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Post #516961  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 7:16 am 
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socrates wrote:
I bit like the Torreira deal, it stinks. Not even a loan fee for Guendouzi. Unless of course we are making space for incoming upgrades which now seems highly unlikely given the few hours we have left in the window.

Torreira may not have been a automatic starter but he would have played lots of minutes, started lots of games and it would not be unthinkable that he could have ended up as a starter. He certainly has enough talent to be a starter given the midfield options we currently have.

Has the Torreira loan been confirmed?


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Post #516962  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 7:20 am 
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Bernard wrote:
socrates wrote:
I bit like the Torreira deal, it stinks. Not even a loan fee for Guendouzi. Unless of course we are making space for incoming upgrades which now seems highly unlikely given the few hours we have left in the window.

Torreira may not have been a automatic starter but he would have played lots of minutes, started lots of games and it would not be unthinkable that he could have ended up as a starter. He certainly has enough talent to be a starter given the midfield options we currently have.

Has the Torreira loan been confirmed?


Not sure, Bernard. Last I saw Athetico were waiting for a sale to fo through before buying.

All very messy.


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Post #516963  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 7:27 am 
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The Martial sending off is just ridiculous. Lamela does exactly the same thing to provoke the reaction, if not a little worse, which is clearly visible to VAR. Surely either both go or they both get a yellow.

In my view a sending off should be a last resort because it spoils so many games and ruins the spectacle for the watching public, unless you support the team the 10 men are playing against.

Martials arm was more handbags than violent conduct, ditto Lamela's initial provocation. A yellow each would have sufficed.


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Post #516964  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 7:45 am 
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What's weird about the situation with Martial and Lamela is that Lamela got a yellow card, so it's not like the ref completely missed it. Just a terrible decision all around, but Martial will be suspended against us so I'm fine with it.


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Post #516965  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:27 am 
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socrates wrote:
The Martial sending off is just ridiculous. Lamela does exactly the same thing to provoke the reaction, if not a little worse, which is clearly visible to VAR. Surely either both go or they both get a yellow.

In my view a sending off should be a last resort because it spoils so many games and ruins the spectacle for the watching public, unless you support the team the 10 men are playing against.

Martials arm was more handbags than violent conduct, ditto Lamela's initial provocation. A yellow each would have sufficed.

I always believed retaliation was punished more harshly than the original offence.

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Post #516966  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:44 am 
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Apparently Arsenal have made Gunnersaurus redundant as part of their cost-cutting measures.

I get the bit where there are no fans in the stadium at the moment but I can't imagine he is especially highly paid and surely he has become part of the fabric of the club for junior supporters. Couldn't they have used him in promotional videos and that sort of thing.

Others may disagree but this club is fast losing its identity.


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Post #516967  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 8:47 am 
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Gunnersaurus is gone. Obviously wage bills are too high and this will allow us to bid for Messi in the next transfer window.

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Post #516968  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 10:31 am 
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socrates wrote:
Apparently Arsenal have made Gunnersaurus redundant as part of their cost-cutting measures.

I get the bit where there are no fans in the stadium at the moment but I can't imagine he is especially highly paid and surely he has become part of the fabric of the club for junior supporters. Couldn't they have used him in promotional videos and that sort of thing.

Others may disagree but this club is fast losing its identity.

Wonder how many Premier League clubs don’t have a mascot. Mind you, I always thought mascots should have some sort of link to the club’s history be it the crest, stadium, location, nickname or whatever. Like Stamford the Lion at Chelsea, Filbert Fox at Leicester, Monty Magpie at Newcastle, Gully (a seagull) at Brighton, Wolfie the Wolf at Wolverhampton and Chirpy the Cockerel (or Chicken) at Tottenham.

I never saw what a dinosaur had to do with Arsenal. Suppose we’ve had a few managers or directors who were dinosaurs.


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Post #516969  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 10:32 am 
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socrates wrote:
The Martial sending off is just ridiculous. Lamela does exactly the same thing to provoke the reaction, if not a little worse, which is clearly visible to VAR. Surely either both go or they both get a yellow.

In my view a sending off should be a last resort because it spoils so many games and ruins the spectacle for the watching public, unless you support the team the 10 men are playing against.

Martials arm was more handbags than violent conduct, ditto Lamela's initial provocation. A yellow each would have sufficed.

Yes it was case of letter of the law rather than common sense prevailing. Lamela should be lambasted for his woeful overreaction to a feather tickle.

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Post #516970  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 10:36 am 
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socrates wrote:
Apparently Arsenal have made Gunnersaurus redundant as part of their cost-cutting measures.

I get the bit where there are no fans in the stadium at the moment but I can't imagine he is especially highly paid and surely he has become part of the fabric of the club for junior supporters. Couldn't they have used him in promotional videos and that sort of thing.

Others may disagree but this club is fast losing its identity.


Don’t be ridiculous :42laughter:

It’s a cuddly dinosaur. I suppose there is going to be a player revolt now eh?

Surely it’s a 2 day a week job at its busiest ? I’ll go out on a limb here and suggest it might be a part time job rather than a 70 hour week

I understand there may not be a ton of transferable skills involved. His green cuddly suit might prevent him from getting work in the bar trade. He could try and do the knowledge I suppose but his huge green head would have to go out the drivers window.


This is some Owen Jones type stuff surely :laughing7:


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Post #516971  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:08 am 
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Rich wrote:
With the way we play I can’t see us sweeping too many teams off the park, but I also can’t see many thrashings. Arteta has us much more organised and harder to score goals against, the downside is it makes us pretty dreary going forward with a real lack of shots.
Playing Aubameyang centrally and having genuine wide players helped yesterday



I thought the biggest impact was having Willian play centrally. He managed to get between their defensive lines and took every opportunity to run into space or at the backtracking defense. Made all the difference to our attack.


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Post #516972  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:11 am 
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TOP GUN wrote:
socrates wrote:
Apparently Arsenal have made Gunnersaurus redundant as part of their cost-cutting measures.

I get the bit where there are no fans in the stadium at the moment but I can't imagine he is especially highly paid and surely he has become part of the fabric of the club for junior supporters. Couldn't they have used him in promotional videos and that sort of thing.

Others may disagree but this club is fast losing its identity.


Don’t be ridiculous :42laughter:

It’s a cuddly dinosaur. I suppose there is going to be a player revolt now eh?

Surely it’s a 2 day a week job at its busiest ? I’ll go out on a limb here and suggest it might be a part time job rather than a 70 hour week

I understand there may not be a ton of transferable skills involved. His green cuddly suit might prevent him from getting work in the bar trade. He could try and do the knowledge I suppose but his huge green head would have to go out the drivers window.


This is some Owen Jones type stuff surely :laughing7:


But that's the whole point TG, its pin money to Kroenke. I would guess that the amount saved is so inconsequential that the negative publicity it generates far outweighs any financial gain.

It's madness, especially when fans are already up in arms at the lack of transfer activity.

Why do it?


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Post #516973  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:14 am 
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socrates wrote:
The Martial sending off is just ridiculous. Lamela does exactly the same thing to provoke the reaction, if not a little worse, which is clearly visible to VAR. Surely either both go or they both get a yellow.

In my view a sending off should be a last resort because it spoils so many games and ruins the spectacle for the watching public, unless you support the team the 10 men are playing against.

Martials arm was more handbags than violent conduct, ditto Lamela's initial provocation. A yellow each would have sufficed.


I say it's about time Man Utd were on the receiving end of a *%^@ decision. Martial cheated to get a penalty so deserves to get something go the other way.


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Post #516974  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:16 am 
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grantyboy wrote:
Rich wrote:
With the way we play I can’t see us sweeping too many teams off the park, but I also can’t see many thrashings. Arteta has us much more organised and harder to score goals against, the downside is it makes us pretty dreary going forward with a real lack of shots.
Playing Aubameyang centrally and having genuine wide players helped yesterday



I thought the biggest impact was having Willian play centrally. He managed to get between their defensive lines and took every opportunity to run into space or at the backtracking defense. Made all the difference to our attack.

I really don't see why we can't play him there at least against midtable sides and lower, with Ceballos and Xhaka behind him, Pépé and Saka on the wings and Aubameyang as the central striker. We'd score five goals per game, in my mind at least.


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Post #516975  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:27 am 
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socrates wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:

Don’t be ridiculous :42laughter:

It’s a cuddly dinosaur. I suppose there is going to be a player revolt now eh?

Surely it’s a 2 day a week job at its busiest ? I’ll go out on a limb here and suggest it might be a part time job rather than a 70 hour week

I understand there may not be a ton of transferable skills involved. His green cuddly suit might prevent him from getting work in the bar trade. He could try and do the knowledge I suppose but his huge green head would have to go out the drivers window.


This is some Owen Jones type stuff surely :laughing7:


But that's the whole point TG, its pin money to Kroenke. I would guess that the amount saved is so inconsequential that the negative publicity it generates far outweighs any financial gain.

It's madness, especially when fans are already up in arms at the lack of transfer activity.

Why do it?


Because the football club lost 100 million quid off its bottom line and the moment the stadium opens the guy has got his job back again anyway


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Post #516976  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:53 am 
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TOP GUN wrote:
socrates wrote:

But that's the whole point TG, its pin money to Kroenke. I would guess that the amount saved is so inconsequential that the negative publicity it generates far outweighs any financial gain.

It's madness, especially when fans are already up in arms at the lack of transfer activity.

Why do it?


Because the football club lost 100 million quid off its bottom line and the moment the stadium opens the guy has got his job back again anyway


The way its going Gunnersaurus and Arteta might as well get their boots on.


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Post #516977  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:55 am 
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Charles Watts now saying we've made a move for Partey. Not the most reliable source, but not the worst either.


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Post #516978  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:55 am 
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TOP GUN wrote:
socrates wrote:

But that's the whole point TG, its pin money to Kroenke. I would guess that the amount saved is so inconsequential that the negative publicity it generates far outweighs any financial gain.

It's madness, especially when fans are already up in arms at the lack of transfer activity.

Why do it?


Because the football club lost 100 million quid off its bottom line and the moment the stadium opens the guy has got his job back again anyway


So they've created unneccessary negative publicity for the sake of saving a few months of Gunnersaurus's salary whilst Kroenke presides over a new billion pound stadium in the states.

I don't get it. Not the way I would run Arsenal that's for sure.


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Post #516979  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 11:57 am 
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Hazuki wrote:
Charles Watts now saying we've made a move for Partey. Not the most reliable source, but not the worst either.


Interesting, but realistically can we get such an expensive deal done in a day, unless the groundwork has already been laid.


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Post #516980  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:00 pm 
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socrates wrote:
Hazuki wrote:
Charles Watts now saying we've made a move for Partey. Not the most reliable source, but not the worst either.


Interesting, but realistically can we get such an expensive deal done in a day, unless the groundwork has already been laid.

I would assume most of the groundwork has been done already and they're just waiting for us to trigger the release clause. Most sources have reported that personal terms isn't an issue.


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Post #516981  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:03 pm 
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socrates wrote:
So they've created unneccessary negative publicity for the sake of saving a few months of Gunnersaurus's salary whilst Kroenke presides over a new billion pound stadium in the states.

I don't get it. Not the way I would run Arsenal that's for sure.

Not sure what exact wages Gunnersauru's was one, but it seems we can now afford Partey. Just saying.


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Post #516982  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:20 pm 
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grantyboy wrote:
Rich wrote:
With the way we play I can’t see us sweeping too many teams off the park, but I also can’t see many thrashings. Arteta has us much more organised and harder to score goals against, the downside is it makes us pretty dreary going forward with a real lack of shots.
Playing Aubameyang centrally and having genuine wide players helped yesterday



I thought the biggest impact was having Willian play centrally. He managed to get between their defensive lines and took every opportunity to run into space or at the backtracking defense. Made all the difference to our attack.

Yes good point, Willian with his quick acceleration and very good close control, skill and technique could thrive I nov that role for us. Decent workrate so won’t be a passenger without the ball.


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Post #516983  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:33 pm 
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Hazuki wrote:
Charles Watts now saying we've made a move for Partey. Not the most reliable source, but not the worst either.

Feels like a classic Arsenal window, scramble to get a deal over the line on the last day and the fans are so happy that we’ve done ANY deal at all we forget that there are still big gaps in the squad


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Post #516984  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:40 pm 
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Transfer was done in advance to let him play a final game.

Welcome Thomas Partey


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Post #516985  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:40 pm 
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Hazuki wrote:
socrates wrote:
So they've created unneccessary negative publicity for the sake of saving a few months of Gunnersaurus's salary whilst Kroenke presides over a new billion pound stadium in the states.

I don't get it. Not the way I would run Arsenal that's for sure.

Not sure what exact wages Gunnersauru's was one, but it seems we can now afford Partey. Just saying.


Yes, it is an interesting turn of events. I suspect you are right, its no coincidence. :laughing7:

Do you think the dinosaur outfit will fit Thomas Partey though?


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Post #516986  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:46 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Hazuki wrote:
Charles Watts now saying we've made a move for Partey. Not the most reliable source, but not the worst either.

Feels like a classic Arsenal window, scramble to get a deal over the line on the last day and the fans are so happy that we’ve done ANY deal at all we forget that there are still big gaps in the squad

Yes, but to be fair I don't think anyone was expecting more than Parety and Aouar. So if (IF) we sign Partey it's still one out of our two main targets. No idea why we'd be leaving it this late if rumours are true. Then again, no idea about the way we do business at all most of the time.


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Post #516987  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:49 pm 
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Spanish journalist Antonio Ruiz of Cadena Cope (who to my knowledge is as good as Spanish sources come) saying Arsenal have communicated to La Liga the intention of paying Partey's release clause.


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Post #516988  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:51 pm 
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Hazuki wrote:
Charles Watts now saying we've made a move for Partey. Not the most reliable source, but not the worst either.

Decent drummer though and you can't always get what you want

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Post #516989  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:53 pm 
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Hazuki wrote:
Spanish journalist Antonio Ruiz of Cadena Cope (who to my knowledge is as good as Spanish sources come) saying Arsenal have communicated to La Liga the intention of paying Partey's release clause.


Would it be cynical to suggest that we have left it just late enough that the paperwork and legalities cannot be sorted out in time and they can then say "we tried".
:laughing7:


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Post #516990  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:54 pm 
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socrates wrote:
Hazuki wrote:
Spanish journalist Antonio Ruiz of Cadena Cope (who to my knowledge is as good as Spanish sources come) saying Arsenal have communicated to La Liga the intention of paying Partey's release clause.


Would it be cynical to suggest that we have left it just late enough that the paperwork and legalities cannot be sorted out in time and they can then say "we tried".
:laughing7:

We've been waiting for the go-ahead from Kroenke who has spent the last two weeks looking for spare change behind his many couches.


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Post #516991  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 12:54 pm 
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dec wrote:
Hazuki wrote:
Charles Watts now saying we've made a move for Partey. Not the most reliable source, but not the worst either.

Decent drummer though and you can't always get what you want


Yes, Charlie Watts claims we've triggered the release but Mick Jagger says its not true.


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Post #516992  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 1:00 pm 
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Ornstein now saying the same thing as Charles Watts and others. This one might actually be happening.


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Post #516993  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 1:03 pm 
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Rich wrote:
Hazuki wrote:
Charles Watts now saying we've made a move for Partey. Not the most reliable source, but not the worst either.

Feels like a classic Arsenal window, scramble to get a deal over the line on the last day and the fans are so happy that we’ve done ANY deal at all we forget that there are still big gaps in the squad


That’s slightly unfair.

They are 100 million in revenue down and clearly are trying to stretch a budget. If we sold players maybe we could have signed both targets and of course it makes sense to negotiate as much as possible if you are in the red.


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Post #516994  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 1:09 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
That’s slightly unfair.

They are 100 million in revenue down and clearly are trying to stretch a budget. If we sold players maybe we could have signed both targets and of course it makes sense to negotiate as much as possible if you are in the red.

One thing that makes a little bit of sense with leaving Partey so late is that he has a release clause. As long as we know he wants to join, all we have to do is trigger the clause, no negotiations needed. So it makes sense to try more difficult transfers first, if we knew we had the money to pay Partey's release clause.


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Post #516995  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 1:25 pm 
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Hazuki wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
That’s slightly unfair.

They are 100 million in revenue down and clearly are trying to stretch a budget. If we sold players maybe we could have signed both targets and of course it makes sense to negotiate as much as possible if you are in the red.

One thing that makes a little bit of sense with leaving Partey so late is that he has a release clause. As long as we know he wants to join, all we have to do is trigger the clause, no negotiations needed. So it makes sense to try more difficult transfers first, if we knew we had the money to pay Partey's release clause.

Of course. Spot on.

I do wonder if football fans have ever gone through the purchase of a house or property and the negotiation involved.

Go in high to start off with and leave nothing to chance !!!,,,


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Post #516996  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 1:32 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Hazuki wrote:
One thing that makes a little bit of sense with leaving Partey so late is that he has a release clause. As long as we know he wants to join, all we have to do is trigger the clause, no negotiations needed. So it makes sense to try more difficult transfers first, if we knew we had the money to pay Partey's release clause.

Of course. Spot on.

Well, it could also be the other way around; Aouar was our top target and since we couldn't afford both him and Partey we waited until the Aouar deal was off because that's when we knew we had money to trigger the clause...


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Post #516997  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 1:34 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Rich wrote:
Feels like a classic Arsenal window, scramble to get a deal over the line on the last day and the fans are so happy that we’ve done ANY deal at all we forget that there are still big gaps in the squad


That’s slightly unfair.

They are 100 million in revenue down and clearly are trying to stretch a budget. If we sold players maybe we could have signed both targets and of course it makes sense to negotiate as much as possible if you are in the red.

Fair comment. I think the frustration is the amount of waste of space players we have who are more happy to not play the game they love as long as they get their wages than accept a slight reduction and actually play football.
I do wonder about the Cédric and Marí deals, we made both permanent this summer at a cost of £7m plus two players wages (which could be £3-4m a season each)
Only getting Guendouzi and Torreira our on loan is frustrating. I cannot wait until we can finally wipe clean so much if the dross in this squad and start to reinvest those wages in to proper players. The squads building over the last 5 years has been absolutely terrible


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Post #516998  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 1:36 pm 
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Hazuki wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
Of course. Spot on.

Well, it could also be the other way around; Aouar was our top target and since we couldn't afford both him and Partey we waited until the Aouar deal was off because that's when we knew we had money to trigger the clause...


Possibly, ie we only had 45 million to spend. Try and get Aour realise they won’t accept less than 60 million so sack the dinosaur and sign Partey instead.


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Post #516999  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 1:46 pm 
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Rich wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:

That’s slightly unfair.

They are 100 million in revenue down and clearly are trying to stretch a budget. If we sold players maybe we could have signed both targets and of course it makes sense to negotiate as much as possible if you are in the red.

Fair comment. I think the frustration is the amount of waste of space players we have who are more happy to not play the game they love as long as they get their wages than accept a slight reduction and actually play football.
I do wonder about the Cédric and Marí deals, we made both permanent this summer at a cost of £7m plus two players wages (which could be £3-4m a season each)
Only getting Guendouzi and Torreira our on loan is frustrating. I cannot wait until we can finally wipe clean so much if the dross in this squad and start to reinvest those wages in to proper players. The squads building over the last 5 years has been absolutely terrible


I think what Arteta has done with the team is nothing short of staggering. I was at the Emirates last season when city smashed us to pieces in 10 minutes and our players gave up and it felt like the end. Now it feels like we have a future and direction.

Fans will need to get behind him because Partey alone won’t fix our problems and it will take more time. Until he gets more creativity in and around the box we won’t make a push for the title. We need a De bruyne type. He’s done remarkably well and the way he’s determined which group of players can contribute and which can’t seems quite similar to when George took over and ditched the older heads for people who would graft for him. He’s still stifled by the decisions of the previous regimes but really I think we have a manger there who could return us to our previous glories if our fans back him.


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Post #517000  Posted: Mon Oct 05, 2020 2:16 pm 
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Hazuki wrote:
Charles Watts now saying we've made a move for Partey. Not the most reliable source, but not the worst either.
He is a good drummer...

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