalie trying to use their feet.

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Post #502559  Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2019 9:23 am 
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WARRIOR: For the last 3 weeks or so I haven’t been able to connect to this site. Weirdly my phone can access the site. Any ideas how to solve this issue, as I prefer to interact with the site with a laptop. Thanks


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Post #502560  Posted: Wed Sep 18, 2019 9:29 am 
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From the things I've read and the leaks from behind the scenes I have the feeling that Emery is (to use a footballing cliche) losing the dressing room.

Once that happens I think there is only one ending.

It is sad because I had high hopes when he first arrived on the scene but I think it was clear at the end of last season (even before that to be honest) that things were just not improving, if anything they were getting worse. I fear his inability to grasp the english language and the footballing vernacular in particular has not helped. That is not a criticism, by the way, it's bloody hard to learn a new language at his age.

The mixed form of rivals like MU and Chelsea may keep us in the race for top four for a while but unless Bellerin and Tierney hit the ground running or Pépé find's some worldbeating form I think it will be a slog again this season.


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