Fixtures Wednesday September 26th - Brentford - Emirates Stadium - Carabao Cup - 7:45 Pm

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Post #493321  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:08 pm 
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tomc wrote:
Pete on the beach wrote:


If I was there and that happened I would turn my back on any presentation, I would hope many others would do likewise .

I’ve said for years that I won’t be able to reflect on Wenger properly until at least 2-3 years from the point of departure and then i’ll See how I feel like

Quite frankly the leave with gratitude angle has long gone with the mess he’s caused and what it’s done to the supporter base ,

I’d prefer he was driven out in humiliation but that probably won’t happen

Brighton should be safe now Pete, the three that are there now look doomed.....



Still a bit of a worry with the fixtures left , the top 4 plus Burnley , hopefully they can get a point or two from the home games


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Post #493322  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:17 pm 
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If he is released after the last match of the season, at a minimum he should get polite applause. Just out of respect. Its his entire career, despite the last number of years. I would disagree Pete, with fans turning their backs.

With regards to us going after certain players, it doesn't matter. Its not players, its the manager. We are at the point where it doesn't matter who we bring in (Aubie, Laca, Özil, etc.) we are still going to lose. If Wenger managed City he'd lose more matches than he should.


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Post #493323  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:18 pm 
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AmericanGooner wrote:
If he is released after the last match of the season, at a minimum he should get polite applause. Just out of respect. Its his entire career, despite the last number of years. I would disagree Pete, with fans turning their backs.

With regards to us going after certain players, it doesn't matter. Its not players, its the manager. We are at the point where it doesn't matter who we bring in (Aubie, Laca, Özil, etc.) we are still going to lose. If Wenger managed City he'd lose more matches than he should.


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Post #493324  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:30 pm 
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Bernard wrote:
Daz wrote:
Mustafi. Not good enough (putting it mildly). Chambers. Not good enough. Koscielny. Past it and injury prone. Bellerin. Probably leaving. Mertesacker. Past it and being a great guy not really enough. Monreal. Good but getting on. Čech. Past it and increasingly error prone.

If you had to rebuild an entire defence I think even Hoy might agree that Arsene Wenger would not really be your go-to manager.

Mertesacker is retiring and is, as you say, past it. But at the moment, however past it he is, I'd still rather have him in the team than Mustafi. I largely agree with what you say about the others. Chambers simply isn't good enough. Koscielny was once, but even when he is fit these days, he's no longer the player he was. He's nearly 33 and sadly needs replacing. Monreal is 32 now and past his best; even when at his best he still wasn't at the level of Sansom or Cole. Hearing rumours the club is looking to move Bellerin on so I think you could be right about him leaving. Čech isn't as bad as Ospina but is another in the 'past it' category.

You didn't mention Kolasinac or Holding. After bright starts to their Arsenal careers (Kolasinac this season and Holding last season), they've both gone seriously downhill. Hence there are solid arguments that we need a brand new defence. However, as you imply, Wenger is the last man you'd select to sort it out.


The additional factor is that a defence that is so weak is also so shapeless, lacking in spirit and energy, and tactically inept. Mustafi's problems are so glaring that I cannot believe they could be improved with better coaching.


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Post #493325  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:38 pm 
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Daz wrote:
From an emotional point of view, Wenger doesn't really matter to me any more. All the anger is gone - I just turn off when he appears on telly and I pay zero attention to anything he says. My only interest in the Europa outcome is whether he leaves if we don't win it - I suspect he might and that is why I don't want us to win it.


I wouldn't worry, we have absolutely no chance of beating Atletico Madrid over two legs.

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Post #493326  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:45 pm 
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tomc wrote:
Win or lose against Athletico, the day after the second leg the club should release a statement saying Wenger is leaving at the end of the season. The Emirates can give him a wave goodbye at the last home match and they can make a presentation. Then we can go back to being a football club again and not Arsene Wenger's Arsenal. He is no longer fit for purpose and every day he stays damages us more.


If he was planning to leave they would have announced it by now. The club are waiting to see if he wins Europa and if he does he stays for another year minimum. There won’t be any movement till the season ends. He has pretty much nothing else going

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Post #493327  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:56 pm 
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Once he does go Wenger can only be really judged in terms of the damage he leaves and how long it takes the club to reach their previous highs. I'm even thinking how long it takes us to get back in the top 4 let alone challenge for the title. To finish above at least 2 of the teams above us in the table is unthinkable in the next few seasons even with a new manager such is the rebuilding job at hand.

As others have pointed out, a whole new defence is required. We still haven't got that proper strong defensive midfielder and we have a horrible lack of pace or width.

The squad is a shambles and needs a visionary and absolute wizardry in the transfer market to even tread water at the moment


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Post #493328  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 1:00 pm 
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Niall wrote:
Daz wrote:
From an emotional point of view, Wenger doesn't really matter to me any more. All the anger is gone - I just turn off when he appears on telly and I pay zero attention to anything he says. My only interest in the Europa outcome is whether he leaves if we don't win it - I suspect he might and that is why I don't want us to win it.


I wouldn't worry, we have absolutely no chance of beating Atletico Madrid over two legs.


I would put our chances higher than that - they must be favourites but we COULD do it if we convert chances and they don't first leg. I could then see us losing the final though.


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Post #493329  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 1:09 pm 
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Niall wrote:
Daz wrote:
From an emotional point of view, Wenger doesn't really matter to me any more. All the anger is gone - I just turn off when he appears on telly and I pay zero attention to anything he says. My only interest in the Europa outcome is whether he leaves if we don't win it - I suspect he might and that is why I don't want us to win it.


I wouldn't worry, we have absolutely no chance of beating Atletico Madrid over two legs.

Roma knocked Barca out of the CL last week. Liverpool beat City twice. It's no foregone conclusion.

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Post #493330  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 1:21 pm 
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dec wrote:
Niall wrote:

I wouldn't worry, we have absolutely no chance of beating Atletico Madrid over two legs.

Roma knocked Barca out of the CL last week. Liverpool beat City twice. It's no foregone conclusion.


We knocked out Milan. I agree it's not foregone at all. I would bet on Atletico but wouldn't feel it was a dead cert.


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Post #493331  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 1:23 pm 
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Bernard wrote:
Daz wrote:
Mustafi. Not good enough (putting it mildly). Chambers. Not good enough. Koscielny. Past it and injury prone. Bellerin. Probably leaving. Mertesacker. Past it and being a great guy not really enough. Monreal. Good but getting on. Čech. Past it and increasingly error prone.

If you had to rebuild an entire defence I think even Hoy might agree that Arsene Wenger would not really be your go-to manager.

Mertesacker is retiring and is, as you say, past it. But at the moment, however past it he is, I'd still rather have him in the team than Mustafi. I largely agree with what you say about the others. Chambers simply isn't good enough. Koscielny was once, but even when he is fit these days, he's no longer the player he was. He's nearly 33 and sadly needs replacing. Monreal is 32 now and past his best; even when at his best he still wasn't at the level of Sansom or Cole. Hearing rumours the club is looking to move Bellerin on so I think you could be right about him leaving. Čech isn't as bad as Ospina but is another in the 'past it' category.

You didn't mention Kolasinac or Holding. After bright starts to their Arsenal careers (Kolasinac this season and Holding last season), they've both gone seriously downhill. Hence there are solid arguments that we need a brand new defence. However, as you imply, Wenger is the last man you'd select to sort it out.


Positive that we will bring in new defenders and keeper, Mislintat has been very busy and he realises that massive changes at the back are needed if we are going to compete for silverware next season. A


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Post #493332  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:07 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
tomc wrote:
Win or lose against Athletico, the day after the second leg the club should release a statement saying Wenger is leaving at the end of the season. The Emirates can give him a wave goodbye at the last home match and they can make a presentation. Then we can go back to being a football club again and not Arsene Wenger's Arsenal. He is no longer fit for purpose and every day he stays damages us more.


If he was planning to leave they would have announced it by now. The club are waiting to see if he wins Europa and if he does he stays for another year minimum. There won’t be any movement till the season ends. He has pretty much nothing else going


Kev’s hunch is that he’ll just slip away out of the country at the end of the season if it’s anounced


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Post #493333  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:10 pm 
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I’m sorry it’s a foregone conclusion :laughing7:

Now if it’s not thats even worse

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Post #493334  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:16 pm 
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Pete on the beach wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:

If he was planning to leave they would have announced it by now. The club are waiting to see if he wins Europa and if he does he stays for another year minimum. There won’t be any movement till the season ends. He has pretty much nothing else going


Kev’s hunch is that he’ll just slip away out of the country at the end of the season if it’s anounced


I can see him returning to Alsace and seeing out his days pondering topics like who invented the question mark.

I really still don’t believe he’s going to go voluntarily and if we win the Europa I can’t imagine the season ahead next year as he definitely won’t go.

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Post #493335  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:42 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
I’m sorry it’s a foregone conclusion :laughing7:


Further evidence it is not a foregone conclusion.


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Post #493336  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:49 pm 
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Breaking news.

Jeremy Corbyn demands further evidence that our defence is *%^@ and says the best way to resolve whether Mustafi is an immobile ball-watching muppet is to ask him.


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Post #493337  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 3:55 pm 
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R. Lee Ermey, the actor known for his Golden Globe-nominated role as an intimidating drill sergeant in "Full Metal Jacket," died Sunday at the age of 74, according to his manager.

https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/16/entertai ... index.html

Image


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Post #493338  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 4:03 pm 
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Draytonkid wrote:
Bernard wrote:
Mertesacker is retiring and is, as you say, past it. But at the moment, however past it he is, I'd still rather have him in the team than Mustafi. I largely agree with what you say about the others. Chambers simply isn't good enough. Koscielny was once, but even when he is fit these days, he's no longer the player he was. He's nearly 33 and sadly needs replacing. Monreal is 32 now and past his best; even when at his best he still wasn't at the level of Sansom or Cole. Hearing rumours the club is looking to move Bellerin on so I think you could be right about him leaving. Čech isn't as bad as Ospina but is another in the 'past it' category.

You didn't mention Kolasinac or Holding. After bright starts to their Arsenal careers (Kolasinac this season and Holding last season), they've both gone seriously downhill. Hence there are solid arguments that we need a brand new defence. However, as you imply, Wenger is the last man you'd select to sort it out.

Positive that we will bring in new defenders and keeper, Mislintat has been very busy and he realises that massive changes at the back are needed if we are going to compete for silverware next season. A

Mmm, I'd wait to see whether it happens before saying "Positive that we will bring in new defenders and keeper." Just because we all think it should happen is no guarantee it will.

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Post #493339  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 4:28 pm 
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Bernard wrote:
Draytonkid wrote:
Positive that we will bring in new defenders and keeper, Mislintat has been very busy and he realises that massive changes at the back are needed if we are going to compete for silverware next season. A

Mmm, I'd wait to see whether it happens before saying "Positive that we will bring in new defenders and keeper." Just because we all think it should happen is no guarantee it will.


Agree. 3 new defenders and keeper it's gotta be 130m plus on the market at the moment. We won't do that! May get a couple in but some of our defenders who are failing this season are likely to be in the side still failing next.

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Post #493340  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 5:31 pm 
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It's not just Arsenal though, is it? The game is meaningless now, a spending wankathon dominated by the biggest teams in Europe. The top European leagues are even less competitive than the PL so all the same teams more or less compete at the business end of the champions league. It's boring, end of story.
Quick question . Without googling the answer. Liverpool played Roma in the 1984 European cup final. In the semi final Roma won the second leg 3-0 at home having lost the first 2-0 away. Who did they beat?


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Post #493341  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 6:08 pm 
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John wrote:
It's not just Arsenal though, is it? The game is meaningless now, a spending wankathon dominated by the biggest teams in Europe. The top European leagues are even less competitive than the PL so all the same teams more or less compete at the business end of the champions league. It's boring, end of story.
Quick question . Without googling the answer. Liverpool played Roma in the 1984 European cup final. In the semi final Roma won the second leg 3-0 at home having lost the first 2-0 away. Who did they beat?


All very true but your question has definitely got the pulse racing again, every fibre in me thrills to know the answer to this one...

They say that self-control is one of the critical markers of a developed personality so I shall refrain from googling it to allow the tension to boil a little longer.


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Post #493342  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 6:12 pm 
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Clue: it is linked to crocodiles and cake and also has a quality that might stop you falling.

I DIDN'T GOOGLE IT I DIDN'T


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Post #493343  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 6:54 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Bernard wrote:
Mmm, I'd wait to see whether it happens before saying "Positive that we will bring in new defenders and keeper." Just because we all think it should happen is no guarantee it will.


Agree. 3 new defenders and keeper it's gotta be 130m plus on the market at the moment. We won't do that! May get a couple in but some of our defenders who are failing this season are likely to be in the side still failing next.


Factor in probable sales of Ospina, Czech,Bellerin? Wilshire, Mustafi? makes it doable.


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Post #493344  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:08 pm 
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Daz wrote:
dec wrote:
Roma knocked Barca out of the CL last week. Liverpool beat City twice. It's no foregone conclusion.


We knocked out Milan. I agree it's not foregone at all. I would bet on Atletico but wouldn't feel it was a dead cert.

If we get the ref decisions Liverpool did v Man City we’d have a chance


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Post #493345  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:13 pm 
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Daz wrote:
Clue: it is linked to crocodiles and cake and also has a quality that might stop you falling.

I DIDN'T GOOGLE IT I DIDN'T

You *%^@** did.


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Post #493346  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:18 pm 
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John wrote:
It's not just Arsenal though, is it? The game is meaningless now, a spending wankathon dominated by the biggest teams in Europe. The top European leagues are even less competitive than the PL so all the same teams more or less compete at the business end of the champions league. It's boring, end of story

Except some teams can break in to it by buying well, selling well and having a manager who has a clear game plan and importantly improves players.

In Klopps time with Liverpool his total spend ins/outs is very slim. No way was coutinho worth £145m but look at what Klopp can do with that money.

Arsenal have consistently sold players for well under market value. The decision to not take £60m for Sanchez last summer was clearly terrible at the time and has proven so. We squeezed mkhitaryan out of Man U but really that deal meant Sanchez was only worth £30m. So we gave up £30m for 6 months of sulking


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Post #493347  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:20 pm 
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Course I did.

I knew it wasn’t Whogivesafuck United which was my first guess.


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Post #493348  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:20 pm 
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Draytonkid wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:

Agree. 3 new defenders and keeper it's gotta be 130m plus on the market at the moment. We won't do that! May get a couple in but some of our defenders who are failing this season are likely to be in the side still failing next.


Factor in probable sales of Ospina, Czech,Bellerin? Wilshire, Mustafi? makes it doable.


Not sure it does Čech and Wilshere would be unlikely to command transfer fees which mainly means we'd need to get around 40 million for Bellerin and Mustafis potential transfer fee could be written on a stamp at the moment !

Plus potentially if the players coming in are decent there would be an increase in wages. I just can't see us signing a whole new defence literally. Our best chance of success is Arsene shaping his existing personnel into a snarling regimented back 4, thou shalt not pass!!

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Post #493349  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:24 pm 
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Rich wrote:
John wrote:
It's not just Arsenal though, is it? The game is meaningless now, a spending wankathon dominated by the biggest teams in Europe. The top European leagues are even less competitive than the PL so all the same teams more or less compete at the business end of the champions league. It's boring, end of story

Except some teams can break in to it by buying well, selling well and having a manager who has a clear game plan and importantly improves players.

In Klopps time with Liverpool his total spend ins/outs is very slim. No way was coutinho worth £145m but look at what Klopp can do with that money.

Arsenal have consistently sold players for well under market value. The decision to not take £60m for Sanchez last summer was clearly terrible at the time and has proven so. We squeezed mkhitaryan out of Man U but really that deal meant Sanchez was only worth £30m. So we gave up £30m for 6 months of sulking

Yeah but if they do the mega rich clubs hoover up the players who were shining at these clubs. Who can see Salah at Liverpool past next season if he has another season anywhere close to this?


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Post #493350  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:25 pm 
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Daz wrote:
Course I did.

I knew it wasn’t Whogivesafuck United which was my first guess.

But you get the point anyway.


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Post #493351  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:33 pm 
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Daz wrote:
TOP GUN wrote:
I’m sorry it’s a foregone conclusion :laughing7:


Further evidence it is not a foregone conclusion.


It is. They are going to podger us up the ringpiece with no lube.

Thankfully

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Post #493352  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:46 pm 
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John wrote:
Daz wrote:
Course I did.

I knew it wasn’t Whogivesafuck United which was my first guess.

But you get the point anyway.


No but I am very tired is it something to do with away goals?


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Post #493353  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:55 pm 
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Daz wrote:
Clue: it is linked to crocodiles and cake and also has a quality that might stop you falling.

I DIDN'T GOOGLE IT I DIDN'T

Still don't know who it is. Though I am *%^@ at crosswords.


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Post #493354  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 7:58 pm 
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TOP GUN wrote:
Draytonkid wrote:

Factor in probable sales of Ospina, Czech,Bellerin? Wilshire, Mustafi? makes it doable.


Not sure it does Čech and Wilshere would be unlikely to command transfer fees which mainly means we'd need to get around 40 million for Bellerin and Mustafis potential transfer fee could be written on a stamp at the moment !

Plus potentially if the players coming in are decent there would be an increase in wages. I just can't see us signing a whole new defence literally. Our best chance of success is Arsene shaping his existing personnel into a snarling regimented back 4, thou shalt not pass!!

I reckon we should bring the old boys back. Spunky, Dicko, Tone, Bouldy and Nutty. Like that episode of Ripping Yarns.


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Post #493355  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:11 pm 
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John wrote:
Daz wrote:
Course I did.

I knew it wasn’t Whogivesafuck United which was my first guess.

But you get the point anyway.


Is it how are the mighty fallen where are they now couldn’t happen these days?


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Post #493356  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:20 pm 
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bromley gooner wrote:
Daz wrote:
Clue: it is linked to crocodiles and cake and also has a quality that might stop you falling.

I DIDN'T GOOGLE IT I DIDN'T

Still don't know who it is. Though I am *%^@ at crosswords.

Another clue then. Claudio Caniggia never played for them.


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Post #493357  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:21 pm 
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Daz wrote:
John wrote:
But you get the point anyway.


Is it how are the mighty fallen where are they now couldn’t happen these days?

Exactly


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Post #493358  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:58 pm 
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They're not biting, John.

In fact they're as enthusiastic about your question as a kid contemplating the tangerine in a Christmas stocking.


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Post #493359  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 9:07 pm 
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Daz wrote:
My wife said my love of Arsenal and being able to speak Spanish were the two things she first liked about me after the Greek god appearance obviously.


and a wise choice ... that's you third from the left in the fourth picture wearing the winged helmet .



https://www.google.co.nz/search?q=image ... A&biw=1338


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Post #493360  Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 9:18 pm 
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John wrote:
Quick question . Without googling the answer. Liverpool played Roma in the 1984 European cup final. In the semi final Roma won the second leg 3-0 at home having lost the first 2-0 away. Who did they beat?

Shamrock Rovers ....?


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