https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/arti ... 4kg2gq0lyo

INEOS showing they are clueless.

Well the MLS one v Wolves clearly wasn't as it was over turned.
No problem with the Merino red.
All of the rest you can absolutely defend as red cards if you look at them purely in isolation with the strictest application of the law. But we've seen this season how identical offenses are not punished so each of them was out of line with the way these incidents have been refereed.

You could reverse hundreds of decisions every season and defend them in absolute law, but that isn't the argument, its about consistently being the outlier.

If a substitute runs on the pitch to celebrate a goal with his team mates under the laws of the game he should be yellow carded, just stepping foot on the pitch means he's yellow carded, but it never happens. So if you were booked for it you could defend it in law but it would seem mighty unfair because no one else is punished for it. That is the crux of the argument around Arsenal's red cards this season

I find it strange when people hang so much weight on European Cups won before the tournament became the Champions League and infinitely harder to win.

When Forest won in 1980 they beat Oster, Arges Pitesti, BFC Dynamo, Ajax, Hamburg. 32 teams entered the first round proper each the champions of their own league. The genuine best 32 teams in Europe now are probably made up from 6-7 leagues at best rather than 32 separate European leagues

Villa's win in 1982 - Valur, BFC Dynamo, Dynamo Kyiv, Anderlecht, Bayern Munich

Could be missing a lot of players v Newcastle. Our first 4 choices of central striker are likely to all be missing - Havertz, Jesus, Merino, Trossard. Also out will be Gabriel, Tomiyasu and likely out are Rice, Jorginho, Timber

Could be
Raya
White, Saliba, Kiwior, Calafiori
Ødegaard, Partey, MLS/Zinchenko
Saka, Martinelli, Nwaneri/Tierney.....Sterling!

Potentially 5 academy players on the bench. There seems to be some prem rule which is stopping Max Dowman playing a prem macth at 15 but Leicester fielded a 15 year old Jeremy Monga in their last match

Guessing Monga is a few months older than Dowman so was 15 when the season started which is the rule I think. Dowman has a December birthday so turned 15 after the season started.

Nwaneri was 15 when he played wasn't he?

I think it's something to do with their actual date of birth. Nwaneri's is 21st March but Dowman's is 31st December - not sure of the rules. Sounds like you have to be 15 at the start of the season, so Max will have a few months at the start of next season to make his debut.

incidentally, Dowman has just been selected for the England U17s for this month's Euros in Albania, along with GK Jack Porter. Dowman's also due to tour with us this summer. Busy lad.

....sorry Ash - missed this.

I’d be happy with both if them.

One of my son's best mates plays for the Arsenal U16s and has played with Nwaneri and Dowman. Says Dowman is generational and beyond anyone he's ever played with.

It isn't infinitely harder to win these days because it's far far easier to qualify. Spurs got to the final a few years ago. They haven't won their domestic league in 60+ years. Arsenal would have had one shot at it in the last 20 years if the old rules applied.

Also, there were lots of good teams from outside the big 4 leagues because only a handful of players played outside their home countries (England being the exception in the sense that you had loads of Scots, Irish and Welsh).

Forest won the league followed by back to back European cups. A phenomenal achievement.

Dec I’m reminded of your Inter post the other day…excellent players,has-been’s,workhorses…..

They were terrific….Shilton and Francis probably in the excellent category maybe John Robertson….the rest…McGovern Bowyer Burns …workhorses….Birtles and Woodcock weren’t half bad

Phenomenal achievement is right …back to back European Cups at a time when Liverpool were an almighty force

But the point being that 1) you only played 5 ties to win it, now you have the jeopardy of an 8 game group stage, where some big teams failed, then another 7 or 9 games after that.
2) in the old format you really only encountered 2 max 3 good teams, now you’re playing far more and the teams are of better quality.
If back in the day you put the best 32 teams in the European cup it certainly wouldn’t have contained the champions of at least half the European nations. The competition would have been bulked out by genuine heavyweights of the bigger upper nations who finished 2nd, 3rd etc. the current champions league is far more representative of the best of the best so your chances of winning decrease.
You can beat a good team in a one off tie, but to beat 3 or 4 of them in a row you have to be very good. Teams back in the 70’s and 80’s just didn’t have to do that.
Look at 99 when Man U won it, a group with Bayern and Barcelona, then knock out games against Inter, Juventus, Bayern
Madrid in 22, inter in the group then PSG, Chelsea, City, Liverpool in the knock outs. In the old format they wouldn’t have had to play inter Milan, Chelsea or Liverpool and instead would have faced the champions of Austria, Switzerland and Denmark etc. only 8 different nations were represented in the last 16 of the 2022 champions league, I’d wager every version of the CL has been similar…..it was 8 from 16 this year as well. So the old format diluted the competition by half compared to the knock outs stages today.

https://x.com/nffc/status/1922308419215 ... -j6VVZXEoA

Forest statement on the owner being on the pitch and the criticism he and they have had from high profile pundits. Now I don’t really buy that the Forest owner’s ONLY thought at the time he entered the pitch was the welfare of the injured player, much more likely he was frustrated at the dropped points late on and the subs being bodged because they didn’t assess the injury situation properly….and now that it turns out the player was quite badly injured they can dress up the club statement this way…..but I do like that they take aim at high profile pundits and their need to create drama and social media clicks rather than gather the facts and give a balanced and informed view

Let’s be honest it’s not the pundits in this case.

Owner is a complete and utter d*******, it clearly wasn’t about “player welfare” and it’s the least surprising thing of all time that they have tried to do a PR effort pointing about something else when the owner has made himself look like such a complete lemon.

The booing of TAA is quite embarrassing for Liverpool, what a group of idiot fans

Players have such risky short careers. He's respected his contract and been a model professional.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/ar ... ywde8d0gwo

What entitled selfish deluded twits some of these fans are

I don't deny we have many similar fans, more of a sign of the times innit

That said Neville and Carragher have become so utterly tiresome on sky. Nonsense banter dressed up as entertainment. They and sky seem intent on developing them as some kind of Bert and Ernie characters constantly arguing. The analysis on what’s happening on the pitch seems little and they are jumping into rage bait. Crap presenters like Kelly Cates only employed because she’s Kenny Dalglishs daughter and now she’s moving to host match of the day. I never thought I’d end up missing Lynam, Hansen and Jimmy Hill.

It’s such immature broadcasting

For what it’s worth I think Amazon do quite a decent job. I think shearer is a reasonable co commentator and the punditry of people like Walcott and Seedorf at least seems ok with them making intelligent observations.

Sky can get in the *%^@*** bin.

Not sure our fans would be doing likewise if the player was going abroad.

The comparison that sticks in my head is when Edu went on a free to Valencia and was roundly applauded and even allowed to take a penalty in his last home game.

Obviously van persie got dogs abuse but that was different.

https://x.com/gravitygunner14/status/19 ... -j6VVZXEoA

Just realised on this tweet that Ødegaard’s late shot at Anfield had Zinchenko sprinting in to space on his left, looked like an easy pass to put Zinchenko in 1v1

Completely agree, but anybody in a high profile taking shots at these well known pundits is always a good thing for me. They should be called out more

Now those boys were good. Lynam particularly was an excellent presenter.

Chelsea have something of a dilemma this summer

Raheem Sterlings contract doesn’t run out until Jun 30, 2027 and he’s on £325,000 a week

19 million over the next 2 seasons. Football is nuts

Not sure we have helped putting him in the shop window

That’s virtually trolling.

Help me out here TG …325k✖️52✖️2=34 odd million
Is my maths off?
Anyhow I agree …modern footballers contracts pay an ungodly amount of dosh…….effectively a million quid every 3 weeks …what’s Haalands…a million every 10 days….ffs

Multiplication sign awol !

The Jadon Sancho situation is bonkers as well. Chelsea have an obligation to buy him for £25m….or they can pay Man U £5m for the privilege of sending him back.
These teams have players on huge wages who aren’t going anywhere and they can’t sell. We’ve been there and cut ties and paid off contracts so we could start to move forward.

Look again at Chelsea’s business last year £250m spent and the only player anywhere near making the odd start for them is Neto who has been frankly well below average

Lots of transfer links coming out today for all teams.

Kerkez and Frimpong to Liverpool. Two good signings for not huge money but Frimpong in a back 4….if you thought Trent couldn’t defend very well….

Huijsen is Madrid’s first choice - good if it keeps them away from Saliba

Man City want Wirtz and Reijnders from Milan. Two top players who would cost the thick end of £170m for the pair!

Were linked with Rodrygo from Madrid. They always manage to alienate very good players who they don’t value as much as their galacticos.

Sesko v Gyökeres. It feels like we’ll grey one of them.
I’d say Gyökeres is currently the better player, but Sesko has the higher potential. If you believe what you read Arteta likes Sesko and Berta likes Gyökeres.
After waiting so long for a proper striker I’d be happy with either as I find it difficult to split them and change my mind all the time.

It was more difficult to qualify for the European Cup. You had to win your domestic league. No coming 4th and getting in, no to mention the farcical situation we have this year where Spurs could finish just above the relegation zone and qualify for the CL.
For years now the group stages of the CL have lacked jeopardy because the gap between the rich clubs and the others is far too wide. This year with the new league format, PSG lost 3 out of 8 games yet still got through to the knock-out phase and are now in the final.

You are also in danger of under-valuing teams of the past due to their current standing in the game. Anderlecht, Kiev, Feyenoord. These are miles off the level now but were serious teams back then. By.contrast, you mention Chelsea above as a big opponent for Madrid. Chelsea were a nothing club in the 70s and 80s.

Most of all though, you seem to be arguing that modern day winners of the CL are more worthy of praise or have achieved something greater than previous European Cup winners. That is just not the case.

I was only a kid getting into football at the time, but to come from the old second division to do what they did was brilliant. More so, Cloughie had a hardwired philosophy of playing passing football at a time when long ball shite was gaining traction especially among lesser clubs.

Arteta will extend his loan for another season

Plus they paid 52 million for Joao felix and loaned him within 6 months. Business geniuses

I think kerkez would be a good signing for Liverpool or ourselves. Seems very good on the ball and more than just your typical “inverted” fullback.

Like I said the other day the interesting part of our transfer window will be aside from the 115 million or so we will spend on a new striker and zubimendi what other reinforcements come in.

Leeds, Burnley and one of Sheff Utd or Sunderland in the prem next season. All a bit boring really. I like Leeds being back up, I live there so know a lot of Leeds fans and I always think of them as a genuinely big club and they'll bring some interest and rivalries, but the rest - meh.

Fully expect Leicester and Southampton to be clear favourites to get promoted back to the prem next season.

Maybe its recency bias because we've had decent championship additions who have stayed up and thrived but it feels like there is a pool of about 25 teams who will consistently play in the prem now - maybe the odd outlier like a Luton coming up, but generally a group of 5-6 yoyo teams now

Prem getting a lot more Northern next year!

The parachute payments made a big difference. I think you are right. Apart from an outlier like Luton it now looks like the same pool of 24/25 clubs and chances are that pool will reduce as the financial gaps widen.

Always a soft spot for Coventry for giving me the greatest ever FA Cup final outside of us winning it. I still smile when I think about it.

So I’m thinking

In..

Gyökeres 65
Zubimendi 51
Rodrigo 85
Garcia 30


231

Out

Vieira 30
Zinchenko 20
Nelson 5
Tavares 8

63

Total around 168. Would be a big one but close to the Declan summer.

Oooh yess I’ll take that and with those 4 you go again and would be genuine contenders. Only issues would be less defensive cover but also still no Odegard cover either.

I saw someone post the other day that the signing of Sterling was akin to the KLF burning a million quid. I thought that was a perfect analogy.

Yeah, I thought it a shame they lost last night. Wanted there to be a new name in the PL. Sunderland would just be another team you've sen too many times.

KLF The 90s was wild eh God please take me back. Music, social culture, bachelor dom, raving and obviously the Arsenal winning loads of trophies. God bless you George, thanks Arsene.

In retrospective as bad as Raheem has been (pretty bad) I don’t think his transfer really financially cost us much. We paid Chelsea 100k a week of his 325k and we were paying Nelson that but then offloaded his cost to Fulham. As mental as that is Raheem and his gold plated toilet actually saved us some dosh. Ain’t football great

https://x.com/tooaroy/status/1922639006 ... -j6VVZXEoA

This weird obsession over Palmer and Foden and the national team. At least Palmer hasn’t had loads of opportunities to impress for England - Foden has tanked almost every time and he’s been played where it suits him too.
Saka never enters this conversation but yet he’s the one who is simply picked every time, a shoe in for his position as much as Kane.

Funny that Neville says we must find a way to accommodate Palmer, Foden and Bellingham but doesn’t offer up any solution to his own question that only has a finite set of solutions.

I think Garcia’s release clause is £20m. £12m if Espanyol get relegated which is technically still possibly but very unlikely.

I think we need 6, the 4 positions you list above and another central creative midfielder and a left sided defender.

Add someone like Eze or Simons or Cunha and you have Ødegaard cover, greater creativity, direct dribbling ability and goalscoring threat and each of them could play a floating wide left role to give depth there
Add a proper left back and it allows MLS to play more games in central midfield.

The leaving prices look attainable except for Vieira, I’ll be amazed if we can get more than £15m for him.

If we sign a wide left player we might see one of Trossard or Martinelli leave, and there are questions over Tomiyasu’s future still, injured far too often and is essentially 3rd or 4th choice in 3 positions.