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Post #478281  Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 8:07 pm 
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Daz wrote:
Fully automated luxury communism - that's an entirely different kettle of makey-uppy nonsense. I also had some sympathy for Lenin's proposal to make bogs out of gold after the revolution. Just a shame Stalin came along and turned the murderous Cheka into the mass-murderous NKVD.

The first part of your post went right over my head. What on earth is Fully automated Luxury communism and what does it have to do with Lenin? 'Make bogs out of gold' is new to me. I presume Lenin meant bogs as in 'crappers', because 'swamps' wouldn't make sense. It is an odd one, because it's hard to reconcile with Lenin's ascetic nature and seems more the style of oligarchs or EPL footballers. (As I side note, I would categorise both of these classes as as more worthy of cynicism that Bolsheviks ... and even, on my new grading, estate agents.)

As for the Cheka (you could add the suppression of the Kronstadt rebellion amongst other things) what can one say? How do revolutions deal with counter-revolutionaries? This is always going to be controversial even when intentions are pure (what do you do with the AWB or fascists or royalists who simply won't abide by the rules, for example?). And of course it is going to open up the danger of reigns of terror and/or stiffing bureaucracy (in the Soviet case, politburos, central committees, etc.)

Where you seem to be wrong (I am going from what you say) is that you seem to be characterising Lenin as some combination of an old-fashioned strongman (not much different from Uncle Joe) and wide-eyed, half-mad idealist. From what I have read of Lenin (and I am no expert--as my ignorance of his views on crappers shows) he was a pragmatist par excellence. There was a kind of mad optimism about the whole Soviet experiment, but it was the madness of the unique historical opportunity and the awareness something has to be done. Apart form that madness and the idealism of the belief in progress (if not the perfectibility of human society), Lenin was uncannily aware of what he was facing and the odds against success, including the grave dangers of vanguarism, bureaucracy, reaction, etc.. So I would say that Lenin and Trotsky were quite remarkable figures, both in their thoughts and deeds. Lenin may well have been a bit too ruthless, but I don't see how that makes his writings any less interesting or relevant.

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Post #478282  Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 8:49 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
kiwipete wrote:

Well I sure as hell didn't think of it ; we were happily paying rent .

He gave us what turned out to be sound advice and we ended up pocketing $70 , 000 grand ... fail to see what there is to be cynical about there . :icon_scratch:


My point is such

If you buy property anywhere in the south of England and keep it for a sustained period. You are going to make serious wedge and you don't need some Pratt in a shiny suit and Audi TT from an estate agent to tell you this. It's blatantly obvious


" some Pratt in a shiny suit and an Audi TT " fairly broad brush strokes .: you seem to be going to great lengths to get your point across while missing the blatantly obvious .........it's horses for courses .

Here's an example ... my mates wife took their $12,000 car for a Warrant of Fitness [ MOT in Pom language ] it failed because of rust in the chassis . Mechanic painted an end of the world picture , next stop the scrapyard .
Doom and gloom they are up for a new car .

I had a look and said I can weld that . Got some 3mm plate , shaped it , weld .... it passed .

The point I'm making [ and reinforced by the learned Decaf ] is what might seem blatently obvious to you is not neccessarily the same to the next cookie .


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Post #478283  Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 9:20 pm 
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kiwipete wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:

My point is such

If you buy property anywhere in the south of England and keep it for a sustained period. You are going to make serious wedge and you don't need some Pratt in a shiny suit and Audi TT from an estate agent to tell you this. It's blatantly obvious


" some Pratt in a shiny suit and an Audi TT " fairly broad brush strokes .: you seem to be going to great lengths to get your point across while missing the blatantly obvious .........it's horses for courses .

Here's an example ... my mates wife took their $12,000 car for a Warrant of Fitness [ MOT in Pom language ] it failed because of rust in the chassis . Mechanic painted an end of the world picture , next stop the scrapyard .
Doom and gloom they are up for a new car .

I had a look and said I can weld that . Got some 3mm plate , shaped it , weld .... it passed .

The point I'm making [ and reinforced by the learned Decaf ] is what might seem blatently obvious to you is not neccessarily the same to the next cookie .


I can agree with that generally but if you can't see house prices going up in Kent or the south of England you haven't been paying enough attention.

As for the rest of the stuff, What the *%^@ are you talking about Bro? Has AG nicked your laptop ?


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Post #478284  Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 9:24 pm 
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Decaf wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:

Just so I'm clear. The estate agent you spoke to provided advice that you remain in his gratitude to right up to this very day and that was that house prices in Kent were likely to go up over the next few years and he knew a mortgage consultant.

I'll try and avoid the temptation to be sarcastic and ask if you feel such advice could be provided elsewhere by other means and if this couldn't have been foreseen anyway.

"Buy land, AJ, 'cause God ain't making any more of it" -Tony Soprano

What you are missing is that a lot of people are clueless. My sister's husband bought a house in Eire just before the crash, despite this being obviously stupid.

So estate agents operate in this environment, either giving people sage advice and saving people money (as in Kiwi's example) or earning their bad reputation.

Where I live estate agents have a bad reputation, but that is mostly because of their activities in the rental market, which is a tough one, especially when most of the tenants are students.

Should we be more cynical about estate agents than the Kmyr Rouge? Certainly not. But very few people have had their deposits witheld by the Kmyr Rouge.

From my experience in Oz they are a mixture of both. When they rent they should be protecting the owners properties and rights and take the hard line. Do some do the wrong thing - yes. But then there are many who are good agents who are thoughtful and do the right thing.

No different than any profession.

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Post #478285  Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 9:35 pm 
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Decaf wrote:
Niall wrote:
Prices are soaring again so your sis might yet be euros in if she still has the property.


That she is. Her husband ran off with another women. He then promptly died and his life insurance paid off the bond.

She didn't see it as poetic justice but I must confess that I did.

Mate you can't leave the story hanging like that.

Did he die from the physical exertions of his new life style. If so the Pro Wengers will be saying 'be careful what you wish for. The grass is not always greener on the other side.'

On the other hand the Wenger outers will be saying 'great to get rid of him. She got rid of someone who was not doing the best for her and in fact she may have ultimately benefitted.'

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Post #478286  Posted: Tue Dec 05, 2017 9:42 pm 
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If Liverpool win their ECL group tomorrow night then Chelsea will either play Barca, PSG or Betikas in the next round. Come on Liverpool and a wish that Chelsea then don't draw Bestikas.

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Post #478287  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 7:33 am 
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bubblechris wrote:
Goonie wrote:
And just last season he got 19 goals in all comps. I can't think of many squaddies that can do that.


Don't be silly how can we play Walcott when according to some both Welbeck and Iwobi are both more productive?
Has AW given Walcott the chance to prove his worth this season? Answer NO. Should he be given a chance to make the right wing at least his own? Answer YES.


I like Welbeck - he's a handful for opposition defenders and causes them a lot of problems. I think we should just go back to two upfront with Giroud, Lacazette, Welbeck and Walcott fighting for the two spots.


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Post #478288  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 7:49 am 
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bubblechris wrote:
Don't be silly how can we play Walcott when according to some both Welbeck and Iwobi are both more productive?
Has AW given Walcott the chance to prove his worth this season? Answer NO. Should he be given a chance to make the right wing at least his own? Answer YES.

I think we should've sold Walcott after the 15/16 season, and I certainly don't want to play him ahead of Welbeck (who is just plain better) or Iwobi (who suits our system and has the potential to be a lot better), but to act like he never contributed to the team or was never a good player is just plain incorrect.


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Post #478289  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:59 am 
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Hazuki wrote:
bubblechris wrote:
Don't be silly how can we play Walcott when according to some both Welbeck and Iwobi are both more productive?
Has AW given Walcott the chance to prove his worth this season? Answer NO. Should he be given a chance to make the right wing at least his own? Answer YES.

I think we should've sold Walcott after the 15/16 season, and I certainly don't want to play him ahead of Welbeck (who is just plain better) or Iwobi (who suits our system and has the potential to be a lot better), but to act like he never contributed to the team or was never a good player is just plain incorrect.

I stand 100% behind my view that he was never good enough for a club with ambitions to win the CL and EPL. He never gave 100% effort for any game, defensively was negligent and for a winger was incapable of delivering an accurate ball onto a forwards head.

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Post #478290  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:52 am 
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TOP GUN wrote:
kiwipete wrote:

" some Pratt in a shiny suit and an Audi TT " fairly broad brush strokes .: you seem to be going to great lengths to get your point across while missing the blatantly obvious .........it's horses for courses .

Here's an example ... my mates wife took their $12,000 car for a Warrant of Fitness [ MOT in Pom language ] it failed because of rust in the chassis . Mechanic painted an end of the world picture , next stop the scrapyard .
Doom and gloom they are up for a new car .

I had a look and said I can weld that . Got some 3mm plate , shaped it , weld .... it passed .

The point I'm making [ and reinforced by the learned Decaf ] is what might seem blatently obvious to you is not neccessarily the same to the next cookie .


I can agree with that generally but if you can't see house prices going up in Kent or the south of England you haven't been paying enough attention.

As for the rest of the stuff, What the *%^@ are you talking about Bro? Has AG nicked your laptop ?



Through gritted teeth ..... NO ... I didn't see house prices would go up , mortgages were cheap ; because I was a f**^^% welder not a financial whizz kid ..... can you not grasp that .........?

if you cant you might be closer to the American halfwit than you think.


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Post #478291  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:32 am 
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Gaz from Oz wrote:
I stand 100% behind my view that he was never good enough for a club with ambitions to win the CL and EPL. He never gave 100% effort for any game, defensively was negligent and for a winger was incapable of delivering an accurate ball onto a forwards head.

Certainly a flawed player (though his final ball is not nearly as bad as you describe, as evidenced by his more than decent number of assists through the years) and I wouldn't argue if you called him one dimensional. But he is (or was) a good goal scorer and overall useful player in the final third.

As for your first sentence, if you replace Pedro with Walcott in the Chelsea squad last year, would you seriously not expect them to still win the league?


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Post #478292  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:43 am 
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House prices in London currently sticking around 2014 levels nobody knows what will happen with Brexit just saying.


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Post #478293  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:44 am 
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kiwipete wrote:
because I was a f**^^% welder


If it's any consolation I have a genuine admiration for and envy of welders.

Proper job.


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Post #478294  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:46 am 
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Although my first wife now has about as much regard for me as General Pinochet, her dad was a welder and I always got on really well with him.


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Post #478295  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:49 am 
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Hazuki wrote:
Gaz from Oz wrote:
I stand 100% behind my view that he was never good enough for a club with ambitions to win the CL and EPL. He never gave 100% effort for any game, defensively was negligent and for a winger was incapable of delivering an accurate ball onto a forwards head.

Certainly a flawed player (though his final ball is not nearly as bad as you describe, as evidenced by his more than decent number of assists through the years) and I wouldn't argue if you called him one dimensional. But he is (or was) a good goal scorer and overall useful player in the final third.

As for your first sentence, if you replace Pedro with Walcott in the Chelsea squad last year, would you seriously not expect them to still win the league?


Exactly so. Though despite his possible incompetence he manages to score goals..................


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Post #478296  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:02 am 
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Daz wrote:
kiwipete wrote:
because I was a f**^^% welder


If it's any consolation I have a genuine admiration for and envy of welders.

Proper job.

:laughing7: :laughing7: wonderful how this f***&^% ponsy tubby arsed knob sometimes shells the verbosity but still takes the piss .


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Post #478297  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:55 am 
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Hazuki wrote:
Gaz from Oz wrote:
I stand 100% behind my view that he was never good enough for a club with ambitions to win the CL and EPL. He never gave 100% effort for any game, defensively was negligent and for a winger was incapable of delivering an accurate ball onto a forwards head.

Certainly a flawed player (though his final ball is not nearly as bad as you describe, as evidenced by his more than decent number of assists through the years) and I wouldn't argue if you called him one dimensional. But he is (or was) a good goal scorer and overall useful player in the final third.

As for your first sentence, if you replace Pedro with Walcott in the Chelsea squad last year, would you seriously not expect them to still win the league?

Last year was a productive year. But was it worth waiting 12 barren years for. A review of the goals he scored last year shows there were important ones against Bayern, Chelsea, Liverpool and Man City (2 w 2D).

But there were cup goals against Lincoln Sutton Basel Ludogorets and a hatrick against Southampton. You may recall the Southampton team was described by some as a third team. I think Perez got a couple as well. Other EPL goals Stoke Hull Swansea Bournemouth and Westham.

I don't think you should disregard the demand to play centreforward when Wenger caved in and gave him a ton of cash.

If he is such a great player why has his greatest supporter Wenger abandoned him.

I am afraid that no manager like Conte would put up with his disappearing act. I don't think he would be a replacement for Pedro ever. I cannot stand any player who does not try. I accuse Walcott of not trying on occasions. Just not interested and never tried to tune in to the game.

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Post #478298  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:58 am 
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TOP GUN wrote:
kiwipete wrote:

" some Pratt in a shiny suit and an Audi TT " fairly broad brush strokes .: you seem to be going to great lengths to get your point across while missing the blatantly obvious .........it's horses for courses .

Here's an example ... my mates wife took their $12,000 car for a Warrant of Fitness [ MOT in Pom language ] it failed because of rust in the chassis . Mechanic painted an end of the world picture , next stop the scrapyard .
Doom and gloom they are up for a new car .

I had a look and said I can weld that . Got some 3mm plate , shaped it , weld .... it passed .

The point I'm making [ and reinforced by the learned Decaf ] is what might seem blatently obvious to you is not neccessarily the same to the next cookie .


I can agree with that generally but if you can't see house prices going up in Kent or the south of England you haven't been paying enough attention.

As for the rest of the stuff, What the *%^@ are you talking about Bro? Has AG nicked your laptop ?

What goes up often comes down, though. If you can hang on through the cycle you'll almost always come up on top (obviously I am not talking about areas going through longer term declines, like old mining towns in SA), but large swathes of the middle class couldn't after the 2008 crisis. The idea that it is always wiser for the middle classes to own rather than rent (courtesy of Thatcher and Franco) is pretty threadbare.

The global economy is burning it up at the moment because of Trump's slash and burn policies. But you'd have to be brave to bet against a major correction sooner rather than later. The underlying issues have never been resolved and US midterm elections are looming.

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Post #478299  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 12:33 pm 
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Gaz from Oz wrote:
Decaf wrote:

That she is. Her husband ran off with another women. He then promptly died and his life insurance paid off the bond.

She didn't see it as poetic justice but I must confess that I did.

Mate you can't leave the story hanging like that.

Did he die from the physical exertions of his new life style.

Nothing like that. It was a cancer that he discovered very late. And I exaggerated a fair bit when I said 'promptly', Nasty business.

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Post #478300  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 1:01 pm 
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Did you know that there is still a Highbury Stadium.

It's in Fleetwood......................

Be great to get drawn against them in the FA Cup.


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Post #478301  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 1:56 pm 
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Gaz from Oz wrote:
Last year was a productive year. But was it worth waiting 12 barren years for.

But if you consider last season productive, he's had three seasons before that were more productive. Between 2010-2013 he averaged 10 goals and 8 assists in the league, which are not bad numbers.

As for Conte not putting up with him, we are still comparing him to Pedro (who started 26 league games for Chelsea last season). Hardly a player who I would say exemplifies intensity, work rate and defensive nous.


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Post #478302  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 3:43 pm 
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The US government, be it local, state or nationally, took over the mob's 'bread and butter' businesses. The mafia had underground casinos for decades. Also, when you hear the term 'the numbers racket' in those old gangster movies, they are essentially talking about lotto.
Every major (and minor) northern city had a numbers racket. It paid better than the government did when it took it over. Plus no taxes. They had an impeachable, publicly known and widely available system for the 3 numbers. In New York one of the methods used was the last 3 digits of the Dow Jones or the last 3 numbers of the daily circulation of the New York Times.
The stock market has been called 'The world's largest casino' at times as well.

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Post #478303  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 4:03 pm 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
The US government, be it local, state or nationally, took over the mob's 'bread and butter' businesses. The mafia had underground casinos for decades. Also, when you hear the term 'the numbers racket' in those old gangster movies, they are essentially talking about lotto.
Every major (and minor) northern city had a numbers racket. It paid better than the government did when it took it over. Plus no taxes. They had an impeachable, publicly known and widely available system for the 3 numbers. In New York one of the methods used was the last 3 digits of the Dow Jones or the last 3 numbers of the daily circulation of the New York Times.
The stock market has been called 'The world's largest casino' at times as well.


Oi AG take your ferkin meds you loon tube. :mr100_IsBruceLeeX:


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Post #478304  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 4:38 pm 
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Us not being in the competition I've not seen one whole match this season in the CL. Anyone else reduce their CL viewing either?
My only interest in the competition is hoping all the English sides do badly..lol. :icon_mrgreen: My CL interest has been reduced to highlights when it happens to be on the news.

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Post #478305  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 5:02 pm 
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Now Trump and the NRA are trying to pass a law allowing people to carry conceal weapon across state borders. The insanity continues.
The public display or even concealment in public is completely nuts.
There was a recent shooting at a store when the cops came the suspect as well as others had their guns out and the cops had no idea who were the 'good guys' and who were the 'bad guys'.
But as the adage goes, you get the government you deserve. I'm also reminded about that other adage about when good men do nothing.
Lastly, with Trump looking to start a war where ever he can get it to distract us, will the UK follow him into the abyss?

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Post #478306  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 6:10 pm 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
Us not being in the competition I've not seen one whole match this season in the CL. Anyone else reduce their CL viewing either?
My only interest in the competition is hoping all the English sides do badly..lol. .

I want all the sides in the CL to do bad. It's no fun at all.

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Post #478307  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 6:33 pm 
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Really enjoy not being in the CL - it's a rubbish competition run almost solely for TV. Couldn't give a flying *%^@ about it.

How's the Sibelius, Hoy, did she have her wrist warmers on?


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Post #478308  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:10 pm 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
Now Trump and the NRA are trying to pass a law allowing people to carry conceal weapon across state borders. The insanity continues.
The public display or even concealment in public is completely nuts.
There was a recent shooting at a store when the cops came the suspect as well as others had their guns out and the cops had no idea who were the 'good guys' and who were the 'bad guys'.
But as the adage goes, you get the government you deserve. I'm also reminded about that other adage about when good men do nothing.
Lastly, with Trump looking to start a war where ever he can get it to distract us, will the UK follow him into the abyss?

Those midterm can't come soon enough. Either that or he'll run out of insanely stupid things to do. Jerusalem? He's reckless to the point of insanity.

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Post #478309  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:31 pm 
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AG's favourite invincibles team are losing 2-0 to Shaktar Donetsk.

Maybe that'll shut him up.


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Post #478310  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:22 pm 
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Daz wrote:
Really enjoy not being in the CL - it's a rubbish competition run almost solely for TV. Couldn't give a flying *%^@ about it..

Sounds a bit like the Premier League to me.

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Post #478311  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:54 pm 
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dec wrote:
Daz wrote:
Really enjoy not being in the CL - it's a rubbish competition run almost solely for TV. Couldn't give a flying *%^@ about it..

Sounds a bit like the Premier League to me.

:icon_rabbit:

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Post #478312  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 10:34 pm 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
The US government, be it local, state or nationally, took over the mob's 'bread and butter' businesses. The mafia had underground casinos for decades. Also, when you hear the term 'the numbers racket' in those old gangster movies, they are essentially talking about lotto.
Every major (and minor) northern city had a numbers racket. It paid better than the government did when it took it over. Plus no taxes. They had an impeachable, publicly known and widely available system for the 3 numbers. In New York one of the methods used was the last 3 digits of the Dow Jones or the last 3 numbers of the daily circulation of the New York Times.
The stock market has been called 'The world's largest casino' at times as well.

AG chatting to CasinoBot :20hospitals:


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Post #478313  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:56 pm 
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Daz wrote:
House prices in London currently sticking around 2014 levels nobody knows what will happen with Brexit just saying.


Do you know many people who have lost money in property over a 5 year period ?


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Post #478314  Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 11:58 pm 
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Wiltord or Freddie ? If you had to pick?


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Post #478315  Posted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 12:03 am 
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kiwipete wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:

I can agree with that generally but if you can't see house prices going up in Kent or the south of England you haven't been paying enough attention.

As for the rest of the stuff, What the *%^@ are you talking about Bro? Has AG nicked your laptop ?



Through gritted teeth ..... NO ... I didn't see house prices would go up , mortgages were cheap ; because I was a f**^^% welder not a financial whizz kid ..... can you not grasp that .........?

if you cant you might be closer to the American halfwit than you think.


Ok mate I won't respond further as your a good laugh but my point is that you don't need to be a financial whizz to know what's happening with property prices therefore estate agents aren't major value contributors. buy land .. you'll thank me


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Post #478316  Posted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:19 am 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Wiltord or Freddie ? If you had to pick?

I am not sure we should make light of the casino business.

Apparently the master plan for end of season is take all the money we get from Alexis, Özil, Walcott and Wilshire and place it on the number 7. If it comes home we get to buy a moderately okay footballer but if it doesn't we will look for a 16yo from some obscure country to replace the 4 of them.

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Post #478317  Posted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 7:56 am 
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bromley gooner wrote:
AmericanGooner wrote:
The US government, be it local, state or nationally, took over the mob's 'bread and butter' businesses. The mafia had underground casinos for decades. Also, when you hear the term 'the numbers racket' in those old gangster movies, they are essentially talking about lotto.
Every major (and minor) northern city had a numbers racket. It paid better than the government did when it took it over. Plus no taxes. They had an impeachable, publicly known and widely available system for the 3 numbers. In New York one of the methods used was the last 3 digits of the Dow Jones or the last 3 numbers of the daily circulation of the New York Times.
The stock market has been called 'The world's largest casino' at times as well.

AG chatting to CasinoBot :20hospitals:


Won't belong before he 'blocks' that too.

Still, at least it's given him someone to talk to.

Do bots lend a sympathetic listening ear?

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Post #478318  Posted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:07 pm 
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Tonights match will test my interest in the competition and the side in general tonight. I think I may end up watching it but its not a foregone conclusion.

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Post #478319  Posted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 3:11 pm 
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Looking ahead to the Manchester derby, literally will be holding my nose hoping Man Utd wins for no other reason than my silly fear City goes unbeaten.

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Post #478320  Posted: Thu Dec 07, 2017 4:14 pm 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
Looking ahead to the Manchester derby, literally will be holding my nose hoping Man Utd wins for no other reason than my silly fear City goes unbeaten.


Could you not do us a little favour and hold your breath till the game finishes?


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