Whilst I'm a fan of Özil and Sanchez you can't deny that what they are currently doing is extremley damaging for the club and totally inconsiderate.

Basically we've made 2x 300 grand a week life changing offers but they will both drag this out now to the last moment on the off chance the club might add ten percent or something. This means that we can't plan for additions or squad building until they let us know if their both arseholes or not.

You absolute spunk monkeys, how much *%^@*** money is enough. I mean seriously.

Ox gets a pass on this, I'm genuinely surprised arsene hasn't tried him in goal yet as he's played everywhere else. That's gotta piss you off

It's a business. Look at what Ronaldo is doing.

Ox wouldn't get a pass from me at all. He has never put a decent run of games together. He says that central midfield is his position but he has yet to show the composure, passing ability or positional sense to play there.

Seriously how much *%^@*** money is enough ?

If your getting 280 grand a week why behave like a prize *%^@ to get another 20

You always seem to try and compare Arsenal's current state with absolute low points in the dim and distant past to try and lessen how bad things may be getting under Wenger.

Rather than comparing ourselves to a decade from the late fifties, what performance on the pitch next season you you consider unacceptable for Arsenal and worthy of Wenger getting sacked? Nothing to do with any revelations about his personal life or corruption, which I simply don't believe there will be. I'm talking about the performance of the team on the pitch. Is there anything that would make you support his sacking?

Don't be restricted by the unlikelihood of some things. If it would take nothing less than relegation for you to support his dismissal, that's fine.

Good to see you're beginning to smell the coffee......................

50% scorecard ...first totally wrong , far from a problem I think Sanchez would fit seemlessly into the Man City lineup . Better than Aguero in my book
Second correct ....... the Ox , to be applauded for his speed and work ethic , but some of his passing and shooting is abysmal ...not sure who replaces him though like for like

I wasn't "shamefully" waving it around like some red rag in front of a bull , and I am at a total loss , it must be the only word in the English language to have that distinction . People can F &^% and C*&^ quite happily on here ...but I value your slow paced narritives and takes on most things Old Man ..... so will never utter it again and leave you to concentrate on your current battle with Bernard ... Good Luck

Too late for a Newk v Bungert result I feel ... I'd liken an argument with Bernard to gently slipping into a quagmire with an octopus clamped over your face

You have to keep the retorts short , decisive don't leave him wriggle room a chance to move the goalposts , the ground , the venue ...and don't get me wrong ; I like Bernard .

How have I moved the goalposts? It was he who decided to associate decline with a decade from the late fifties.

Well I did actually say in the post above that we have declined since his peak year in 2004, which is not too far in the past? We see things differently. You are now obsessed with getting rid of the manager, whereas I am not overly-bothered either way because he will be leaving sooner rather than later anyway. The issue for me during all the airplane and wanting the team to lose nonsense, was not wanting to see him hounded out in a poor and undeserved way. Also, I couldn't see another obvious available alternative manager big enough to take over and improve Arsenal. I am a positive Arsenal fan, and after the brilliant win over Chelzee, my spirits are up. I am not interested in negativity.

Hi Kiwi - I've had my say on the n word and am moving on. You are right about 'debates' with Bernard - always five sets with tie-breaks along the way. And plenty of 'You cannot be serious' thrown in. Makes Passarell v Gonzalez look like a quick affair. I suppose I must like Bernard too - I keep on keeping on with him, at the risk of my own mental health. I sometimes wonder if he'd taken up that generous offer in Bryantwood Road all those years ago, might he be a less intense debater? I mean, a thing like that could change your whole outlook on all sorts of matters.

I feel obsessed is far too strong a word. I'm a long way from being his strongest critic on here. However, I do think he's doing more harm than good to the club, so would welcome his departure. Although that won't happen for another two years at least.

Don't know that you have ; but your reputation for meandering dialogue , splitting hairs , moving the goalposts , going off on a tangent precedes you

Think back to the famous epics on here Wiltord v Ljungberg , Supply and Demand , Terry Mancini [ your one defeat ] Bayern Munich and now Dominant clubs ...... protracted struggles all

They all have one common denominator ..... YOU

Sanchez, Özil and the Ox have done nothing wrong at this time. They have a contract for another year.

You lead by example, and the leader chose to leave it until less than 8 weeks from the end of a contract to deal with the issue of extending his own contract. Just because you throw a pile of money at them does not mean they must sign a new contract. If Alexis is really dealing with the next 4-5 years of his life by signing a new contract he will also need to believe that he will win something. Özil likewise and the Ox will want regular starting in one position.

Why should they sign - apparently at our club, 8 weeks before it expires is acceptable or is there one rule for Wenger and one for everyone else.

The whole idea that you can sell someone because they have a contract with you is strange and I think borders on illegal. Still football seems to get away with it.

23 days until our first match. I hope the changes Gazidis promised are operational by that time and our top top signings are available and working within the squad. We don't want to give our competitors an advantage.

It’s definitely bizarre. If Kroenke has no desire to interact with the players, why be around the team at all? And if he has no desire to be around the team, why own it?

Tweed/linen/khaki manbags are quite the 'in' accessory I believe. Have you updated the Barnett accordingly?

Actually that's a good point, that I hadn't really thought of in any great depth. Wenger apparently delayed signing a new deal until he received firm assurances that there will be no, or at most next to no, changes in his level of power, authority and control across the club (I read even bloody Gerry Peyton is keeping his job, who I'd count as a barely noticeable sacrifice for Wenger to make from his assortment of lemmings under him). So why isn't it okay for Sanchez and Özil to delay renewing their contracts until they have whatever assurances they're looking for (your guess that it's having more chance of winning the bigger trophies at Arsenal might be a reasonable)? As you also say, why isn't it okay for Chamberlain to wait until he gets assurances about his first team place?

I suspect Sanchez' position may be complicated a little if dec is right that he simply prefers not to hang around the same place for too long. But if he is going to sign a new contract at Arsenal, why not look for the sort of assurances you outline before putting pen to paper? They weren't the same type of assurances, but Wenger did after all.

Bernard, I await OMOH's response. I think Alexis has a different way of thinking about life and I would understand if he moves on. The dogs might be bored with the current walks they have and may need new challenges in their life. Alexis has an FA Cup medal, a Copa America medal and probably would love to add an EPL medal and WC winners medal. The last he may have limited chance of owning but you just never know. As someone who moved a few times in my career for challenges not necessarily money I can understand his mind set. I am sure Kiwi probably understands the need to move on to avoid staleness. He has probably been to many countries and companies before they run him out of town.

How any of you can compare to Wenger is beyond me, it's unbelievable.

Wenger has been nothing but a true Gooner, unfortunately not the right Gooner to drive us on, while Sanchez has behaved like a spoilt brat.

well put together

... saw Passarell play in the doubles with Bob Lutz at the Aussie Open ....... I thought he was the ultimate in cool , Lutz as well ...good serve and volley nice no nonsense economical style .

He is NOT a football fan. We are investment. Pure and simple. No different than shares of a company on the stock exchange. Accept that reality.

Personally, I think its sacrilege to sell the team to a man who is not an Arsenal but not even a fan of the sport. He's an American football man. I've always said I'd love to wager him personally for any amount I can afford if he can name maybe 7 of the 11 positions. If he knows ice hockey he stands a good chance at guessing the right answers.

Dollar signs True Blue ..... since the advent of the Premier League it is just one massive gravy train .

Arsenal have the name ; all the other really big clubs , the two Mancs , Chelsea and Liverpool have been swallowed .
Kroenke just has to bide his time knowing Usminov wants to get his mitts on Arsenal , same for Nigeria's richest dude , no doubt there are a few filthy rich Arabs ready to offer well over what he paid for it .

....and to add. I'm not saying he doesn't get some pleasure in seeing us win the cup. Every man has his pride. However, its not his motivation. My guess is he was convinced by Gazidis and others that the league has changed and has gotten very competitive and costly and that for us to maintain CL and not slide down farther we need to spend a bit more and change the team. I think he was told by doing so, the fans and perhaps new fans will put more money into tickets and merchandising and increase our brand for overseas tours, etc.

Basically, financial reasons, not sporting reasons.

ahh yes definitely Gaz ..... there's nothing to compare with being in a brand new environment and something cr*ps out that you have no idea how to fix it.

Sweat pouring from the forehead , chewed fingernails , mountains of stress , breaking out in a rash ....... wonderful

Was working as an engineer on a cruise boat on South Molle Island years back .. we went out to the Barrier Reef on a five day fishing trip ... fridges full of coral trout , sweet lip , red emperor , third day in we suddenly lose power , the 240 volt three phase alternator is not charging and everything is starting to defrost .

What the f&&^%$ ... I'm no electrician but I thought there's a phase out here ...wandered around the engine room with a torch fiddling with this and that to no avail ....

Oh well we'll have to head for Mackay and drop them off .

How happy will they be ...... 30 blokes [ they were from Townsville as it happened ] once the word gets around we wont get another booking , and the bogus engineer will be sitting on the wharf at Shute Harbour .

Finally after a couple of hours I took the cover off this little box and here's a bunch of melted wires .... got a knife stripped them back found some colours ........ found some wire to bridge the gap , tied them together .... cranked her up......Voila .....Halleluhah .

If you meant "How any of you can compare" Sanchez "to Wenger is beyond me, it's unbelievable", I'm not aware that anyone has suggested the feelings of Sanchez to the club are comparable to Wenger's. If they did, I missed it. I'm sure Wenger has a great deal more affinity with Arsenal than Sanchez. By a big distance.

However, I would also argue that Wenger has had very good reasons to stay at Arsenal so long, even to the point of turning down Real Madrid. Firstly, the targets given to him at Arsenal (if any have) are, I reckon, far easier to meet than what would be expected of him at Real. Their managers tend to last the proverbial five minutes if they don't win the Champions League or La Liga. Wenger knows the level of job security he has at Arsenal probably wouldn't be repeated anywhere else that's a very big club. Secondly, Wenger may have been able to earn a higher rate of pay elsewhere, but surely he has been one of the highest paid managers in world football at Arsenal so the fairly marginal difference may not be that important a factor. Thirdly, Wenger has such enormous power at Arsenal, even to the point where organisational restructuring apparently planned and favoured by board members including the chief executive and chairman don't come to pass. Wenger's control at the club might even satisfy someone with severe megalomania.

In short, I think Wenger would have been barmy to leave Arsenal and I'm unwilling to dismiss the possibility out of hand that he himself didn't realise that. I thus believe his 'loyalty' to Arsenal, with you calling him a 'true gooner', should be defined with that perspective in mind.

If it doesn't kill you it will make you stronger

Some reports surfacing that Mourinho has also been accused of tax fraud in Spain. The only thing we need to do is ask the Spanish authorities if they need a hand to prove this case. Maybe someone can start a crowd funding site to help out the Spanish authorities.

Here you are. I think the clue to all of this further anti-Wenger nonsense is in Bernard's use of the word 'apparently' when describing Arsene's re-signing. Rather than speaking like oracles why don't you guys just stop the pretence of inside knowledge and admit you know nothing of the reasons for the timing of his signing, or anything else about the motivation of players and the internal workings of the club? Like children, you make it up.

As for Sanchez, Ox and Özil - great if they stay and are committed to the club. If they are not then thanks and goodbye. We don't need half-hearts or moaners around the place. Accentuate the positive, eliminate the negative, and don't mess with Mr. In-between.

My use of the word 'apparently' is a safeguard against stating something as a firm fact, when it is strong rumour from various sources. What do you think were the reasons for his delay in signing then (the delay was a fact)? After all, quite a few times you yourself asked here what a new director of football would do, so you presumably saw something in the strong rumours Gazidis and others wanted one.

Whatever the reasons for Wenger's "delay" in signing a contract, they have bugger all to do with Alexis, Özil and Ox and their current contract negotiations. The notion that any of them would run down their contract to the last few weeks because that is what Wenger did is absurd.

Players' contracts are influenced by the transfer market. There is no transfer market for managers. Alexis and Özil have been offered very lucrative contracts. If they don't sign, it is on them. I'd reckon Ox has been offered something good too. With the nature of the transfer market, the club can only do so much. It ultimately comes down to the players and their agents.

I apologise if I gave the impression I did, but I didn't mean to say the players were running down their contracts because of what Wenger did. Without checking myself, did Gaz then? My main memory of his post was that he suggested Top Gun moaning that the players were, or Sanchez and Özil at least, might have been over the top after Wenger did exactly the same thing. Namely, why moan about the players doing so when Wenger himself set exactly the same example. He didn't say 'setting an example' as far as I recall (perhaps I should have read his post before replying to you). But I used that everyday expression in a way that doesn't mean the players are doing what they're doing because of what Wenger did. Simply that Top Gun might have been going over the top about the players because it's common to want assurances before signing a contract. I would agree with Gaz, if that's what he meant. That's why I haven't moaned about them not renewing their contract. As you implied yourself (I believe), it's what happens in life.

I think you should maybe start the crowd funding site in Ireland 'cos that's where the image rights end up.

I haven't a clue why he signed when he did, but I would assume it had something to do with focusing on the job in hand for the final dozen or so games rather than letting the media and minority fan frenzy dictate events. As manager I wanted him to concentrate on the task of winning the FA Cup and finishing as high in the league as possible. Everything else could wait.

But didn't he himself admit the distraction over his contract harmed the team?

In a half hearted look around cyberspace, this is what I've discovered. Apparently we are waiting to see what Alexis and Özil are doing before we make any major moves in the transfer market. I've also discovered that Alexis and Özil are waiting to see who we bring in before they decide whether to sign the new deals.
Sounds like there's going to be plenty of waiting.

Wasn't it other people (media, anti-Wenger supporters) making his contract a distraction? I can't recall him or the club making it a big issue. Between them they surely knew all along he would sign a new one. It must have been what the club and he wanted, otherwise he would be gone. The media and the anti brigade whipped up a storm in a tea cup.

If that was the case, wouldn't it have been quietly signed ages ago? Then it wouldn't have damaged the team so much, which Wenger has admitted it did. Perhaps the likelihood is stronger than you think that there was a boardroom split, and some directors wanted a change in management structure. Wenger, and I'll use the word again, it would appear didn't want one, and delayed signing it until he had assurances from Kroenke senior that there would be no restructuring.

You and a number of others have some difficulty understanding that all they need to do is see out their contract. It is a 'çontract' - that is an agreement of minds at the time it was entered into. Because the club might want to ask them to enter a new contract does not mean they have to sign it. They are not holding anyone to ransome. They can take less pay for another year and then chose who employs them. This is a basic human right.

The uncomfortable fact is that then the club gets nothing for them. So it is the club who has the problem and want to make money out of them by selling before their contract ends..

Will the Ox, Özil or Sanchez put in less effort if they do not extend. It is WC year - they will all give 100% to ensure they get to go to the WC. I back all of them to put in a greater work effort than Theo has ever done or some of the other passengers we have at the club.

The stupid b'stared played on an injured ankle and cracked himself badly

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/footba ... ankle.html